Big COL

Paul you can run the heating on the aldi but not with the stove lit? if you are using the stove and the pump is part of the aldi bypass the pump must run the in the correct direction or you will be pumping against the stoves boiler flow

Paul You will not be able to run both stove and boiler together as you will have opposing flows, the boiler will be able to work on its own with the stove not lit, if you want to use the stove I suggest you fit a by pass pipe infront of the boiler. this was covered in a post in the last month. If you are only using the stove for space heating then by pass the stove ie link flow and return, drain the stove and leave the stoves boiler connections open

Paul Not enough info 1 Is the pump on the flow/return? 2 Are you running stove and boiler

Do you not think that we are all a little guilty here? The thread was started with a simple question and was dealt with quite quickly, it was then expanded upon by us guys who have enjoyed the banter that then ensued. I wonder if this may be detrimental to the forum in as much that the level that some of the threads are taken to, is off putting to readers who are reading the forum looking for basic information and so may deter them from posting a basic question. The contributers to this forum have a wealth of information collectively and I assume get a great deal of enjoyment from their involvement, but as John quite rightly stated we tend to digress and take it to another level. Perhaps there is a call for a techy section where threads can be moved to when this occurs. I am not being condescending here but from experience when subject matter starts to go over my head I tend to shut off, there will be a lot of readers that do not understand the technical replies and will probably do the same .You could argue that there is the information within the replies to help these sort of readers. It is there, but when a group are debating a subject and have differing opinions it's difficult to discern the correct pieces of information, its not like following a set of instructions or learning it from a book. These are just my observations and thoughts I am well aware of principal of forums but it just seems to me that KISS should apply to the general sections and have a techy section for the hot debates. It will be interesting to see if anyone has similar thoughts

Paul I know exactly what you are mean here. My marina supplied me with an inline meter with a plug wired on at both ends, the chap got most upset when I informed him where he could plug it in. He was most insistant that this was how they came wired, and only after a demonstration of pluging it in with a test lamp on the other end did the penny drop. It turned out that the meter had been used before,and was handed back when the boat left, the owner of the boat had changed the socket for a plug so it matched the configuration on his boat. Enough said.

Does this make it environmentally friendly?

Dor It would be worth trying electro plating then.

John Found your improvements very interesting, as this is a subject that I have very little knowledge of, the extent of my knowledge ends after the boat is trimmed. Any thoughts on what I term as boil over, when making a turn with quite a few revs on a quantity of water passes over the top of the rudder, this seems to me to be a waste of energy. I have seen rudders on boats that have a piece of metal welded to the top of the rudder to form a T shape, this looks as it would stop this boil over, in discussion with a number of hull builders none of them seemed to think that the boil over was a problem, and therefore no need to add a plate on top of the rudder. I also have a small problem with my current boat in that when requiring to stop quickly, once in reverse and the revs go on the stern lifts, air can be heard rushing in under the counter, and on she sails with very little breaking effect. It's not over propped, in fact its slightly smaller than recommended, the trim is correct about 2'' of water over the counter. Would appreciate some views on this.

At long last have we put this thread to bed? NOW! about rubber hulls.

Richard In a single cell the construction is of two separate plates sitting in electrolyte, the positive plate is the anode and the negative plate is the cathode, the resulting chemical reaction produces a voltage of 2 volts approx across the plates. The anode plate is the one that suffers the deterioration. Substitute this into the theory that the same reaction is happening with the boats. IE your boat is the positive plate (anode) another boat is the negative plate (cathode) canal water is the electrolyte, a single cell exists, and your boat corrodes. This is as I understand the theory that is being put forward, I like John am not convinced that this is so. Rubber hulled narrowboats is the answer.

Chris Reverse the polarity.

Surely if the anode and cathode are shorted together as I was trying to say in the previous post, then no reaction can occur. A cell works from the reaction between an anode and cathode separated from each other sitting in the electrolyte. This is why batteries cease to work, the separator between the plates after a period of time breaks down. The plates (anode and cathode) short together and the cell stops working. This is what I was trying to describe in the previous post (not very well) but if one boat is the anode and the other the cathode and they are hard wire bonded how can any reaction take place, to add to this debate in a cell it's only the anode that suffers the corrosion, which follows in the case of the two boats only one would suffer.

Maffi I agree, but it will still be there for the future.

Maffi Wheels turn a full circle. We have closed most of our coal mines, steel works, etc, as long as we don't lose the skills, when the wheel comes around again, and it will, we are still sitting on huge resources of coal and ore, others may have depleted theirs, supplying us with cheap products.

Dor Sorry cannot agree, the argument is that the boats are acting like the plates in a battery. Two separate boats, sitting in an electrolyte, each connected to earth, the land mass between the earths becomes the load and a reaction will occur. Well that's the theory. If you were to link all the plates together inside a battery it wouldn't operate as a battery and you could then quite happily short out the terminals.

Maffi, Chris, Dor, Gary Hi guys Interesting debate going on here, if you were to hardwire bond the boats together they would then be of equal potential and being of equal potential the problem does not exist.(Gary does not agree with this, but any current flow will take the easiest path ie through the bonding cables) as water, although a conductor, is not one of the better ones. I know, totally impracticable, but just to keep the debate going. Assuming the theory on this subject is correct, but to my way of thinking the jury is still out. Surely the only certain or near as certain as one can be, without any data confirmed by controlled tests, as opposed to scare mongering by manufacturers, who have a commercial interest in doing so, is to fit an isolation transformer in the supply from the land line, this effectively leaves your boat an isolated island without any hardwire connections to any land based supply. This is the method that I have used on my boat, as I do believe there is some credence in some of this but cannot commit to it totally because of the lack of evidence. Hence my decision to use an isolation transformer, as I can understand the physics of it. As to sacrificial anodes I believe that this was another commercial scam. What area is covered by the anode? On a 70' boat with an anode at bow and stern one assumes they are providing a radial protection in excess of 35' - highly unlikely, fit them end on end down the length of the hull and you may then get some protection.

Dan Adjust the belt, this link belt as you describe it is Brammer belting widely used in industry in applications where normal V belts cannot be used. the belt is adjustable by removing or adding links. If the belt is too loose slip it off the pulleys, split the belt as it's designed to be split, remove one link, rejoin the belt and then stretch it back over the pulleys. These belts wear over the cross section just the same as normal V belts, it would be advisable if your belt has been slipping to replace it with a length of new belting. The modern Brammer belting is easier to split than the old style.

Richard Yes you do. Please let us know the end result.

Rick Is the ring going past the cal being used? ie to warm the engine room. Normal practice is that the last rad or cal in this case,makes the link from the flow and return. You could fit a valve on the flow after the connection to the cal and when this valve is closed the cal will make the link. What John is suggesting is for you to balance the system. Try this first but use the balance valve if you have them fitted this is on the other end of the rad from the on/off valve, doing it this way enables you to close a rad down should you need to without interfering with the balance of the system. You could also have an air lock in the cals coil try cracking the joint on the flow just befor the cal and bleed off some water into a dish.

Have a look at what Reading college have to say on galvanic isolators,also have a look at isolation transformers. www.reading-college.ac.uk/marine/cover.html John are you moonlighting at the college?

Richard Are the rads getting hot? Is the first rad hotter than the second? How hot is the flow leaving the second rad and going to the cal? how hot is the return after the cal? also is the pump going the right way (as some pumps have a brown and black wire and the polarity is not as you would expect)? Finally what is the temperature differential between the flow and return at the boiler.

Ok guys whats the correct terminology when applied to pumps? cavitation or ventilation

Ian The soot is actually a problem, it's indicating that your stove is not burning efficiently.This is the same as a car on choke where the petrol mixture is richer than normal and you get black smoke. Oil stoves need regular maintainance - the burner pot should be decoked about every 6 weeks. The principal that these stoves work on is they physicaly do not burn liquid diesel, as you start the stove off with a piece of firelighter your fuel setting should be at the minimum, as the burner pot warms up it will eventually get to a temperature where the fuel entering vaporises and ignites. This vapour is actually burning 1/2" above the base of the pot, at this point you can slowly increase the flow of fuel.The flame should burn with a blue tint, if it is burning with a yellow flame with wisps of black smoke then you have too much fuel coming in for the air available through the stove. The problem with oil stoves on boats is because of the short length of flue they have a very low draw this means the speed that the hot fumes escape at controls what air can be drawn in through the stove to replace it and therefor determines the ammount of fuel that your stove can use for the correct combustion. To maintain the efficiency of your stove you need to keep the flue as clean as you can and decoke the burner pot regularly, also when the stove is running you need to keep the flue gasses as hot as you can - a doubled walled chiminey will help this - plus you need to check that you are not getting any downdraft, this is when the wind blows back down the chiminey. When the stove has been running for some time check the gasses leaving the chimney - all you should see is a heat haze. If there is any black smoke then your fuel setting is too high. Generally the controls on these stoves will allow you to over supply fuel You need to play with the controls by gradually increasing the setting until you start to get wisps of black smoke out of the chimney, then close the control gradually until the smoke disappears,(allow 2 min between each adjustment as it will take this amount of time for the stove to react). This will indicate the limit that you can go to so as not to overfuel the stove, if at any time you do go too far you may find that the stove sounds like a chip pan boiling. This is exactly what is happening, there is too much fuel present and instead of vapourising and burning it's boiling on the floor of the burner pot, close the valve back to minimum and allow the stove to burn off the excess fuel then slowly increase the flow First generation stoves tend to be more troublesome as they were domestic stoves valved down and fitted on boats, second generation stoves, sometimes called blueflame, are much better as they are designed for the low draw that you get on boat chimineys. I hope this imformation is of some help if nothing else you know how a stove works.