Jerra
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Posts posted by Jerra
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Apologies for top posting. Yet again I can't get the cursor to click in the white below the quote.
Fortunately many people don't agree otherwise there wouldn't have been the outcry against Starbucks etc.
I actually think tax avoidance is a necessary and moral act,
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Where does the continual reference to poll tax come from? A poll tax is based on number of people in a "property" council Tax isn't and as far as I can see is always in the lowest band for any form of movable residence be it caravan or boat.
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Local authorities that I have lived in for a week or more recently (in the last year).
Manchester
Trafford
Frodsham
Macclesfield
Northwitch
Derbyshire
Tameside
Oxford
Banbury
Stoke
Chester and west Cheshire
Probably more.. and I don't even CC. About the only way you could collect is by having checkpoints on the canal or a local sales tax. Given in some of those boroughs all you can get near the canal is stale white bread and lager even that is hardly going to pay for wear and tear on the pavement and the carrier bag of rubbish I left in the bin.
You appear to be missing my point. If you don't CC then you should/would be paying a council tax somewhere. As a visitor you get to use the facilities provided on a reciprocal basis. People from area A visit area B People from area B happen to be visiting (at some point) area C etc. So everybody is getting use of facilities on a shared basis.
I have admitted CCers (and their land based equivalents) are a problem for any system and I have asked others to make suggestions. One has been offered - a form of local income tax.
Incidentally what you get near the canal isn't the only things being provided I am sure people stray as far as pubs and shops along roads and pavements.
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You really can't see the contradiction in your statement?
I am not suggesting double council tax only council tax if that is your residence. Are you suggesting a tax per person is the same as a tax per residence?
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What I don't understand is you have decided of all the 'somethings for nothing' in the world this is the one that makes you grumpy. I point out there are many other 'something for nothings'. For instance a visitor to an area pays nothing for local services but presumably expects the use of local services.
Of which emergency services and police are not included, please get your facts right or people will think you are just spouting bullshit.
The government, in its wisdom, has decided what the criteria to collect local taxation, you in your wisdom, want a form of taxation that not so long ago caused riots and so much protest it was dropped like a hot brick.
I must admit the churlish of your "something for nothing" really disgusts me.
There you go again misrepresenting me.
Nothing I have suggested comes anywhere near a poll tax. The poll tax was a payment per individual all I have suggested is the current tax method is applied evenly to those resident in the area. I have admitted true itinerants are difficult and in a different position.
I am not in a discussion about all the different possible "somethings for nothing" I am in a discussion about (wait a minute I will look at the thread heading) "Living Aboard Thames"
Strange that when others have mentioned these services further up the thread you didn't accuse them of spouting BS. Whether I have picked the correct examples or not the principle remains it is impossible to live in an area and not benefit from things done with public funds raised by council tax.
The point about visitors doesn't hold water as everybody (well shall we settle for most) is at sometime a visitor and benefits from "free" services for the short time they are there on a reciprocal basis with visitors to their area.
I find your attitude which suggests you shouldn't be paying your share disgusting but there you are.
With regard to the comment that has just come in about a one trick pony I am only "regurgitating" my position because people keep coming back and querying it. I am not likely to go out and look for new reasons as to why I hold my view am I? Neither am I likely to be more than amused at replies such as the one about sleeping well knowing I am paying for others services. That is highly amusing coming from somebody who resorts to such tactics as "one trick pony" comments.
Incidentally your continued protestation about my stance makes me wonder am I touching a nerve? Are you resident in an area and not contributing is that why you are getting upset about my position?
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So you're very selective about your "getting something for nothing" then?
I live in my camper van - should I pay council tax? Who should I pay it to?
I did make the point way back in the "discussion" that those that are truly CCers (or their land equivalent do present a problem) and asked somebody to suggest ways they could contribute and local income tax which was then divided out to local authorities was suggested.
However this is again straying away from my original point which was anybody who is residential in an area (CMing, residential mooring, leisure mooring but in actual fact has no other abode etc and their land based equivalents) is getting quite a lot for nothing if they aren't paying council tax as they still expect for example local emergency services and police to look after them.
As yet nobody has IMO given me a reasonable explanation of how they aren't getting something for nothing. To come back to the point I originally made if a proportion of the population aren't paying their local taxes then it costs the rest of the population a little more (or they don't get as good a service as not as much money is coming in to pay for the level of service).
I don't feel it is a difficult concept or an unreasonable or unfair concept, you obviously do.
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But they're getting Something for Nothing and that's not right.
Jerra has said so.
Roads are for cars. End of.
Do please try to not misrepresent what I have said!
My comments about getting something for nothing were about the situation where somebody lives in a mobile residence (be it property or chattel) and pay no council tax.
As Arducius points out roads for example (not to mention police etc.) get much of their money from local tax so those who aren't contributing are IMHO getting something for nothing.
I have not mentioned roads for cars as far as I can remember due to the point Arducius makes above.
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Sorry I now can't make it.
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Evidence, link?
I know some people will not count the BBC as suitable evidence but a very quick google produced the following quote from
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16643677
<QUOTE>
- As of February 2011, there were 5.5m people receiving working-age benefits. Some 371,000 of those were foreign nationals when they first came to the UK, representing 6.4% of the claimants.
- Almost 17% of all British nationals receive these benefits compared with almost 7% of all those classed as non-UK nationals when they first arrived in the UK.
- More than half of those receiving a benefit had in fact at some point become British citizens, meaning they had the same rights as people born British.
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Your profile gives nothing away but guessing by your comments, you must be a government minister.
Keith
No where near! Perhaps I should take up politics by your view I might get rapid promotion!
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To me at least Yes.
(Sorry for top[ posting but I couldn't get the cursor to go into the white area below the quote)
It would be worth it though, would't it?
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1. Most services that mobile boaters use ( water, sewage disposal, rubbish collection etc ) are provided by the waterways authority and are paid for in the licence fee.
2. Local Income Tax, a levy could and should be added to everyone's tax bill, this should go towards paying for local services.
Anyone not paying income tax or on benefit would still not pay.
Fire service police etc aren't provided by CRT so while I would agree with most it certainly isn't all so I personally feel there still needs to be a payment.
No.2 Yes I think that might work.
Apart from the fact we all pay taxes for our boats - its called a licence fee
Sorry but the CRT license isn't a tax it is a payment to a charity for use of their facilities a bit like an entrance fee to one of the National Trusts Properties.
See my comment elsewhere about provision of other services e.g. Police.
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Or, perhaps leisure boats should be classed as second homes and taxed accordingly?
Keith
Why not? I pay taxes on the holiday home I own.
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Don't you just love a "something for nothing" whinge.
If you really want to address the inequalities in the taxation system then I suggest that Poll Tax is not the way to do it.
As for "they belong to somebody" - do you think I should pay council tax on my boots?
Oh Dear Oh Dear
I certainly love hearing those who try to justify why they shouldn't pay their way.
Where does this poll tax suggestion come from I certainly haven't mentioned it - just council tax.
I gave the readers credit for having the intelligence to separate the concept of "property" as in where you live from property as in this pen knife is my property. Was I wrong?
Is there a justifiable reason why somebody resident in some form of mobile domicile shouldn't be eligible for the same taxes as those who aren't mobile?
Unless you are very well versed in the ways of the Valuation Office, most council officers are not, I would steer well clear of demanding that boat owners pay CT.
Fine. Please do 2 things for me.
1. Suggest a justifiable reason why those resident in Chattels shouldn't be expected to pay their share.
2. Suggest a reasonable system other than council tax which could be applied.
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Well, that's really a different subject, perhaps you'd like to come up with a better suggestion than the system we have now?
Keith
No I wouldn't! I am happy with the current system provided all residential units pay a charge, no missing out living caravans or residential boats.
Perhaps for mobile residential units (as opposed to static caravans) it could be paid to the government as a tax which could then be divided up and paid out to councils along with other monies the central government pays to councils.
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Council tax is a tax on property - there were riots when somebody (can't remember the name but then neither could she) tried to impose a poll tax, do you think you can impose one all on your own?
Of course council tax is a tax on property unless I am very much mistaken living caravans and boats are property i.e. they belong to somebody. If a living caravan used for residential purposes has to pay council tax why not a boat. In fact I am not inventing anything if you live on a boat (other than genuine continuous cruising) you need residential planning permission and that lays you open to council tax.
Council tax is calculated to bring in the money a council needs if some aren't paying then others have to cover that.
Incidentally what has my drawing attention to the fact residential boats should be paying council tax got to do with a poll tax. You will find that the council tax is the same for a single person on a boat or a family of 6 on the same boat.
I am not imposing a tax of my own merely not expecting others to try to get something for nothing.
P.S. I suspect the only reason a genuine CC doesn't have to pay a council tax is because of the difficulties in
1. Catching up with them to impose it.
2. Deciding which of the many councils to award it to.
3. Effort to do the above exceeding the money which might be raised.
Totally agree and I would go so far as to say that planning restrictions, with regard to residential use of boats, have no logic and should be scrapped.
So how and when do the residential boaters pay their share of the things provided by the council, for example the streets they use to go shopping the street lights as they stumble out of the pub and haven't yet adjusted to the dark they will face on the tow path etc.
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At the time I worked for the local council, they didn't care where I lived and were aware I lived on a boat.
it doesn't cost anyone else more either.
I am sorry but I can't agree with your points above.
The council should care about you living on a boat because at the very least they were being immoral giving an employee (or for that matter anyone else) preferential treatment - letting them off without council tax and not persuing them for breach of planning regs as they would anyone else.
It does cost others more. The amount of money needed by the council has to be collected from those paying council tax living somewhere and not paying your share means others have that share split up among what they pay.
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You can even go from the top down
Have only ever swept domestic chimneys from the top down. Seal the fire place, sweep,unseal a little and use a strong vac. No mess at all - properly done.
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I think you will find that this only applies to land not on the land registry.
When I bought my first house I was given permission by neighbours (On the basis of everybody from your house has always parked their so perhaps permission isn't quite the right word) to use some land to park the car on. The land did not belong to them but to the firm I bought the house from.
The advice from the solicitor was say nothing keep using it and if nobody complains or charges in 12 years yo can claim it. Now he might have been wrong but that was his professional advice. I suspect it to be true because 30+ years later it seems to be being treated as their own by the current owners of the house.
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A quick look at the CRT website confirms TDH's statement with these words.
Your boat's licence includes permission to tie up for short periods along the towpath when you take a break from cruising. A short period means up to 14 days, or less if there's a sign along the bank indicating something different.
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Completely unusable at present.
So was this posted by telepathy?
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Once your eyesight goes, you're not safe to be in charge of a car.
That would prevent a number of people ever having a license and I was under the impression that glasses corrected vision. Perhaps you know something the opticians don't?
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Thanks for the advice which has solved my reading problems (yes I know I should have learned years ago).
Perhaps somebody can help with my current problem.
I wanted to post a reply so I dutifully clicked on quote edited to leave just the bit I was commenting on and then couldn't click outside the quote box to add my comment.
Ideas.
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It may be because I am currently suffering lots of errors but there are a couple of observations I would like to make.
1. In the past when I have clicked on "new content" I have been presented with a list of all posts from the last several hours. Now it only seems to show any posts since I was last on the page perhaps only seconds ago. I find this a big disadvantage as I was in the habit of using this facility to ensure I at least saw the title of the threads where there was activity. Now I can be presented with a longish list (say first visit in the morning) I read one thread and all the others have disappeared.
2. In the past when I revisited a thread (because of new posts) I was automatically taken to the first unread post. Now it seems to start on post number 1 what ever. This can be a pain if the thread is long, particularly as there no longer seems to be a "last" button to take you to the last page.
TV licence
in Living Afloat
Posted
I totally agree with you. I am intrigued by the site telling what to do if you don't watch TV. They have missed the obvious (well to me it is obvious) answer of telling them you don't use a TV for watching live programmes.
At one time we had a flat above one of the shops which was empty and used for storage work room etc. As it was still listed as a separate address we were contacted about a TV license, politely replied that we didn't use one and heard no more for 3 years or so. The question was asked along the lines of any changes answer no off they go for a few more years.