Kismet
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Posts posted by Kismet
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On 27/11/2020 at 19:14, DHutch said:
Hopefully the OP is not still sitting in the dark!
electric back! all 12v stuff also working.. now just to work out how much life my batteries still have in them... thanks to everyone for comments and help
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9 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
Edit - not a true 'engineers' definition, but hopefully an understandable comparison for a non-engineer.
Edited 5 minutes ago by Alan de Enfield
Really helpful Thankyou! Through this whole battery saga I really want to know about more about my boat electrics so hopefully in the future I am a bit more capable in sorting minor problems myself.. can anyone recommend any books / YouTube vids or anything else to get me a bit more clued up?
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Confirmed switchy action is happening but still no luck. As well as trying to insert a little ball of foil as Tony suggested in previous comment
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13 minutes ago, David Mack said:
You have two batteries with a common negative and separate positive wires, so it looks like one engine start battery and one to run the domestic 12V stuff. This is not a lot of battery capacity to run without either frequent engine running or a permanent mains connection to recharge.
My guess is that the 1-2-both switch has been set to both, so that the mains battery charger keeps both batteries topped up. But the problem is that with the mains having failed, both batteries have supplied the domestic electrics until they ran flat. Which is why you can't start the engine.
Ideally you need to get the mains sorted so you can recharge both batteries. The only alternative would be to borrow a fully charged battery from a fellow boater, put that in place of your start battery, and then with the switch set to whichever of the 1 or 2 positions connects only the start battery you should be able to start the engine. You can then switch to Both, which will recharge both the borrowed start battery and your domestic battery. You will need a few hours running to get a reasonable amount of charge into the domestic battery. If that works you could then stop the engine, remove the borrowed battery, put your charged battery in its place and put your old start battery in the domestic place. Then repeat the process to charge your second battery. You will now have swapped your two batteries, but I don't think that matters as they look to be identical.
When the engine is not running turn the switch to connect only the (new) domestic battery so that you don't run down the start battery.
Recharge with the switch set to Both. You will probably need to repeat this daily, so the sooner you can get the mains sorted, the better!
Okay thanks for this! Yes you are right it was set to both and I always have set it to that, not sure if that is the right thing to do? Yes hopefully the mains will be sorted soon... So if I start re charging them is there a smart way to test if they are actually recharging? As opposed to dead and not taking any charge
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8 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:
If those are the only batteries you don't have much capacity so living aboard you would discharge the domestic one (or both if that switch is set to both) quickly if you lost charge. Any number on the battery labels like 85, 90,100, 110, 115, 120 followed by Ah?
Yes 110
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17 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
Unless the box has been installed upside down (not unknown)
I notice that it appears to have PVC cable running alongside / thru the Polystyrene insulation, which is not ideal.
Is all of the other 230v (mains) stuff working ?
Is the light on (or any humming) coming from the battery charger ?
I don't suppose you have a voltmeter or multimeter on board ?
Still waiting for my electric to be topped up as the marina office hours during covid / lockdown are reduced! But when I get back onto the mains I’ll let you know. But pre to my electricity credit running out everything was working, even though I’m betting the 12v batteries had been not working for a while without me realising..
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3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
The black box with a picture of a sailboat and saying 'Hypertronic' is your battery charger - is the battery charger 'on'?
The grey box with the clear 'front' is your main 'fuse box' - are the switches in the 'on' position ? (sometimes when your electric goes off and comes back on it can trip the switches)
Yes pretty sure both are on (and have tried flicking them the other way just incase I’m being stupid and no changes)
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20 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:
Some points but not too helpful
The master switch with the red key. As @Jen-in-Wellies said these are very unreliable so do as he suggests and turn it on and off a few times, I woudl suggest that you take the red key out and screw up a little ball tinfoil or paper and put it down the hole under the key. If the 12V comes back on with no charger running you need a new master switch but get a quality one like BlueSea etc.
With both a master switch and a 1, 2, both, off switch its hard to guess how the boat is wired. the four position switch might be a bank selection cum master switch or it might be wired for charge selection. The reason this is important as that you seem to have only one other master switch. That would be workable for tow banks if it was in the negative but it looks as if there is a thick red wire running to the switch. This suggests its in the positive for one bank. probably the domestic bank - the discharged bank (I hope).
The white box is the mains consumer unit so that will have no influence upon the 12V side of things apart from it supplying the charger.
The line of ceramic/plastic "torpedo" euro fuses are the protection for your 12V circuits. this type of fuse is a pain in the situpon especially in damp environments. Make sure each fuse is tight in the holder and ensure the two fuse metal is clean where it fits into the clips. In an ideal world you I woudl advise changing this for one with car type clade fuses once you solve the battery issue.
I think the four position switch might be set to both and is a battery bank selection switch. When set like this the engine start and domestic batteries act as one big bank so if you do have a faulty battery it would discharge the whole lot or if you used the 12V for a long time with no charger the same would apply. I can't be certain about this because I cant see anything to indicate position on the switch knob.
It is important now to get the charger working and leave the four position switch to both so hopeful the charger will charge both banks but it will take hours and hours even if there are no faulty batteries.
Once you get it charging after an hour or so inspect the batteries. If any cell is bubbling a lot more than the others or if an cell is hot then that battery is faulty. if the ends of the battery case are bulging out it also indicates a the battery is close to the end of its like.
Thankyou so much for this! I will try what you have suggested and re read a couple of times to get my head round it! Have attached other photos of the batteries also if it helps
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8 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
IS working, or ISN'T working either ?
Now you have found the 'red key switch' is it in the 'on position' ?
Now you have found the "1,2, both, off" switch is that in the 'both' position ? (then try it in the '1' position, if that works leave it there)
If so is everything working now ?
Sorry isn’t working. And just tried this still no luck..!
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Also now feeling very stupid for not knowing what my battery isolation was as there is a large plaque telling me.... ?♀️
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Also tried starting the engine and looks like the starter motor isn’t working either
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1 minute ago, Tony Brooks said:
Thanks. Normally I would offer to drive over and take a look subject to parking but regrettably because of my age and lockdown I can't make that offer and by the time I can it will be months too late to solve your problem. Sorry.
No Problem, thanks for offering anyway and totally understandable lock down is making things trickier to sort! If my batteries are dead , and I top up my electricity - until I get round to replacing the batteries, is there any problems with running off just the mains? I assume the mains still travels through these batteries (correct me if I'm wrong) but doing this will it cause any future problems with the electrics on my boat?
14 minutes ago, bizzard said:Does your engine start? If so start it and see if the 12v comes alive, lights work ect.
good idea- will try this when I am back thank you for the suggestion.
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1 minute ago, Tony Brooks said:
1. What was set like what? What have you now changed? We don't know enough about your system or how it is set up.
2. Yes, an inverter just converts battery power (12VBC) to mains power (240V AC). An inverter charger or combi-unit combines both an inverter and charger into one case.
sorry the 'changed that' was related to the location you had mentioned for some reasons was 'freelance'
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4 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:
Re @DHutch's post
For clarity combines inverter chargers can discharge batteries by trying to use batery poower to charge them if not correctlys et up.
Many members here are willing to help other boaters so as I don't know where Freelance is in the UK a better known GENERAL - not specific - location may get a volunteer or recommendations for a a proffesional.
whoops I didn't realise it was set to that- have now changed!
I don't have an inverter as when not plugged in the 240V plugs don't work - which never was a problem for me as I stay put in the marina and only go out for the occasional weekend.
The 'inverter charger' is this different to an inverter?
Think I was more aware of my battery setup when first buying the boat and had forgotten it all as I haven't been cruising and hadn't thought about it! So will try and learn a bit more about the setup...
They are open cells, and I have two batteries. will have a closer inspection of them when back, at work right now and can also take some pictures.
12v things were working when the mains was on. Last time I was off the mains electricity was August and the 12v lights definitely worked then. The lights went out and at the time the only electric I was using were the 12v lights so hard to tell if the 240 went out at the same time as the 12v. However I was using 240 plugs earlier in the evening, so if the 12v stayed on it would have been probably minutes rather than hours.
As for the battery isolator being off, is this something I would have to physically turn off or can it turn it self off?
thanks all for the help, making me realise I need to take more care of my battery set up!
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Hello!
I am a complete novice, so sorry if I'm asking the wrong thing / this question has been asked before..
I am in a marina and constantly connected to the marina's shoreline electric. Yesterday the mains went out (forgot to top up!) Obviously all my 230v plugs stopped working but so did the essentials , lights, water pump etc. When I have left the marina these essentials worked when not plugged in as they run off my leisure batteries so I assumed they should work when I ran out of electric also. Does this suggest that the batteries are dead? have I been doing something wrong am I meant to not have the batteries connected at all times?
Thanks in advance
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Oh that’s good to know thank you!
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Hello,
I have tried to install my own shower and after a year of trying I have now accepted defeat.. so now looking for a plumber to help me. Just wondering could I get any plumber to do this or are there plumbers who specifically work on canal boats? If so would anyone be able to recommend someone? I am in Uxbridge in a marina!
thanks in advance
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Hello!
i tried fitting my own bilge pump a year ago and it’s never seemed to work very well / maybe atall!? So am now giving up with the DIY approach and would like a professional to install one. Currently in packet boat Marina, Uxbridge- any recommendations of people who can do this for me? Or websites where I find people?
Thanks!
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Thanks everyone! I will leave it where it is and sort next time it’s blacked ?
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Currently in process of painting my boat and de rusting everything, have just got to the engine bay, have been using a wire wool brush / flap disks for the rest of the boat to get rid of the worst bits of rust but this means there is some potential for sparks.
I assume any sparks near the batteries is a bad idea so was planning on taking out the batteries.
first does this whole process seem sensible? Secondly if we were to take out batteries, is it the same process as car batteries - taking off negative first?
thanks.
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Currently sanding down my boat to paint, there’s this metal plaque on the side of the boat, ‘Electrolux refrigerator’ two of the screws are rusted and heads have fallen off so would need to drill out to see what’s behind it.
Before doing this does anyone know what it is? Just a plaque or something more important. On the inside of the boat it is where the oven is placed... -
Thanks for the reply Jen,
I have a solid fuel stove but not using it at the moment during summer.
checked my hob and oven, both burning blue.
Will check the batteries now though, and give it a Hoover! Thanks for advice -
Hello,
wondering if anyone could help,
I am currently moored in a covered wet dock repainting my boat. currently at the sanding stage so there is ALOT of paint dust in the air. My carbon monoxide alarm went off, and I am confused why. I was cooking about two hours earlier with the oven, with all doors and windows closed but other than that no gas is being used, the engine isn’t on. I then opened the doors and windows and the alarm went back to 0. I’m really confused as to why there would be carbon monoxide, if I am not burning anything- could it be something to do with the paint particles in the air? Or something more serious, gas leak etc?
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5 minutes ago, dmr said:
The roof has a hard time and usually fails well before the sides. A wire (cup) brush in an angle grinder is my derusting tool of choice. If you can get back to bare clean steel then no need for a rust treatment, rust treatments are a compromise fix to be used only when you can't clear the rust, certainly NOT to be used on clean steel as a precaution. If there are one or two pits a grinding stone in a Dremel can dig them out, otherwise it will be local use of a rust treatment.
If there are just a few patches of rust then Bondaprimer is my chosen primer, but if its extensive then get a tin of boaty primer. Craftmaster do good paints though I have not used their primer. Get undercoats on as soon as you can, don't leave the primer exposed for weeks on end. Some primers from the DIY shops really are useless. I tried the Hammerite stuff years ago and was not impressed.
I have used Bondaprimer all my life (VW campers before the boat) and it works, it also dries super quick so you can get two coats on, and an undercoat, in the same day.
If it fits in with your desired image then a Raddle red style roof is easier to maintain than a gloss one. Raddle red (or grey) looks good on many boats, not just old trads. A roof will likely need some repairs every two or three years.
.............Dave
Thanks Dave , really helpful advice!
dead batteries
in New to Boating?
Posted
great I will try this. Thank you Tony !