NB DW
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Posts posted by NB DW
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I'd be hugely grateful if anyone could help put me in touch with the owner or at least know of the boat...
Thank you
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Cheers. They're picking up the phone but the brokerage is closed during lockdown, so can't reach the person I'd like to.
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Thanks for the reply.
Oh dear. Not good reading, I've just skimmed through the thread in your link.
They've a boat on brokerage I'm interested in. The brokerage is closed at the moment and the manager and presumably the rest of the staff are furloughed, so there's nobody to talk to. I had faint hopes of maybe reaching him/her on here - but perhaps not given the feelings towards them!
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Hello..
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I rang two insurers - Ford Direct and Admiral - last week with a view to understanding whether they'd offer me cover as a liveaboard based in a marina. The only reason I picked those two out is due to them coming out cheapest on a comparison site. I was absolutely honest about the potential situation, that I'd be living in a marina, on a boat, and that the address on my policy would not be a place of permanent residence (be it BoatMail or a family member, I offered both), and the car would be kept at an address different to that to which the policy is registered, a marina in my case.
Neither had a problem with this setup after being placed on hold a few times whilst they checked with the underwriters whether it was acceptable. I think it may have been Ford which said that I'd have to put down the marina as the policy address - I explained I wasn't keen to do this as they don't handle mail on my behalf and it's also not residential - but they helped by suggesting that if I opt for email correspondence then no mail need go to the marina. Again, they understood that I did not live in a house. I cannot remember which of each or whether it was both that said I'd have to put the specific pontoon/berth reference as part of the address.
Esure, my current insurer, were clear with me in saying that I have to reside at the address to which the policy is registered, so BoatMail or a family member is not acceptable, even if you're clear in saying the car would be parked at an alternative address. They advised if I were to do this they could no longer cover me and I'd need to cancel the policy. Note, this is important; don't get yourself into a situation where insurance has been refused/cancelled as it's something you need to declare in the future and as I understand it, counts against you. Cancel it yourself once you've got an alternative sorted.
I'm sure others are sympathetic and understanding to the situation of being based at a marina though not sure how constant cruisers might fair.
Hope that helps.
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When you've got the cash it's still worth contacting brokers to let them know what you're looking for and what position you're in. Talk nicely to them and it might pay off. In my case in recent weeks I've had personal emails/phone calls from some brokers having taken this approach of boats which are on their way into brokerage or have arrived and haven't been advertised. It beats being on the automated mailshot everyone receives and by which point it's possibly too late.
Explain to brokers it's for a residential purchase to stand you some chance of a viewing.
There's compatively nothing on the market at the moment - even Whilton/Venetian who usually have easily 60+ boats for sale between them have next to nothing.
Those who bought them on the basis of not being able to do a foreign holiday etc will I suspect have them back up for sale in a year or so.
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Thanks a lot for the input everyone.
I don't want to use up any more of anyone's time and will leave the thread here on the basis that I won't be progressing with this one.
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1 minute ago, nicknorman said:
Before we knew anything about boats, we nearly bought a new Orchard Marine boat. But with my sober hat on I looked under the glitzy surface and saw very cheap and badly assembled materials. I realise that there isn’t much choice at the moment, but be aware that you are buying at the “cheap and cheerful” end of the market. I suggest that an older, higher quality boat is a better bet - if you can find one.
Ta. I think you're right. I'm in danger of falling into a trap that I'm aware of, and that is talking myself into something that I know isn't quite right, largely because there's nothing about at the moment.
I'll keep waiting.
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3 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:
This is where the comment I was about to make is corroborated! If the floor is getting wet, it makes no difference what the material is, it will still rot. I'm basing this on our first boat, which had leaky front doors and a corresponding spongy floor, and leaky side hatches with corresponding... you've guessed!
Where is the water ingress, and can you be arsed to fix this rather than walking away and finding another boat?
The problem is that it's not obvious anywhere to me. There's no evidence anywhere of water staining that I can see on the interior other than at the stern and that's very localised to a cupboard directly under the hatch.
It's not something I can be arsed to get fixed either as it'll involve big money, potentially ripping apart the fitout and none of that is reflected in the price.
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Just now, haggis said:
Could there be an inspection hatch under the steps up to the back deck? It is quite common to find them there bit you need to move the steps to see the hatch
Haggis
I'm not sure but I can check.
So if the bilge was found to be dry what would this mean for the floor?
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Thanks all.
I'm not certain it's solidwood and I reckon I'd need a new cupboard built.
Plus the hatch sorting assuming I'm right in saying that's where it's coming in from.
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Thanks all.
Without inspection holes throughout the cabin I'm not sure how a surveyor would be able to tell if hte bilge is dry / sub floor is knackered?
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I'm not 100% sure what it's made of. Potentially it's solid wood. The reason I say this is because a few years after the fitout was done, the same people fitted fixed seating and this was done in the same matching wood. I noticed the joints were dovetailed so guess that's solidwood too.
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2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
There were quite a few, and whilst they were only 6' 10" wide at any point along their length, it you put it along side a wall you may find that near the stern and bow it was nowhere near the wall, they wee 'banana' shaped such that some of them would not fit thru narrow locks.
Another (not infrequent) problem was that one gunwale could be 6" wider than the other.
The boats were assembled on a production line with different welders operating on each side, & as some welding was done the hull was rolled over to get to the other areas needing welding and being 'a bit weak' the hull twisted.
Always give a liverpool hull a good looking over.
Liverpool's future was obvious once cars changed from 'hub-caps' to alloy wheels (their supply of steel dried up !!!)
I wouldn't entertain buying it without a survey so hopefully they'd pick up on that.
The good news is that it's been up and down Hurleston plenty of times prior to last year's closure and widening, so narrow locks shouldn't be an issue.
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5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:
It was the one with the minimum banana bend that actually made it thru Hurleston and onto the Llangolen
This one must be banana shaped then as that's where it's moored
1 minute ago, Mike Tee said:Whatever room is at the back of the boat, just before the engine, check in any cupboards etc, as often an inspection hatch will be in there (which is normally the lowest point).
There wasn't one that I could see but then again I'm pretty new to this.
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I'm looking for a liveaboard boat as a primary residence and visited the boat pictured earlier today. I kept well away from the owner, with him letting me walk about the boat alone, and wore a mask and disposable gloves. Shopping in a supermarket would have been a thousand times more risky given how close people get. Just thought it worth adding in case anyone were to think I was sticking 2 fingers up at the rules etc.
Detail:
Built in 2010. Fitted out by Orchard Marine and shell by Liverpool Boats
1 owner from new, manual present
60ft Cruiser with Isuzu 42 engine having done only 400 hours
Reverse layout
Sterling 1600w inverter, Webasto Top C feeding the radiators, Morso Squirrel
12v/240 Shoreline fridge
No shortage of storage! Drawers and cupboards all over the place
Evidently barely used with the interior being as new. The oven's never been switched on!
Seems a nice quality fit out. Granite work surfaces, no evidence of water marks or ingress anywhere (see below)
Blacked every 3 years at Wrenbury boat yard with bitumen
I like the layout
Bad points:
Needs blacking
It's been sat a while so felt a little damp inside. The floor is ever so slightly flexible in some areas of the boat
Looks like the hatch has been letting water into the cupboard at the stern housing the califorier causing the woodwork to bubble
Wooden window/porthole frames all need refinishing
The roof was painted last year by the owner but not sure the prep was what it should have been - there's evidence of it bubbling again
No immersion heater and owner unsure whether the Webasto could be used to heat the water
No plumbing for a washing machine
Only 1 small side hatch (but that's hardly the owner's fault!)
The owner will take £55k
I've got to factor in the cost of somebody re-working a cupboard space and plumbing for a washing machince and fitting of an immersion heater/new califorier. Plus potential new cupboard required due to damage from water ingress from hatch.
2 pack paint and blasting will likely set me back £2500, maybe £1000-1500(?) for a washing machine and plumbing plus a califorier with an immersion element?
What do you reckon? Apologies, only very limited photos..
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Maybe it's just me being over critical of it but the flex was only pretty slight. I certainly wasn't bouncing up and down on it.
Orchard Marina (sister company to Liverpool Boats?) did the fit out so I can only assume they knew what they were doing and used marine ply.
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Just now, mrsmelly said:
Do you know anybody who can have a squint over it for you before you commit to surveys or anything?
Unfortunately not, no. I'm sure I could pay somebody to - there's lots of marinas and boatyards close by - but without any inspection hatches would this even be possible?
The owner is 2 hours drive away from where it's moored and I'm 20 minutes away, which is frustrating.
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8 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:The floor is probably rotten. Even old boats floors should be solid. Its either rotten or built with flimsy board. To sort could be a nightmare as everything will be built onto it.
A quick tip when boat buying. Try to buy from a full time lived aboard boat not a hobby boat. Hobby boats invariably sit about for months on end especialy in cold wet winters whereas my boat for instance is very warm all winter with the stove perpetualy going and interior kept dry and warm. Boats left unattended all winter year in year out can suffer.
Definitely a hobby boat bought from a boat show 10 years ago and not used a lot since. The oven has never been switched on!I did feel a little for the owner, an older chap, who'd bought it to use with the kids who I'm guessing didn't take too much of an interest and are now all grown up. Not that it's a reason to buy it or the owner was soft soaping me. Just my take on things.
1 minute ago, mrsmelly said:Can you get to the floors to look or is it carpeted?? 400 hours in over ten years could be great but could be bad news if its not been looked after, just laying idle for year after year isnt good. Nowt wrong with Scouse shells they have built squillions.
Floors are laminate, I think, rather than solid wood.
I'll put some photos up on another thread.
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Sounds like one to avoid then.
It's a 60ft cruise on a Liverpool shell fitted out by Orchard Marina, Northwich. It's 2010 and barely used - the engine has only done 400 hours.
It definitely wasn't winterised as far as I can tell. Curtains were still up, slightly mold on the blinds, and very, very faint orange marks (some sort of mildew I think) on the buttons on the seating.
Roof needs a repaint - it's bubbling - but other than that it's clear the boat's never been used and the owner I met today is the first and only owner.
They'll take £55k.
ETA the engine bay is pretty filthly though appeared dry but definitely in need of a repaint.
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Hi,
Apologies for the noddy questions here...
I've been to look around a boat that's been sat unattended to since October last year and therefore had no source of heat. The foor in places feels as though it flexes a little, maybe very slightly spongey, but not to any great effect. Certainly not the extent it feels rotten or like I'd be about to put my foot through it.
The boat didn't wreak of damp though there were some signs of mold. on blinds etc and around window frames, as you might expect on a boat that's been left for so long.
There are no inspection holes in the cabin so I wasn't able to check the bilge was dry.
In terms of the floor, is this pretty normal and as a result of moisture and once that boat's properly ventilated and heated the ply under would likely loose any moisture and any slightly flex would disappear?
Thanks
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Hi,
I've just been to view a boat that's up for sale privately. Other than a roof repaint, all looks well.
The only issue I can see is with it being a reverse layout cruiser, the hatch appears to have been leaking which has then run into a cupboard at the stern which houses the calorifier. The surface of the door and cabiet - I'm assuming veneer on top of MDF - has bubbled and rippled across an area that's roughly 15cm by 15cm.
I think I once read this could be made to look better if heat is applied. Is this correct? Or is it a case of a replacement panels?
Thanks
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Just now, enigmatic said:
I think you made the right decision. Buying a boat in that price range based on photos is madness.
Venetian's COVID policies were very strict, but based on that timing I have a sneaking suspicion they already knew somebody wanted to buy that boat and decided to save themselves the risk of showing others round...
Thanks. I definitely don't regret it not progressing it. And having seen more photos since I don't much like the wraparound bow - the steel lines where it's been extended look really obvious to me.
In fairness to Whilton, out of all the brokers I've been in touch with and sent details over my likes, dislikes, budget and 'ready to go' position, they've been one of the few that have acknowledged it and since been in touch about a boat that's coming to market next week that meets my criteria. They're happy to send photos ahead of it arriving and will let me know just ahead of it arriving so I can view, should I wish to.
One Cheshire based broker who I sold my boat via the summer of last year didn't even bother to acknowledge it despite personalising the message to jog their memory of our previous dealings.
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4 hours ago, enigmatic said:
Some/most of the listed boats were from last summer. Rugby Boats didn't have many for sale at any one time and was very efficient at selling them. Not many have gone on the market anywhere since, for the reasons you mentioned.
Winter and lockdowns may have had an effect on sales since then. Elsewhere, there is a very nice boat I looked at in September for nearly £40k which is now £35k and apparently still unsold,. At the time I looked at it the broker chuckled and said "you'd be lucky to knock £500 off it in this market", Then again, maybe its October survey found some issues.... and somebody actually bought the boat posted on here that Venetian wouldn't let anyone look at without paying a deposit!
That was me. I was on the phone to them when the boat had only been on the market literally 5 minutes. This was late in the afternoon. I was told that I couldn't view unless I paid a deposit and even then a viewing would only be allowed at survey time. I explained it would be for residential use and despite them going away to check for any exemptions after I explained other brokers were allowing viewings for residential sales, it was still a no.
At 10:00 the following morning it was under offer and is now sold. I've seen some pictures of it in dry dock having been blacked and presumably surveyed. So it's worked out for somebody.
2 hours ago, matty40s said:Any boat that has been on sale for 3 months or more now is either overpriced, has had a sale resulting in it coming back to market, or a complete dog......sometimes a combination.
Whilton, down to 8 boats(including a plastic tender) would normally have a massive selection to go and view.
ABNB a few more, but most of those off site, creating massive viewing issues, again, very little new, the last few email updates have featured Available Again a lot with no new stock. They have also been marketing boats in the previously 'Whilton' bracket, just to keep sales throughput going.
GreatHaywood, difficult to tell as they are not good at updating website.
Great Haywood have next to nothing too. Anything on the website which appears available has either been sold or withdrawn, so they tell me, but don't alter the website. Presumably to drawn you in and get your details on their register.
Toddy II - is anyone familiar with this boat or know the owner?
in General Boating
Posted
It's up with a brokerage, not that you'd be able to tell from the (barely existent) ad.