IanD
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Posts posted by IanD
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2 minutes ago, M_JG said:
Why are you explaining this to me?
Haven't I already made it clear in the post you quoted I am fully aware.?
I'm not explaining it to *you*, other people read posts too you know... 😉
You seem so determined to pick an argument that you can't even see when I'm agreeing with you. Bye-bye, again...
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8 minutes ago, M_JG said:
I think the differennce is that going over seats or a rail you would tend to go in head rather then feet or side first.
Which is exactly the problem with seats at the stern like in the photo, whether it's a trad or a cruiser stern. If you get knocked backwards by the tiller while steering standing up on a trad then you might not even go overboard but be left hanging on to the tiller, and if you do go overboard it won't be head-first.
Against this, it does give somewhere to sit instead of stand while steering on a trad, so they do have a plus point. Whether this is worth having given the (small but possible fatal) risk is a decision for the boater, but they should at least be made well aware of the risk when they buy (or hire) the boat.
8 minutes ago, M_JG said:You do know that it takes two to have an argument?
Coming from the member who takes arguing for the sake of it to a whole new level that comment is utterly priceless.
Yes it takes two. Funny how so many of the arguments like this -- with me and others -- are with you then, don't you think? And that -- as here -- you're usually the first to start playing the man, not the ball?
Pot, kettle... 😉
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4 minutes ago, M_JG said:
I would also point out that there is a greater length of cruiser stern rail to tip over when compared to two small seats.
Btw, its you that has a problem expressing an opinion that differs to yours.
Not in the slightest, I always point out that other opinions are available 🙂
Apart from arguing for the sake of arguing with me -- and seemingly, saying that these seats are not a bad idea, whatever they're called -- just what have I posted that you're objecting to?
And please don't put words into my mouth like "you want to ban them" when I've said exactly the opposite... 😉
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9 minutes ago, M_JG said:
There are also cases of people tipping over the rail of a cruiser stern. So should these be removed because people are not aware of the risk of sitting on them?
The answer is no.
That's your opinion. You do realise that other people are allowed to think differently?... 😉
I should also point out that on a cruiser stern you can stand or sit safely forward of the arc of the tiller, on a trad you can't.
BTW, the answer is not to ban them, it's to make damn sure that people are aware of the risks of sitting on seats near the tiller. I'll bet that most boaters with them fitted aren't, or think "Oh, it'll never happen to me". And mostly they're right -- except in the occasional tragic case when they're not... 😞
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8 minutes ago, M_JG said:
We would use them when moored to increase the outside social space at the stern. If you sit on them whilst underway you are in the arc of the tiller, I say that constitutes them being misused.
Even when I did try them whilst underway I found you inevitibly found you were unable to steer properly as you couldnt move the tiller much towards the side you were sat.
So they were consigned to being used when moored and quite useful they were too.
You may well have used them safely, but going by the boats I've seen travelling with and sitting on them most boaters don't, maybe because they don't know of the risk... 😞
It's a bit like giving someone a chainsaw and after they've chopped their leg off saying "Oh, didn't you know you should have been wearing chainmail gloves and chainsaw trousers? How silly of you..."
I believe there are several recorded cases of boaters being tipped over them by the tiller and dying or being badly injured as a result. Fitting them seems irresponsible to me, unless boaters are made well aware of the risk -- which I don't think most are.
If you're aware of the risk and don't sit on them when underway -- and especially not in a lock or when reversing -- that's fine for you. Not everyone is as knowledgeable though... 😞
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7 minutes ago, M_JG said:
Lots of things 'kill' people if they are misused.
Difficult to see how "sitting on them" is "misuse", since that's obviously their intended use... 😉
I wasn't the one to coin the term, and that's what both Ricky and Tim called them, as do other posters. If you're happy to have them then that's your choice, just like not having them was mine... 🙂
Back to the OPs question, for a single-hander a trad stern is the best choice in most people's view, especially if you aim on using the boat and travelling all year round. If you want to be more sociable with more people on board then a semi-trad or cruiser stern may be better, a cruiser stern is more miserable when boating in bad weather offers more outside space in summer. Pram hoods are an abomination in the eyes of many, as are big cratch covers. YMMV... 😉
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Just now, M_JG said:
Yes I know. However they never managed to kill me or Mrs. M_JG in five years.
Frankly its a daft name for them.
They didn't kill you, but I believe they've killed others, hence the name.
Whether you have them fitted is entirely your decision 🙂
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12 minutes ago, M_JG said:
Cough.....
AKA "suicide seats"...
Ricky at Finesse told me Tim Tyler wouldn't fit them to one of his hulls, if I wanted them I'd have to get somebody else to add them on. Fortunately I didn't... 😉
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2 minutes ago, pete.i said:
When I had my first narrowboat, a 30 footer trad stern with a BMC 1.5 engine called Keb, the original engine cover, which was a solid sheet of marine ply, had a lining of what looked to me like a horsehair layer then a layer of lead and then another layer of horsehair, a lead sandwich sort of affair. Anyway the the original engine cover had started to delaminate so I replaced it with a sheet of 18mm buffalo board. I didn't replace the sound deadening until much later but it was amazing how much difference that lead sandwich made. Downside was that it also made the deck board VERY heavy.
Insulation with a lead layer has largely been replaced by a dense polymeric layer like the one I linked to, which is cheaper but is claimed to be just as effective. See lead one below...
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3 minutes ago, cuthound said:
I went off cruiser sterns when I watched an inebriated man moor next to me and then trip over the taff rail, tumbling head first into the cut.
At least with a trad or semi trad stern you would fall in feet first...
Unless suicide seats are installed... 😞
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You can also use acoustically-lined flexible ducting like this behind any ventilation holes to reduce noise to the outside world, a couple of feet long will do the job, a bend in it will also help...
Various sizes available, diamter quoted (125mm in this case) is internal, external is 50mm bigger.
Best sound insulation for panels/hatches is the type with a dense internal layer like this, it's 32mm thick:
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I remember going through Shelton steelworks and feeling the heat from the furnaces...
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1 hour ago, Paul C said:
Let us know once you’ve had chance to test it.
Will do.
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3 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:
Lets hope it works better than a dongle in the window
I certainly hope so. I paid about £240 which is similar to the price on the German website I added the link to, so I'll be quite annoyed if it doesn't do what it claims... 😉
P.S. The reichelt.com one also has inbuilt GPS and Wi-Fi antennas which I didn't need, also it was cheaper without them.
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39 minutes ago, Pluto said:
You may find this report interesting, though I have had to compress it significantly so that it is small enough to be uploaded here.
Too blurry to read unfortunately -- can you compress it less, or split into parts?
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56 minutes ago, rusty69 said:
Yes, I remember you mentioning that antenna before. Is that the one that costs £470 ?
Yes, but I paid less than half that, I don't understand why the price on their website suddenly went through the roof (geddit?) ... 😉
£470+VAT (£564 inc VAT) is *ludicrous*, a German website has it for EUR270 inc. VAT which is about what I paid... 😞
https://www.reichelt.com/de/en/sharkfin-4x4-mimo-4g-5g-2x2-mimo-wifi-gpsd4-6-60-d-p330428.html?r=1
54 minutes ago, Owls Den said:I did look at those fin style, looks good.
I didn’t fancy installing that style as already had a TV aerial setup that I just swapped out for the 4g thing!
Can anyone see a unlocked 818 on Amazon that is ideally prime next day deliv ?
All seem used or really really long postage times, neither of which are any good to me.
If I was to run say 50 - 60 ft of 12v cable would it be a good idea to get the adjustable output voltage type converter. And how would I adjust it accordingly?Put the converter next to the router, and run the input 12V a long distance -- that'll be fine since it can accept 5V-30V at the input and still have a stable output.
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Just now, rusty69 said:
I found the best signal and SNR of ours was a few inches above the roof. Having tried it on a pole at the limit of the cables, and various location, this consistently gets the best signal, hence the desire to reduce the cable length to reduce the loss.
If you get it close to the steel roof then this acts as a reflector, and if the signals happen to add in phase you get more power -- however if they add out of phase you get less. With an antenna like the Poynting it's going to be pot luch which happens, and it'll probably be different for each antenna if you have MIMO -- so you might get better results on the band you happened to be using when you tested it, but much worse results when connected to a different basestation using a different band.
To avoid this the antennas need to be very close to the roof and designed for mounting like this (ground plane). Like this one -- the black dual-shark-fin in the middle of the picture... 😉
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7 minutes ago, rusty69 said:
Yes, I agree (I think that is twice now this week). I looked at replacing my thin lossy cables with a better quality shorter ones, but decided that remaking the connections at either end look too difficult and required a special crimp tool, not to mention opening up the aerial housing.
The cables often used can have loss up to 1dB/m or more, especially at 3.5GHz (the main 5G band). This can mean that an external low-gain omni antenna like the commonly-used Poynting doesn't give much more signal than the internal router antennas by the time it's crawled down the cable... 😞
Short cables are the best (e.g. having antenna on the roof above the router -- mine has 0.8m total cable length including 0.5m SMA-TS9 adaptors) but can be difficult to arrange in many boats.
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2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:
If you mean the power supply, then yes. I run mine from a buck converter that has an adjustable output voltage. The router is about 30 ft from the supply, so I adjusted the voltage accordingly.
Extending the cable too much will cause loss of signal, so may have a negative impact if extended too much. I think mine are 5m.
Even 5m antenna cables cause significant signal loss, this also depends on the cable quality -- thicker more expensive cables are better than thin cheaper ones.
https://www.wilsonamplifiers.com/blog/understanding-coaxial-cables-the-complete-guide/
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1 minute ago, Owls Den said:
Thanks all most helpful, I have a spare 12v lead coiled up poised like a snake ready to strike any gadget in sight!
Next question 🙋♂️
Can I extend the cables from the router, or will that affect performance?
Which cables?
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12 minutes ago, Owls Den said:
Sorry to bother everyone on this subject again! Or if this has been answered before
However I’m about to buy a huweai 818 router, and I’ve just thought about the power. Am I able to run this off 12v? Or do I have to have the inverter on all the time for a router? Can’t see them drawing much power but I’m but confuzzled by it all.
I have my Scancom sim ordered and I have a pontying mast installed ready!
TIA
Most routers nowadays (don't know about this specific one) use a 12V DC input from a mains adaptor. In theory you could run this straight from the boat 12V but it's not a good idea, because this can go up to higher voltages when the batteries are fully changed and this may cause damage. The safest option is to use a small DC-DC converter with a stabilised 12V output, like the one Loddon posted.
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1 hour ago, cheesegas said:
Interesting...
Looks like they use the well proven JBD BMS, although not much mention if all the batteries include the Bluetooth dongle which is critical to configure it and monitor cell voltages.
They do however use cylindrical cells which have a higher discharge current, although this will be limited by the BMS's peak current capabilities.
Most Lifepo4 batteries use four large prismatic cells in series which gives better energy density but a lower peak discharge current which isn't usually an issue for leisure batteries on boats.
Bear in mind that the large number of connections (and the way they're done) with cylindrical cells makes the quality of manufacture/joints (spot-welded and/or soldered) much more critical than with prismatic cells. This is fine for manufacturers with well-established high-volume production lines (e.g. Tesla) but not so good for small-volume suppliers -- especially packs built in China, which I assume these aren't but it's not clear from the website.
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12 minutes ago, magnetman said:
On really quiet installations it is useful to know if the engine is still running when knocked down to tickover and hasn't stalled.
Either a light or a rev counter are handy for this. The Beta marine standard panel just has rev counter and uses lights for other functions. Nice and tidy.
I'd have thought rpm monitor would be good for electric drive as way of judging if the prop is fouled. RPM v current drawn.
Various things are useful for electric drive, for example motor power/torque/current/rpm/temperature, generator/battery/charging status -- and even a "prop fouled" warning by monitoring torque vs. rpm. Since these are usually shown on an LCD display like this one, you can have as few or as many things displayed as you want... 😉
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31 minutes ago, Slim said:
In my opinion, no. Revs judged by ear and experience, fuel by a length of stick.
You could even ask why rpm matters on the canals, when what really matters is how fast you're going and how much wash you're making... 😉
Best Stern for Single Handed
in New to Boating?
Posted · Edited by IanD
Or better still, hire more than one type and see how they compare for you -- and if it's nice and sunny, try and imagine what it would be like in cold wind and rain.
Sometimes the real-life advantages and disadvantages of each type aren't everything you might think of before trying one... 😉