RogerM
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Posts posted by RogerM
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I was hoping Zodiac might have been attending. I understand she is normally based at Braunston. Anyone know where she might be?
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I think when only a wreck remains to represent a historical boat type it is better conserve the remains and then build an honest replica rather than to attempt a restoration that will result in the destruction of nearly all the surviving original material.
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Is this one of yours, please, Roger ?
Yes, it is indeed!
Roger
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It was Dodona by the tunnel (or half of it anyway!).
A very pleasant afternoon. Got some nice shots of Sickle working through the locks.
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Planning to call in on Saturday to grab some shots etc. Bit of a Middle Northwich fan so really looking forward to finally seeing Sickle
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Thats almost word for word what one of the guys from CCT said to me about the railway bridge problem. They seem to be very aware that it will be a massive undertaking. Its a shame that they couldn't connect from Saul sooner as surely boats using the canal would bring in more money. Also as the center of stroud is looking very good alot of people seem to think the canal is nearly fininshed.
Oh well, at least then they are aware of the task ahead. That is a good start.
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I'd have liked to attend the festival but sadly work commitments made it impossible. I really must find the time to have a look at the restoration progress, it seems to have come on in leaps and bounds since I was last there.
One thing that does worry me about the Cotswold Canals resoration is the missing railway bridge at Stonehouse Ocean. This doesn't feature in the first phase of the restoration but my experience from many years working in the railway industry is that it will be phenomenally difficult to get this reinstated. I think the Trust need to prepare themselves for years and years and years of often frustrating and fruitless negotiations with Network Rail who a) will be largely disinterested and b)will quote unfeasibly high costs for the job which will be constantly revised upwards. If this is not tackled now then I can see this bridge still holding up the restoration ten or twenty years hence. Bypassing the M5 blockage will be a walk in the park compared to dealing with the railway!
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The tug at Union Canal Carriers is the RENNIE which I believe once operated on the Thames and River Wey. It was built by Pollocks of Faversham but has been much butchered in recent years.
Hope that helps.
Paul
Paul, thanks to your information I have found the tug listed on this excellent site: http://www.lighteragetugs.co.uk/MARITIME---ROTIFER.php so that one is now nicely tied up (if you'll excuse the pun). Many thanks indeed.
Roger
#16. Achilles converted into a motor by Roger Farrington in 2011 for his own use, I understand that the butty back end is now the front end of another modern hull.
Thanks - this ties in with what several people have said so I'll remove the picture to its proper place in the GUCCC section now. Much appreciated.
Roger
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For those who like to indulge in social media the Friends of Purton would like to announce that we now have a presence on Facebook and Twitter:
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/The-Friends-of-Purton/215088541944821
Twitter: search for @Frnds_of_Purton
You are very welcome to join us, "like" us on Facebook or follow us on Twitter.
Alternatively, our website can be found here: http://www.friendsofpurton.org.uk
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Once again I'd like to convey my thanks to the members of this forum for their generous help with boat identification for my embryonic website. Hopefully one day I will attain the necessary knowledge to identify myself more of the boats that I photograph. Let's just say I'm working on it and modest progress is being made!
Reading between the lines of my preamble, you may have correctly ascertained that I have another batch of identification-related questions :-)
My first enquiry relates to the vessels in the yard behind the Midland Chandlers premises at Braunston. There appears to be a wooden motor, a butty of some description and what looks like an ice boat of some sort. Can anyone provide names?
Secondly, and still at Braunston, I photographed this dredger a few days ago. There are no identifying markings but the hull looks as though it may have some history to it so can anyone enlighten me?
Thirdly, once again at Braunston, I spotted this rather lovely vessel.
I appreciate this one might be a bit of a long shot but can anyone help?
Finally, there are one or two other new ones in my Identification Parade on the site, so please do take a look: http://canalsidecamera.weebly.com/identification-parade.html
Many thanks in advance, Roger.
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Spotted this butty at Paddington Basin the day before yesterday. No visible name but the chines, as far as I could see them, appeared rounded and according to Jim Shead's listing the registration idenifies her as TAURUS:
http://rpmtest.weebly.com/page-2.html
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is No.16 former butty Achilles? which has recently been converted into a motor there?
Newbury used to run with "Meteor" which they sold to my parents via UCC in the early nineties, and then had "Newdigate" built.
Regards
Dan
I did wonder if it might be Achilles (or half of it at least). Sounds promising.
Thanks for all the other input as well.
Roger I notice in your album you have a section on FMC boats. If you are into collecting other people's photos, you might be interested in these. The two boats (hulls) were built side by side under the same order number by W J Yarwood of Northwich in 1929. Panther was delivered to Saltley for completion, whilst Python was taken to Uxbridge for fitting out. The photographs were taken on the first occasion since that time (as far a we know) that they were together, celebrating their eightieth year. Panther as can be seen is owned the Coventry Canal Society and is used regularly as a rubbish boat collecting same from the Coventry Canal. Python is in the hands of the Chesterfield Canal Society who use her as an educational craft.
I own the copyrite so feel free to use them or not as you wish. I have a bette picture of Panther if you want it.
Tony.
Thanks Tony, that's very kind. I would like to use a couple of them on the site.
Roger
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I wonder if Mark or Laurence could clear up a point? On the updated maps of the site the numbering of some of the boats has changed. I'm not clear if this denotes a change to the identification of those vessels or if the new numbering refers to a revised key to the boats on the site that hasn't been posted with the revised map. For example, wide boat "Alberta" is identified as number 26 on the original map, but on the revised one the same vessel is numbered 28 which is identified as "Mavis" on the original key. So is it still "Alberta" or has it subsequently been identified as "Mavis"? If the former, can we have a copy of the revised key?
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I've added a few more boats for identification. As before, any help would be much appreciated.
http://canalsidecamera.weebly.com/identification-parade.html
Roger
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I spent a wonderful half hour last night going through your photos, great stuff, especially the pictures in Jem's yard and the Severn Bridgd history.
Without seeing it for real it's difficult to have an opinion on the upside down boat, what's strange about the knees?
Thans Chris, glad you enjoyed the pictures.
I just thought the nearest knee looked to be bent at rather an acute angle, but it may just be an illusion caused by the angle of the shot.
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That's because it's upside down
Indeed, I'd clocked that, but the knees and the thickness of the planks seem a little strange too.
Roger
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I had the chance to have a quick look around the site at Harefield today. Some fascinating stuff there. I was particularly taken by "Alberta". Despite her ravaged condition with a mature tree growing through her bottom boards, I thought in some ways she was better preserved than what I am used to at Purton. In particular she seems to retain most of her shearing planks.
Some pictures of "Alberta" here:
Surprisingly, given the current drought, the water level appeared to be a little higher than was the case when some of the recent pictures on this thread were taken. The previously exposed ironwork of "Yardley" was beneath the surface.
Now, if you follow the track past "Alberta", on towards the Uxbridge direction, it swings back toward the canal and then runs parallel to it, at a slightly lower level as far as bridge 182. Alongside this last stretch are the remains of a few boats. They are a bit of a rum old collection and I assume that having become abandoned on the canal above, they were put over the side of the embankment by a grab dredger. Amongst the dross is the remains of a wooden vessel, which despite not looking like any wooden narrowboat I've ever seen, nevertheless looks interesting. Any ideas?
Picture here: http://rpmtest.weebly.com/
Roger
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I think you'll find that's both of them in their final embrace.
It seems a lot of fuss over nothing, they're not going anywhere, you wouldn't want to board them or dive near them as the only time you can get a boat near is when the tide is running. There's not much on them worth plundering or it would have been done years ago. Why bother to attach a load of bureaucracy to a couple of wrecks that will be visible for my lifetime at least.
You say that, but the wrecks have indeed been plundered, with several parts removed. Sadly this was done in 2010 when the 50th anniversary of the Severn Bridge disaster was being remembered, so personally I very much stand by the remarks made by Paul Barnett.
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As others have suggested, it is the historical nature of the vessels at Purton that make it so important. Schooners, a Bristol Dandy, a Kennet barge, trows, wych barges, stoudwater barges, FCBs and lots more. It is an awesome collection that has been badly neglected. It is true that virtually everything on site is beyond restoration, but what is important is that the remains are documented, recorded and protected from needless human destruction.
In case it might interest anyone, here is the one and only vessel at Purton that was not deliberately placed there for bank protection along with the story of how she ended up there:
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All 12 boats identified in the space of 24 hours! Thank you so much to eveyone who has helped. Now they are identified I'll be moving the pictures onto the appropriate pages on the site so the link in my original post will no longer be active, however the link to my working boats page is here:
http://canalsidecamera.weebly.com/working-narrowboats.html
Many thanks again to one and all.
Roger
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Photo number 1 is Ricky motor boat Umbriel, Photo number 3 is big Woolwich motor Epsom, Photo number 6 is big Woolwich pair Darley and Alperton, photo number 7 is Big Northwich motor Otley and little Woolwich butty Moon, photo number 10 is an ex Bantock BCN day boat that has been converted to a motor boat, originally it would have had a number and not a name, Photo number 11 is the back end of a W J Yarwood & Sons station boat used for a bow section and I think it is called Heron.
Blossom! Thanks mate. You helped me loads on the old site which I lost. Many thanks once again!
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This might not be the right area of the forum for such a topic. If so apologies to the forum moderators - please do move the thread to the right place.
I just thought it might be nice to share one or two pictures of hire boat holidays in the 1970's and 80's. This was certainly my introduction to the inland waterways and I guess that might apply to some other forum members. My first canal holliday was in the early 1970s when I was little more than a toddler. The boat was "Blyth" from Halcyon Cruisers of Lower Heyford. On a break from work I popped into the shop at Tooley's Yard in Banbury a couple of days ago and, on display in the shop was the old sign from Halcyon Cruisers, a real blast from the past.
A couple of pictures from early boating days:
Tolladine Boat Company. These were really lovely boats - steel hulled but with wooden cabins. My parents owned one of the fleet, Glouceter Rose, under a sponorsship arrangement whereby Tolladine hired the boat out and we got a percentage of the profits. In order to preserve the viability of tha arrangement, we only got to use the boat out of season so my memories of "Gloucester Rose" are universally COLD! Much icebreaking around the BCN, but I'm glad we did it.
The second photo is here:
Twinram boats, based at Red Bull Basin and later at Longport Wharf, used boats built by David Piper which had remarkable buoyancy and handling abilities. They also sported an oddball series of names which reputedly referred to the nicknames of various members of staff. This particular boat was called "The Colonel" but there were others named "Red Boar", "Angry Bull", "Chums Waltz" and "Brass Straw". All of which was wonderfully idiosyncratic. Happy days...
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Number 4 is Guccco Town class motor Shirley owned by forum member NB Alton. The location is Hazlehurst/Denford on the Caldon Canal.
Tim
Thanks Tim. Great info. Is Fulbourne yours? I used a picture of her to head the working boats page:
http://canalsidecamera.weebly.com/working-narrowboats.html
#9 is Jackal and Hereford I believe owned by the Deuchars and based at Trent Lock, #11 is Heron, recently in the BW auctions and lying at Norbury.
HTH
Regards
Dan
Edit for spilling!
Great stuff. I thought #11 would be a long shot so really pleased for this identification :-)
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I wondered if this forum's working boat aficionados may be able to help identify the following boats:
http://canalsidecamera.weebly.com/identification-parade.html
Any help much appreciated.
On a related note, does anyone know the identity of the big ricky butty that has lain sunken for some years near Cropredy? Tooley's were keen on raising it and restoring it a few years ago but for whatever reason it has bever happened. BBC article here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/oxfordshire/6078776.stm
Cheers,
Roger
GUCCC Town Class Names
in History & Heritage
Posted
I've been doing a little research on the Town Class boat names and the theory that they were picked froma list of railway stations. This is intended to eventually form a page on my website but I thought I'd post it here first in case anyone is interested, wishes to add to it or pull it apart!
Although they were known as the as the town class, a casual glance at the list of GUCCC boat names reveals they are not consistent with this nomenclature. Instead we find a list of towns, cities, villages and even locations in London.
It has long been speculated that the boats were actually named after railway stations but there have always been a number of anomalies in the list that don’t appear to fit this theory. However having undertaken some research into this I now feel certain that the entire class were named after British (and in one case Irish) railway stations without exception.
I’m not going to go through the entire list of 172 boats because in the vast majority of cases the railway station inspiration for the name is obvious. What I will do is run through some of the more interesting, obscure or apparently anomalous ones.
161 boats in the fleet were named after British railway stations.
1 was named after a Northern Irish railway station (BELFAST).
10 boats were named after London Transport (Underground) stations: (ALDGATE, ALPERTON, ANGEL, BARNET, BAYSWATER, CHALFONT, CHESHAM, EDGEWARE, PINNER, RUISLIP).
In several cases the station name was abbreviated which has produced some of the apparent anomalies:
BADSEY: Littleton & Badsey (GWR)
BARNET: High Barnet (LT)
BATTERSEA: Battersea Park (SR)
BEAULIEU: Beaulieu Road (SR)
BOGNOR: Bognor Regis (SR)
CHALFONT: Chalfont & Latimer (LT/LNER)
HAWKESBURY: Hawkesbury Lane (LMS)
RAWDON: Apperley Bridge & Rawdon (LMS)
SOUTHAM: Southam & Long Itchington (LMS)
TADWORTH: Tadworth & Walton-on-Hill (SR)
TARPORLEY: Beeston Castle & Tarporley (LMS)
In some cases the abbreviation of the name makes it impossible to ascertain which station the boat was named after:
BELFAST: could be Belfast Great Victoria Street (GNR), Belfast Queens Quay (B&CDR) or Belfast York Road (NCC)
FENNY: could be either Fenny Compton (GWR & LMS) or Fenny Stratford (LMS)
HAMPSTEAD: could be either West Hampstead (LMS) or South Hampstead (LMS)
KEW: could be either Kew Bridge (SR & LMS) or Kew Gardens (LMS)
OULTON: could be either Oulton Broad North (LNER) or Oulton Broad South (LNER)
YEOVIL: could be either Yeovil Junction (SR) or Yeovil Pen Mill (SR)
There are five names in the list where the name could refer to either of two identically named stations in different parts of the country:
BARNHAM: Suffolk (LNER), Sussex (SR)
BELMONT: Middlesex (LMS), Surrey (SR)
HALTON: Lancashire (LMS), Cheshire (GWR/LMS Joint)
NORTON: Cheshire (GWR/LMS Joint), Yorkshire (LNER)
OAKLEY: Bedfordshire (LMS), Fife (LNER)
Finally there are the boats with mis-spelled names:
BILSTER: This is generally assumed to be a mis-spelling of BILSTON, which was a GWR station.
GLOSSOR: Presumably this was either supposed to be GLOSSOP (LNER) or GLOUCESTER (GWR & LMS).
BERKHAMPSTEAD: Antiquated spelling of BERKHAMSTED (LMS). It is possible the station still used the old spelling at the time the boat was named.
EDGEWARE: Mis-spelled with an extra E. There were actually two Edgware stations; the London Transport station which opened in 1923 and the LNER station which closed in 1939. I tend to think the boat was named after the LT station, but it is not possible to prove this.
FULBOURNE: Apparently mis-spelled with an extra E, but in fact although the village is called “Fulbourn”, the railway station always used the older spelling “Fulbourne”.
So whilst there are still questions regarding which precise station some of the boats were named after, there are no names in the list for which no corresponding railway station can be found. It seems likely that the GUCCC used a railway directory (Bradshaw?) to pick the town class names. They would have been better named as the station class boats, although it is probably a good thing that they weren’t as it would cause confusion with the LMS station boats.