Danny1234

Hello Thanks for the comments. Good to hear some people have had positive experiences getting things done in Holland. For the record, it's a 'UK' wide beam. Normally I've got the dimensions worked out so that it should be usable on nearly all the Southern Widebeam network ........ Uhhh, ... Yes, should have realised, the Cat D is not actually a UK certificate but an EU one. So that should help on that side of things. I have the link for the Dutch Barge Association and have had a look now and again. Haven't contacted them yet though as it's not a Dutch Barge I'm actually after (though if this saga carries on, that might just be an option) Am tempted by the kit option, but that adds further issues finding a yard, good builder (again). As I'm sticking with the canal boat rather than barge, I've resigned myself to the fact that I would have to bite the bullet and pay for the transport. Thanks of the link (nieko). Have emailed them to start things off. I see they have a UK contact/agent as well. Have got a couple of links to follow up as well. I did try Euroships, but they turned out to be quite bit more expensive than I was hoping. Though possibly they we're put off when it was clear that I actually wanted something specific building (from detailed plans) and wasn't going to buy one their 'standard' products. Which is certainly the response I got from the British builders, who were keen to claim 'we can do anything' ..... As long as it's the same stuff we've been doing for the last 20 years! But when it came to signing a contract, pissed me about and then declined to proceed. Sad, but I will just have to take my business/project abroad due the slapdash/naff attitude of the UK based companies. Anyway, I will let you know how it goes. Cheers Danny

Hello I've been 'grinding my way through' a variety of British canal boat builders, for my would be 60 x 12 or so canal boat, ..... And have been pretty dissatisfied with their responses. So am now seriously considering getting a boat built in Holland (by an actual boat builder! As they seem to be in short supply in the UK). Forgiven my grumbling a but their responses have been pretty naff. If there's any particular points/things to be aware of in relation to such, ... Comments much appreciated. How much would one be looking at to get something like that brought from Holland? 3 grand maybe. I'm guessing that even if it's built to a certain Dutch standard, I might well have to get a UK accredited surveyor to certify it as a class D craft. Must admit I'm a bit wary getting something like that done outside the UK. Mainly for legal and contractual reasons, more so than the travel and transport costs. I'd guess it would be worth employing some surveyor/solicitor in Holland to oversee things (and maybe get an English version of any would be contract). Cheers Danny

Hello Extra consideration .... I'm sure I've read (more than once) that having more than 200+ amps on the same alternator drive belt will wear out/ stretch the belt fairly quickly (or a lot quicker than it would normally take). 350 amps might be a bit much for the 1 belt. For that arrangement you may well really need 1 drive belt for each alternator. As other have mentioned, it may be preferable to spend the money upgrading other aspects of your system: more 'intelligent' charger, maybe a PV panel or 2. Regards Danny

Hello At some point (when this boat finally gets built), I will hopefully be taking it along the Thames. For which you normally need a VHF radio. Are the handheld ones (about £100????) OK for this? My initial preference would be for a handheld rather than a bulky box that would be permanently installed somewhere (on the stern), so that it can be put away when not needed, rather than getting damaged, or stolen (if visible on the stern). Any potential issues with the handhelds ....... Dropping it in the water springs to mind (maybe have a spare handy then?). Regards Danny

Hello Have been shopping around for timber boards of various kinds a fair bit these last few months. As mentioned, the quality of WBP varies enormously. Word of caution with regards to Moisture Resistant (MR) MDF, ...... MDF can be quite nasty stuff to work with, recognised as a carcinogenic by the more forward thinking associations/bodies, .... Proper masks and dust extractors really are a must. Other thing, it's bleeding' heavy. About 40kg a sheet, approx double the weight of standard ply type sheets. Have you tried lifting 2 sheets of ply at once?. Maybe you're a 6'4" bodybuilder type and that really isn't a problem. It's pretty hard to lift around with a comfortable level of control and not bang the edges/corners. If in doubt, depending on how much time you have available, you can seal/paint the edges of the boards. Through as I'm sure you're aware, dealing with the condensation and moisture before it gets to the stage where it may start damaging boards is probably the most important issue to consider/deal with. Regards Danny

Hello Can anyone point me to where in the RCD Regs it states this. I have here the 2010 Edition and can't see anything in the section about fuel systems. Browsing the web, there doesn't seem to be a newer version, or some kind of updade or amendment. ..... a shot while later, ... apologies, so the new requirements are actually stated in ISO 21487, which the RCD Regs refer to. Seems the ISO documents are generally not available as a free download. You typically have to buy them (which I guess is not so bad if you're a professional boat builder/company, ... ect. ..... but somewhat 'false economy' as far as generally improving technical standards, ...... no further comments on that at this point in time though) Regards Danny

Hello When ...... I get my nice big new wide beam, I'm hoping to spend some time along the Thames (past West London mainly), so figure I will need anchors. I'm finessing the that I will also need a winch as there might be occasions when pulling up the anchor by hand is just not going to be feasible. Can anyone tell me how big/powerful a which I would need in such a situation? I'll try and go for something that works off a crank handle, but with the back up of an electric motor. Cheers Danny

Hello ..... Hmmm, .... Must admit I thought at first it might be a bit OTT, but upon after consideration, perhaps not. Yes, one shouldn't get too concerned about it but a number of comments do confirm that there are some issues. Haven't got all the details yet, but certainly will have to look in to 'slip-joint' type connections at various key locations. I'll probably fix the boards for the roof rack using oversize holes on the boards, then a rubber and metal washer, or something along those lines. 'Forget about movement from thermal sources, think more movement from vibration and if your refitting on dry land the boat will sit differently in the water so may will move' ....... Will look at bedding various things on a strip of rubber/neoprene and see what type of anti vibration mountings are available (like the main engine sits on) 'Movement of the timber through changes in moisture levels will cause you much more trouble than any thermal expansion/contraction of the steel' Still looking in to getting some windows made so yes, ..... Will have to consider that. Am considering this http://www.accoya.com/ Don't know about prices yet so that might rule it out 'not along the length but along the width of my boat by 8mm' I would say that is quite noticeable and significant, ...... Slightly worrying, ... But I will look to 'accommodate' this when fitting/setting out the main partitions ' In a fight between steel plate, wood and screws, the steel always wins! ' Indeed, that was my main concern. Was wondering (in my original posting) how pronounced this effect can be. Would seem then the answer is that it is a factor that needs to be addressed/dealt with. Some more figuring out to do then. The shell won't be ready till about June/July so I've got some time to look in to various options. Thanks again Cheers Danny

Hello I was thinking in relation to movement and windows. But also maybe some timber panels on the roof and if it would be a good idea to oversize the/bolt holes to relieve any stress put on the boards or windows by any movement in the structure. Not looked at the calculator yet but will shortly Cheers Danny

Hello I'm getting a 60' wide beam shell built. Out of interest, does anyone know by how much the shell wll expand (length mainly) between summer and winter? I'm assuming that's the main consideration rather than between day and night ( though maybe that is also a factor to consider). Any figures on this? Regards Danny

Hello After a bit more looking around it seems there are indeed such things. Why, ..... Just so happens I co-own a small plot of woodland (about 5 acres) so am interested in using my own fuel so to speak (gives me an excuse to go up to my wood land). Plus, I'm hoping to go gas free, which usually means electric, which usually means a fairly beefy genny, and good quality ones can be a good few grand! Also, one could do some other 'cooking' on it in winter, maybe just the kettle or heating a bowl of soup. But anything that cuts down on the electricity use is generally desirable. My main concerns are how controllable it is (actually used as an oven) and how much heat it kicks out in the summer. Most of them still seem to potentially kick out 3-4 kW of heat to the room. Then the rest can be diverted to the hot water or oven. I'm considering building an 'enclosure' that could be used in the summer, the removed during the winter. Obviously out of metal/bricks/stone/tiles. It would be pretty neat to get the hot water, central heating and some cooking all out of the one unit. Which of course can be done, but it seems so far that these would over heat the cabin area in the summer. Cheers Danny

Hello, thanks for your comments I must admit on the scale of a house boat, the extra heat retention probably wouldn't be that much. I will probably 'settle' for double glazing. I've got a workshop and could get some triple glazed panes made. But I don't really have the time to indulge in that at present. Though it will be a fairly big boat (about 44 m2) with 11 windows, so maybe it would make more of a diffence. If I get the time I'll try and do the calls and see how much different it could make. My main 'interest' in it wasn't just about heating costs, .... The notice issue would be a bonus (partly to protect other people from my noise!), but also how much less wood you might have to burn. Maybe you would only have to have the log burner on 5 months of the year rather than 6 or 7. So less wood to collect/transport/store. I'll keep looking in to it but as mentioned, will probably just go for the double glazing (time issues mainly). Cheers anyway Danny

Hello Have been checking out the different options for windows. There are some double glazed units, but as far as I can see, no triple glazing available. Can anyone point put any potential drawbacks to using this (other than cost)? Cheers Danny

Hello there I'm hoping to go gas free for cooking so for now am looking at electric (and a generator). Been considering a wood fired oven (preferably logs), nearly all of them are pretty large Aga style ranges. There are a handful of 'standard' cooker size units available, but so far I have not come across one that is only an oven (no rings). Does anyone know of such a thing? Realistically I don't see us using the oven more than a couple of times a week, so wouldn't mind having to clear out the ash now and again. Regards Danny

Hello to all I see, .... Thanks for the pics. I'll get the shell builder to fit the tube and provide the necessary holes/fixings. I may still get the builder to install it if they aren't trying to charge what is in my view an excessive amount of money. I've had one builder quoting me 3 grand to supply and fit the bow thruster. From my previous discussions with them, fitting the bow thruster tubes was included in the cost of the shell. As the bow thruster kit (Vetus 75 kg, .... Which did sound a bit 'small' for the size of the boat) is about £1700 retail, that makes it around £1300 they want for fitting it. Hhmmmmm. If that's the case I'll stick with just having the tubes fitted as part of the shell. Then see about fitting the bow thruster some good while later. Haven't fully spec'd the electrics yet, but am aware of the issues. Comments in relation to such have been appreciated (added to my notes!) Cheers Danny

Hello there I'm looking at getting a wide beam shell buildt (with engine fitted). The shell will, have a Bow Thruster tube fitted. I may not get the BT fitted at the time as it will be a good 6 months doing the fit out, so might save buying the BT till shortly before it's going in to the water. Quick question, is fitting BT in reasonably straight forward? From what I can see it's essentially just an electric motor with a simple ON/OFF witch and a Left/Right control panel. It needs it's own batteries and obviously some wiring and the control panel fitting. But this should be something an experienced electrician shouldn't really have to much problem with. Would that be a reasonable assumption? Cheers Danny

Yes, ..... that is a concern. Haven't fully decided to do this yet, .... locating a safe place would be a min requirement Thanks for the confirmation Regards Danny

Hello Am in the final stages of refining my design for my would be widebeam boat, ..... Minor question, ... I'm considering having the starter battery for the main engine somewhere else than in the actual engine compartment (haven't decided where yet and I do realise this may need some ventilation, ...) .. 2 reasons ... I might be able to locate it somewhere reasonably warm (not to warm), .... but mainly to stop the battery getting very cold in winter, thus reducing the charge and making it harder to re-charge Also, could be of some benefit with regards to security, one could easily just disconnect the starter motor battery without having to lift up the engine bay covers, .... if the battery was actually somewhere in the main cabin, then someone would actually have to break into the main cabin (which should be a lot more secure than the engine compartment), ... then actually know where the battery was. Question then, what is the longest distance one would reasonably be able to have the starter battery from the engine? I'm thinking 4-5 metres should be sufficient. My understanding is that in theory one could overcome any voltage drop issues by just having a much thicker cable. Is there some potential issue I'm missing here? Regards Danny

Hello there I'm in the final stages of designing/specifying a wide-beam canal boat for myself (have finally got the short list down to 2, maybe 3 builders and will be getting some final quotes in the next week to 10 days). Anyway, normally there will be at least 1 rubbing strake (or guard iron as apparently they are called on steel boats), which will be at approx the same level as the waterline (about 650 mm from the base plate from my initial calculations). Though I'm anticipating there being at least a 2nd one running the full length. How that works with the swims is another issue which I'll try and deal with another time/in a separate thread. So, ...... Ideally at what height should the 2nd rubbing strake/guard iron be? Should this be above the waterline, say around 800 mm? Or would it be better below? My initial feeling is that this would be better above the waterline (rubbish floating in the water, ease of repair and touching up, ......). Is that correct? Cheers Danny

Hello again 'It is to make sure the blade remains fully immersed in water all the time' I see, thanks, that confirms it for me a bit ' tell him what you want to fit, engine wise.' Yes, that' the line I'll be taking. What I doing here is picking up some tips/info so that I can make a more informed choice when negotiating with the builders. Thanks again Cheers Danny As a non qualified boat designer (you and me), my advice go to a builder that builds the style of shell you like, to Cat D, tell him what you want to fit, engine wise. Problem solved. Depending on who is doing the fit out, the shell builder, a separate company or you, the shell builder will need to liaise with them, as to positioning of portholes/windows, doors and hatches.

Hello No, I'm most certainly not building this boat myself! That will be the job of a reputable boat builder! I've visited 5 or 6 now and had various email exchanges with several others. I'm just trying to get a few further opinions/info for finalising my design and negotiations with the builders. I'll leave the underside of the stern where it is then (600 above the main base plate), for the time being. I'll do some further checking with boat builders and prop suppliers/firms to ensure there is sufficient room. Was slightly intrigued to know if there is some important reason that the stern 'sits, in the water (as it seems from all the boats I've seen). Regards

Hello there For my would be widebeam boat, I've currently got the stern deck at 1100 mm above the base plate. The underside of the stern (structure), the bit that overhangs beyond the engine compartment and sits over the propeller and rudder, is at 600 mm above the base plate. I gather this is reasonable and complies with the RCD CAT D Regs. I'm thinking of raising the stern deck level by 100 mm or so (as I might be getting a bigger/taller engine), so that there will be sufficient space (height mainly) to accommodate the engine I have in mind. I could raise the stern deck by 100 mm then and leave the underside of the stern where it is at 600 mm above the base plate). From what I understand the draft would be in the region of 600 mm. This leaves the underside of the stern probably in the water. This seems to be 'normal' from what I can see. Is there a reason for this?. If I raised the underside of the stern to say 700 mm, it might then be slightly above the water line in some circumstances. Could this be a problem? My guess is that having the stern slightly in the water is maybe helping with the overall stability and limiting the boat 'leaning back' towards the stern (the water under the stern then taking some of the load). Regards Danny

I see Thanks for that Normally then I've found a board supplier that holds veneered MR MDF boards in stock. I'm going to give that a go and see how it pans out. We'll be adding a hardwood edge strip in certain situations that will be getting a bit more wear and tear. I'll let you know how it pans out.

Hello The other thing I'd say is that while some dampness in a bathroom is to be expected (and should be vented out), there's no reason for any other internal living space inside a boat to be damp. If it is there's something wrong. I see, .... I've read things to that effect in some of the other related topics. Normally I should be able to rig up a fairly well developed Ventilation system, so I'm hopeful that damp won' be a problem. Though I'd like to veer on the side of caution, ...... I might be away from the boat for some periods of time and wouldn't want to come back and find out there were all sorts of problems with my (expensive) cabinets. I realise there are winterisation procedures, but still, ........ Guess I'll have to do a bit more research/reading up and then make a decision Cheers

Hello I'm looking at making some cabinets/fitted furniture units for my canal boat project. I've been told to avoid using MDF as it will be affected by the damp/condensation and will/may then eventually swell.bloat and become damaged. This sounds like a reasonable assumption to me. So normally I will be using a decent quality marine ply for the backing boards (for veneered boards). These can be obtained, but unfortunately it seems you have to wait a good few days (maybe even a couple of weeks) to get the boards made, as boards based on marine ply are not standard/items. Nearly all veneered boards (for furniture) seem to be based on MDF. There is such a thing as 'moisture resistant' MDF, which is apparently fairly common (bathrooms, though I've not direct personal experience of these. Has anyone used such a product and did they find it to be suitable? It might well be that using such a backing board still requires a considerable lead time, so will not any quicker than using marine ply (though my feeling is that it should be cheaper, though I need to check in to this a bit more) Regards Danny