rovingrom

WOW - THANK YOU so much for posting those excerpts from the Brum Boats hire brochures from 1985 etc!!!! I do have a further request though and this relates to the confusion about BrumTug QUERCUS / QUERQUS. Back in November 2019 Dave Moore wrote: "I remember Quercus well, I wrote it around then. All of the notice boards at the yard had it spelt Querqus and that was how I laid it out. Director Alan Green dropped into the paint dock and queried my spelling, before I put paint on so disaster was avoided". However the 3rd of your brochure photos shows a "QUERQUS"..... Could you enlarge the photo of "QUERQUS" (photo below) to see how the name is written on the cabin side? Or just tell me how it's written if you can't enlarge it?

Tim - I forgive you for not being the other Tim because you are a complete star for finding and posting those excerpts from the Brum Boats hire brochures from 1985 etc!!!! THANK YOU so much! [Edit - Now I see it wasn't you who posted the brochures but RS2021. I forgive you anyway, for anything for which you should be forgiven!]

Thanks Julian. The same details were provided by a new member on our Facebook "BrumTug" page yesterday, such that we have been able to identify BRUM TUG No.3 and list it on our BrumTug fleet list. In later years this boat was renamed MOSELEY SHOALS (after a place in Birmingham) and SHANID.

The boat described above by Sea Dog is clearly a BrumTug by the name of QUERCUS (or QUERQUS) but it's identity remains a mystery. Could you ask your friendly neighbour whether the QUERCUS he remembers hiring was longer or shorter than 35', where they hired from, and what year/s? Any photos, especially showing a BWB licence number would be incredibly helpful!

Well Sea Dog, what you are describing is most definitely a BrumTug, however QUERCUS (or QUERQUS) remains a mystery to us. It does not appear in any of our existing BrumTug fleet details, nor is there any record on the CanalPlan listings that corresponds. Is there any chance you could remember what year you hired it, and how long it was (the boat, not the trip!)?? You don't by any chance have any photos do you, especially one showing a BWB licence number???

Tim, you are not by any chance the Tim whose e-mail address started with "timtsll2" and is (or was) owner of BrumTug DOVETAIL (73318) are you??

Thank you for the update Theo! I have just finished compiling v1 of the BrumTug fleet list (with much help from Pete Harrison) and am about to post it to the Facebook group we have recently set up for BrumTug supporters. The group is called (you'll never guess?!) "BrumTug" and the link is: https://www.facebook.com/groups/2333300103642367 Your update arrived just in time and I have added the extra details to the list. On Pete's advice, which we agree with 100%, NB THEODORA (formerly KINGSWOOD LADY) is most definitely regarded as a genuine BrumTug. She has most of the characteristics of the other BrumTugs with the exception of being twice the length and not having the "snout" bow with the characteristic flat, diamond-shaped plate to seat a button fender. The photo is great! Colin.

Well now - interesting that you should both mention Quercus (or Querqus). Esox, who started this thread, and I, have been researching BrumTugs for a few weeks (only) and have Quercus down on our list with several question marks. Another authority on Brummagem Boats and BrumTugs didn't know about Quercus. So rustynewbery and Sea Dog - can you tell us any more? Do you know the boat or it's present location, or do you have other connections with it? Do you know if it has/had a traditional back cabin? Sea Dog - did you hire Quercus or own it? What are those fond memories??

Nice! I was there with my boat in April last year and certainly the pub was gone. I agree that the BCN is fascinating and deserves to be explored much more widely! (Both photos - Ryders Green Locks).

Undesirable crew?? Not sure what that might infer but clearly they were without the "TY" (or tea?)!!

You mean the search box is not working??

Not many we think, although it gets confusing because they went into partnership with the Alvechurch Boat Centre who had an extensive hire fleet. I suspect that very few hulls/shells were built by Brummagem themselves but it looks like a lot of the fitting out of their hire fleet boats, as well as a number of private orders, were done by Brummagem at their Sherborne Street wharf base. There are reported to have been just 13 BrumTugs, although there is confusion because #14 appears twice - it has been suggested they didn't want to produce a #13 - and we also know of a boat claimed to be BrumTug15 !! Nice photo on the Ryders Green 8 locks! Do you recall which boat that was Tim?

No, the company was Brummagem, as in the colloquial name for "Brimingham". However for some reason many owners of their boats seem to be unable to spell...... In addition the listings at CanalPlan give a range of spellings: Brummagen, Brumagen, Brumagem, Brumajem, etc. In our research we learnt quickly to check as many variations as we could imagine possible! The Apollo Duck listing for IBIS is under "Brummagen" (N) as stated above!! The photos below prove the correct spelling of the name. I worked a season with Brummagem in 1976 or 77 (before the BrumTugs era) and I can confirm the owners of the company knew how to spell!

Thanks Howard! As Alan said, there were a number of posts here around 2011/2014, including a number by Alan himself when he was owner of BrumTug BEAVER. We have been through all those posts and archived the details found there, including the original sales brochure. However we are hoping to find the current whereabouts of as many of this small fleet as possible, with a view to producing a detailed fleet list. Being that they were built in the 1980's many have been lengthened, refitted, and/or renamed, so that their originally distinctive BrumTug features are now more difficult to identify. There were only ever 13 (or maybe 14.... and then some people say 15!) genuine BrumTugs built and we have located 7 of them. We're hoping that other members on this Forum will know of a few more.

As it happens I can tell you almost exactly where Ibis is now! She is on Apollo Duck currently for sale, having recently been extensively restored, refitted and repainted. Location shows only as "Oxfordshire". Along with Esox above, I am the founder of the new Facebook "BrumTug" group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2333300103642367). 2 days ago I posted a copy of the sale advert to the group but the owner/seller asked me to remove it (no idea why), which I have now done. I will just post the advert photo here. If anyone is interested and can't find the advert on Apollo Duck (try a search for "Brummagen" with an "N") let me know and I'll direct you.

Hope nobody minds me reviving this fascinating thread? I worked a summer season at Brummagem Boats in (I think) 1976, helping at weekends with hire fleet turn rounds and from time to time with the 2 trip boats. This was at the time Alan Green was a director, along with Barry Stanton(??). Alan was senior lecturer in Town Planning at the City of Birmingham Poly (Planning Dept. located in a prefab right next to Aston Junction) and I failed my first year(!!) so Alan offered me the job. I recall the 3 main hire boats were LAD, LASS and LADY and I'm pretty sure all 3 were Rugby Boats build with that unmistakable wide top "plank" bow. All three were 42 foot, 4-berth, cruiser sterns I believe, and were painted in Brum Boats scarlet with (I think) green and yellow lining. KLEIO (I think you got that spelling right Pete Harrison) was owned privately, possibly by Barry Stanton, and was a trad stern painted in plain maroon or crimson lake, unlined. I think she was also slightly longer - 45ft? She was kept more in reserve for busy periods - being a trad she was my favourite but the company was more protective of her so I never got a chance to do more than clean her! LINDA was the Teddesley build, shorter in length (32 ft, maybe 35ft?), with a square hull at the stern, very short read deck (almost trad) and fibreglass top painted in a mustard yellow or beige. 2 berth or maybe 3 maximum. Like KLEIO, LINDA was privately owned and used less than the 3 Rugby boats. Sherborne Street Wharf was fairly derelict at that time but still with the original covered loading dock in situ. I had a bit of a shock when I took my current boat round the loop in April this year - one or two changes are in evidence!! Back in 1976 the business was run out of a fairly scruffy caravan parked on the hard-standing. As I recall, the trip boats ran from Gas Street Basin as a start and finish point - maybe even on the Worcester side of the "Worcester Bar" - a far more convenient point to load punters than at Sherborne Street. They were the BRUMMAGEM FLY, an ex-GUCCC(??) working boat that had been converted to a trip boat on the Regents Canal (again I'm dredging through the deep recesses of my mind - much deeper than most of the BCN at that time - and maybe wrong here!). The 2nd trip boat was the EUPHRATES PACKET, but not the current one - I'm led to believe that Brummagem Boats have used that name on at least 3 trip boats?? The PACKET's steerer was Malcolm Wigley(?) at that time, who I believe was Graham Wigley's brother (of Gas Street Basin and the rival trip boat fleet). I'm told Malcolm later emigrated to New Zealand. The PACKET was a purpose-built trip boat, possibly on a Teddesley hull? My main job on the trip boats was to run the bar on the PACKET, although a couple of times I was sent to run the bar on the FLY. On occasions though Malcolm asked me to relieve him at the tiller and I had a sneaking suspicion he wanted to eye up the ladies in the cabin..... With the strict pub licencing hours of the period, the theory was that alcohol could be served at any time of day provided the bar was afloat. However it was a moot point - at pretty much every bridge hole the silt and rubbish in the cut lifted the stern by 6 inches or more, before dropping back in as we left the bridge (even more so the FLY with its deeper draught)!! So how much of the time we were actually "floating" was debatable!! Trips were usually down the Worcester & Birmingham to Selly Oak and back, with occasionally a longer trip to Wast Hill Tunnel. With the small hire fleet I was invited to take one of the 3 Rugby boats out for a couple of days if they were not all booked out to hirers, although I was told not to take them through locks if single-handed. Still, from Sherborne Street Wharf there's a fair bit of lock-free pound available. My favourite route was out along the Main Line, including some of the old loops if time allowed, then down through Netherton Tunnel, left through Gosty Hill to Coombeswood Basin and back - a trip I did on several occasions. I have a number of photos of Gas Street, Farmers Bridge and Netherton Tunnel from this period (let me know if you want to see them) and somewhere I should have some colour slides of the Brummagem Boats fleet but they will take some finding!! Any additions or corrections to the above would be much appreciated!

Laurie - interesting photos thank you! I have now edited my post having found the owner of the original article (Brian Clarke). In my edit I have added links to Brian's respective pages. If you look closely at those pages you will find further links to 2 most interesting documents, namely: - BrumTug Original Sales Brochure: http://nbrumpus.cut-net.co.uk/brumtug1.html - BrumTug Priced Specification: http://nbrumpus.cut-net.co.uk/brumtug2.html The Specification is fascinating, although the reproduction is quite poor and it's hard to read in places! Notice especially: - The Engine Installation (Item 2) with remote drive to stern tube via belts and pulleys and 5 gallons of diesel included, all for a mere £2249. - The Electrical Installation (Item 3) with just 1 x 90 Ah battery (2nd battery available as extra). - Optional Extras list, Items 9 onwards. I am taking the liberty of posting the Sales Brochure here (with thanks now to Brian Clarke). However the links above lead to higher resolution versions that are easier to read.

Beaver was certainly a BrumTug, I assume that at 32ft Bobcat would also have been a tug... Here's an article about Beaver from 1986..... (with apologies to Mike Stevens and the original author who is unknown!): [Edit: I have now found the original website - owned by Brian Clarke - from where I filched the article below. See: http://nbrumpus.cut-net.co.uk/index.html http://nbrumpus.cut-net.co.uk/brumtug.html End edit]

I don't think so, other than that it is a John Deere issue and not connected to the marinisation (and thus constant running at low RPM) by Beta. The following JD link may be helpful: Diesel Engine Coolant (engine with wet sleeve cylinder liners) There was another link that I found a while ago that gave a little more info but I've hunted again without success!

Thank you Mike. One of the 2 reasons I am doing this though is that I have discovered there is a known coolant cavitation issue with JD3 and John Deere 3029 engines, that can produce early pin-point corrosion in the cylinder bore liners between the block and liner. The solutions are either to replace the existing coolant with a 50:50 mix of Comma Xstream G05 (at £31.50 for 5 ltr!!) or to buy specially formulated John Deere coolants. I managed to find 3 x 5 ltr G05 from one supplier on eBay at a tad over 60 quid delivered, so I'm going with that!

Thanks for this Dave - great advice and exactly what I was looking for! After spending some time checking the John Deere specifications and updates I found that there are 2 options to avoid the cavitation issue: one is to refill with a 50:50 solution of normal tap water and Comma Xstream G05 which has a special formulation to address this problem, the other is to use a special pre-diluted coolant produced by John Deere. Being a skin tank my system contains 27 litres. The Comma G05 normally costs around £30 for 5 litres but I found a supplier on eBay from whom I bought 3 x 5 litres for £60. Great advice - many thanks for that! I shall wait until an engineer friend is available and work on this together - clearly it's not going top be a 20 minute job if I want to fit isolater valves to aid draining in future.

I have a Beta JD3 (John Deere 3029) in a 2007 Colecraft narrowboat, with very low hours from new (280 hr). It has a horizontal skin cooling tank running along the hull base plate (photo). The is also a horizontal calorifier under the main bed, heated by the engine coolant as well as a Webasto. I need to drain and refill the coolant as the previous owner has run the engine with zero anti-freeze / corrosion inhibitor and I am aware of risk cylinder bore liner pitting with this engine. However I cannot find any coolant drain valve on the engine or skin tank, nor any bleed valves to prevent air locks on refilling. Do I just remove coolant hoses, pump or blow through to remove coolant from the skin tank, then refill to the highest level, run the engine and top up through the engine header tank? Or are there drain valves and bleed screws that I have missed? The Beta Marine JD3 manual makes no mention of how to drain/refill the coolant, and the John Deere 3029 manuals relate to agricultural installations with cooling radiators. Any help would be much appreciated! Please note: I don't need to know whether or not I should do this, what coolant to use, etc. - just HOW to do it?

Thanks for that Dave, but I wish I'd known that before I flushed it and filled with new oil. The only real problem is with storage - my boat is filling up with full 5-litre pots of anti-freeze and engine oil as it is.... But your point is good and I'll have a think about that! Not sure now though that the damage hasn't already been done? 164 hours from December 2007 when installed up to July last year, since when I've added another 36 hours in occasional short 1-2 day trips. Also I have no way of knowing if the oil I recently pumped out was the original from 2007, or whether the previous owner changed the oil at some point but didn't bother to change the original factory fitted filter. How many hours would be considered suitable running-in time on this engine? Is it still worth removing the new clean oil and refilling with running-in oil, or do you think we're past that point now?

Good to know, or it least it was until I looked into the cost of Comma Xtream G05 - £31.50 per 5 litres. My skin tank cooling system holds 27 litres and at the Beta recommended dilution of 50:50 that means buying 3 x 5 lite bottles at little short of £100 with transport. However I did find them on eBay from Workshop Essentials at the slightly more palatable price of £22.03 each for 3 plus £5.95 for overnight delivery - thus a tad over £72 delivered. Still seems a lot for anti-freeze though.....

Mine - also the newer version with plastic air cleaner housing (2007 build boat) was rather expensive. Part No. BT-211-03819 ordered for me by Wharf House Narrowboats at Braunston Bottom Lock cost £25 + £5 VAT. So I am fitting the new one and keeping the old as a spare. I'll use the air line method of cleaning them in future.