harrybsmith

March 2

On 21/02/2024 at 01:03, john.k said:

I think you will have serious problems running a genset that big to power kitchen appliances ........... Listers are notorious for bore glazing if run light..........Running a prop should be enough power drain to load up the motor.

I agree, loading up the generator is a key concern, I'm contemplating all sorts of stuff from an electric shower (as well as a Paloma gas water heater for when the engine isn't running) to an electric towel rail to a bitcoin mine, all as switchable loads to ensure there's always some load on the Genny.

Insulation hasn't split, the only slight criticism of my method is it compresses the board on the inner face, which of course excludes the air from inside it, which makes it a bit less insulative

February 20

49 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Washing machines and kitchen units tend to have shorter lives than steel boat shells. Would be a good idea to plan in openings suitable for their eventual removal and replacement without cutting into the structure.

I totally agree, I can even get the engine out the doors with the flywheel housing removed, standard 60cm appliances go with no bother, it's just a lot easier with a boat on the hard to not have to lift them to nearly head height to get them on the stern

Also "when are you closing up the big hole in the back of your boat" seems to be the most frequently asked question in real life, and the answer is not for another couple of months yet

February 20

7 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I think you may need a new top bearing on the tiller!!!

And the rest! The stern is the only area that remains that's unrepaired, and it's atrocious. The tube the bearing sits on (rudder tube?) is seriously frilly and there's a big hole in front of the weed hatch. New uxter plate, a decent chunk of swim and counter repairs all planned, for now I'm making the best of a massive hole to get things like a washing machine and kitchen units in.

It really shows that boats tend to deteriorate pretty uniformly, I think the hole that sunk her originally was probably in the bow, but there's been at least 10 holes throughout the hull that all could have

February 19

On 12/02/2024 at 22:02, MtB said:

Yep, I've been pointing out for a while now that lots of Springers qualify as "historic" and ought to be admitted to the Braunston Show.

Currently registering my project with National Historic Ships (and might see whether HNBC are interested...)

If I had a silly amount of money i'd buy Mabel and Forget Me Not (which I believe are still for sale, keeping on topic) and return them to hotel boat guise, a "Frobisher" style narrowboat with horrible sildey plastic roof and a Taylors cruiser. All historically significant and not really preserved much

February 19

Well i'm frankly disappointed in you all... Not one guess at an engine.

Lister HR3 is the answer. I picked up this genset with 5 hours on the clock from a local farm after a chance chat with someone who worked there. The SR3 mentioned earlier in the thread is fully rebuilt now (and very shiny) so if anyone wants a reverse rotation SR with electric start then give me a shout, happy for it to go cheapish as it's no longer needed

In no way is it implied this was driven on the road with the engine in the back

The reason i've gone for the HR3 is because by having the generator it gives me absolutely buckets of power (25 KVA...) for running kit like a washing machine, allows me to offset the engine from the centreline of the boat by running a 3 phase motor to drive the prop and I have a rough idea to build a workshop butty after this, and being able to plug that into 3 phase would be mega.

To get it in was a bit of a game, step 1 was to cut a massive hole in the stern. Much of this needed replacement anyway and i've held off doing it for this reason

After that the Land Rover could be backed up some ramps to get it level with the counter

And the engine pulled off using a chain puller

Then craned down with an engine crane

In other news i've been distracted by painting other people's boats rather than my own...

(Wey & Arun Canal Trust's dredger float)

Still more to come

January 18

Paints and compatibility is a minefield, one of the next updates will contain some even more controversial stuff...

Ultimately the best thing would be to shotblast everything back aggresively, prime with an active primer and follow it up with a topcoat system, all while keeping the shell dry and preferably at 20 degrees c.

That simply isn't possible here, I can't remember the last time it was 20 degrees C and the only reason it isn't raining currently is because it's snowing!

Withams Zinc Phos primer is absolutely OK for use as a primer over Vactan, I do concede you're losing the active benefits of the zinc phos bit but as it's the only primer approved for use under their bilge paint then it's the best option here. As a test sample i've tried it without a rust converter and it performs less well

January 16

13 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Lister SR3 would be age appropriate, but that is mentioned earlier in the thread, so you have something else in mind? Sticking with air cooled (and noisy) or are you looking at water cooled?

Change one letter to make it bigger...

Will be noisy but will be good noisy, will usually be constant speed running too

January 16

10 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

But the Landy's MOT is nearly 10 years out of date! And not on trade plates either.

Registered historic as it's pre 1983 and currently taxed (and insured). It had a hiatus off the road to have lots of issues addressed a few years ago and is my daily driver now, the online MOT system doesn't always reflect historic exemptions (As a result I carry a photocopy of the V5 stating historic and the V112 with the exemption)

1 hour ago, Stilllearning said:

It's getting to the stage where I began wondering what engine you are going to use, or have you already decided?

Feel free to have a guess, it's era appropriate, 3 cylinder and not the one mentioned earlier in the thread

48 minutes ago, Bee said:

So you've got a 2CV, a landrover and a big boat project. Do you ever sleep? or eat? Really good work by the way.

Oh that's only the start, 2 jobs and a few other projects like to consume time too! Plenty of eating but not enough sleeping is the usual trend

January 15

Time for another update

So the idea is to get the front 1/2 of the boat liveable, while I finish off the last of the steel work on the stern, which allows me to spend a whole weekend there in relative comfort. Liveable to me, in this context, is dry, warm and able to be cleaned.

Dry has been achieved, able to be cleaned is possible now its painted, but warmth was lacking. suppose i'd better put some insulation in then...

I initially was dead set on sprayfoaming, however it isn't a DIY job (no matter what way you play it) and if you're getting someone in they really need to do the whole boat all at once for it to make financial sense, which isn't possible here, so I've gone for "Celotex" style boards. It gives a constant thickness of insulation which is nice, and I've bonded them to the hull with a generous amount of foam which hopefully leaves no gaps behind.

First job was to batten the roof. There's quite a lot of curvature to the roof so I wan't really happy using timber bent to suit and I had some nice scavenged plywood offcuts (not sure exactly what it is but it's got lots of layers and is very solid) so I chose to make the roof battens out of ply cut to size. Because it's nice ply it does hold screws on its edge

Templated one, cut them out, screwed and bonded them in.

Then time to insulate the roof. The total thickness of insulation I want on the topsides is 50mm, which on the roof is made up out of two 25mm sheets bonded together. To wedge them in place I made props which force them into shape while the adhesive foam dries.

Done! Reassuringly there was plenty of squeeze out from the foam, which shows its worked its way throughout the rear of the insulation.

Cabin sides next, which were a tad simpler than the roof as they are flat 50mm sections, although I appear to not have taken a photo of them done, which is weird...

Another thing to achieve liveability was to stick some doors on the front, so I drew a set up on CAD, produced some nice engineering drawings and comissioned a local company with a CNC plasma to knock a couple of sets up. Did they fit? Did they heck, too big. Quick measure and they were bent wrong, so I had to trim the sides off and re-weld them. Quite annoying but now rectified.

Here they are fitted temporarily

Still nowhere near up to date, so plenty more to come with more progress being made every weekend

December 14, 2023

39 minutes ago, Barneyp said:

Really impressed with the progress.

Did you seal the exposed edges of the plywood after you cut it? The edges are the weak point of plywood, unsealed/coated edges will suck in any available moisture causing the individual layers to swell and split the board apart.

I did, and they'll receive more coats when the floor gets lifted to ballast the shell

December 13, 2023

1 hour ago, David Mack said:

There's not much room for any bilge water to flow past the ends of those angles. I would have cut them at 45 degrees or flatter to leave a bigger gap.

Are you mounting the plywood floor directly to the angles or are you putting timber between? Providing longitudinal timber bearers will allow airflow under the floor whereas putting transverse bearers on top of the angles (or having no bearers) will result in a series of separate spaces with poor underfloor ventilation.

There is a fair bit of room for water to get past, I can get a finger between the hull side and crossmember on each of them

Not planning to put timbers but thin ish (6mm or so) rubber pads on the crossmembers and longitudinals, which I hope should thermally isolate the floor from the hull as well as provide a bit of an air gap

December 12, 2023

2 hours ago, MtB said:

I have one of these exact stoves in one of my boats. While it works passably well, everything about it screams "CHEAP".

Which seeing the Robert Dias price, it is. For a stove costing just £279 retail I'd say it is excellent value for money and a far better 'poor man's Squirrel' than the Boatman Stove by Northern Fabrications.

Go on, I'll bite, what's wrong with a Boatman stove in your eyes? No riddler?

December 12, 2023

On 30/11/2023 at 16:04, magnetman said:

It seems odd for a brand ending in -inox to be doing ceramic sinks..

Inox is short for inoxydable which is French for stainless (unoxydisable).

Aye but you want to try buying a bus off Airbus, the No 19 route has never been completed so quickly

December 12, 2023

Let's fill in the timeline and get this thread up to date

So after the tug deck was fitted and welded into place the drains were added (as was mentioned above). I opted for 1" tubing mitred to suit the angles of the gunwhale and tug deck edge respectively then welded in. Here's the only photo I currently have of one which was while I was tidying up the edge of it with a die grinder so doesn't really show you much

After that the guard irons could then be reinstated. My method for doing this was to tack a piece of angle iron to the hull side, then balance one end of the strip on that while holding the other in position by hand and tack it at that end. All being well you can then go back along the elngth, tacking it then weld fully. They will be fully welded top and bottom but I'm going to fetch my MIG back to the boat to do underneath and that's currently tied up sticking my 2CV back together...

(That's my Dad in the backround, really not sure why he's pulling that face?)

Window holes were then cut and the double glazed windows shown earlier were then plonked in. They're actually still not fully attached but they will be held in with stainless self tappers. Not usually a fan of stainless screws but they are the most appropriate thing here

To get the guard irons to conform to the shape of the bow requires them to twist, which requires a fair amount of force. Here's boatbuilding special tool No 147, a big spanner with a scaff bar attached.

Which gives a result as shown here

Meanwhile, inside the boat, it was time to start rust converting and get some paint down. Everthing fresh steel was given an aggressive going over with an 80 grit disc in a DA sander, then a decent coating of Vactan, then Zinc Phosphate primer, then green bilge paint. Here's some excerpts

Painting at night under the bow. Note the hull side on the left in rust convertor

Baseplate in first coat of primer

The floor crossmembers mentioned earlier were also painted in bilge green before being welded into place. Note the gaps at their edges to allow water to drain past, and the reinforcing struts in the top right that span between them

Where the paint was affected by welding it was then touched in and everything given another coat

Before laying it the marine plywood floor was slathered in yacht varnish as I really don't want to end up replacing it

And then it was cut up and placed down on the floor crossmembers, and the cabin top and sides given a de-rusting and a paint too.

All of this interior work focuses on the front half of the cabin, the rear isn't being addressed just yet in the story.

The astute amongst you will notice no mention of ballasting. Not because i've forgotten, simply because this floor is just being put down temporarily to give me somewhere to live while i'm at the boat (and has been a huge help in that). There's still a bit of hull work to do at the stern, and I'm keen to do a floatation test as soon as possible so the floor will be lifted and the boat ballasted prior to that

More to update, but I bet that generates enough questions on its own!

December 11, 2023

Ultimately it's my boat, and I'm building it for me, in line with the applicable regs. I can't see it being for sale for quite a while nor used as a trip/hire boat so I'm not overly concerned, although it it all good to bear in mind.

I can get out the front hatch without an issue, it's not going to be my main entrance but doesn't pose an issue.

I've thought about break glass hammers etc, but the windows I've fitted are double glazed so I'm not sure how successful they would be and I'm really not planning to check!

December 11, 2023

4 hours ago, Stroudwater1 said:

Missed the last instalment it’s looking really good. Presumably you are intending to cut out a hatch in the front cabin roof to facilitate getting out?

I imagine there’s to be some good drainage holes at each corner by the front decks, and a lip on the front entrance to avoid a fair amount of rain ingress. Is anything going under the tug deck?

Ooh, thanks for waking up this thread, MANY updates since the last one I need to write up

No hatch at the front but a side hatch being cut about ⅓ the way down the cabin (like a Canaltime South West Durham built shell) and this hatch is big enough for emergency egress (as per BSS)

Drain channels and lip in, it's totally dry now

Bedroom under the tug deck (allows all the width to be used and is cosy)

November 23, 2023

On 21/11/2023 at 11:38, David Mack said:

Why on the reverse side? If you have a curved surface on a boat it is going to be concave seen from the inside. So scoring the back will result in narrow voids opening up in the back face. If you cut narrow slits, or better v-grooves the inside face these will close up when you curve the sheet, and after the sheets have been bonded to the shell you can tape over the slits using the same metallised tape you use to endure a continuous vapour barrier over board joints.

I foamed the rear of the boards so hopefully voids were filled by that, and they supported themselves better cut on the rear with the way I propped them

I see both sides of the coin, probably for a few remaining tighter bits I will notch the inside of the board, see how it goes

November 23, 2023

CRT are reasonably toothless when it comes to vehicles on their moorings.

I used to moor at a certain residential mooring site in central Birmingham run by them, there was all sorts of stuff in the car park that shouldn't have been there and for the most part was fine. Caravans caused an issue but never anything self propelled. What do your neighbours think? If they're aggrieved I'd move it, if they're not I'd probably stick it out

November 21, 2023

I've just Celotexed much of the inside of my shell, process was (cabin top and sides):

-Scrape off loose rust, scuff over with a disc sander

-Vactan

-Zinc Phos primer

-Paint with any old exterior gloss I had, great way of using up odds and ends

-Batten sides to allow lining to be fitted later

-Cut Celotex to size and score reverse side with a Stanley blade

-Gun on this stuff to back of Celotex

(https://www.selcobw.com/bond-it-mega-foam)

-Apply pressure from a bit of 4*2 cut to length, leave it 15 mins, do the next bit

A full write up will eventually happen on my build thread, I promise...

November 16, 2023

Many people make a bilge paint, Withams being my preferred one, seems really good quality and is immersion rated

November 16, 2023

I had one on my last boat, it was a fiberglass boat so I had an insulated flue, into a silicone collar thing and the whole lot finished about 6" above roof level. I then fabricated a removable tapered (didn't need to be as tapered as it was, looked silly) chimney to sit on top.

On my current boat I've welded the chimney collar level on a little plinth, seems to work*, which personally is the way I'd go here, but a silicone one would get you through winter. Consider using a PU sealant rather than a silicone to stick it down as painting over silicone residue in the future is a nightmare

*Really should update my build thread....

November 8, 2023

On 07/11/2023 at 13:31, Crewcut said:

A Highbridge 32 might, just might, suit a single hardy, tidy, minimalist liveaboard but it would need additional insulation or would be a nightmare in the winter months. I have seen them with stoves fitted though, even one where the large windows had been removed, the whole area fibreglassed and then portholes added - much less window area so reducing condensation...

I lived aboard my Highbridge 32 for 6 years, some additional insulation and a Boatman stove made it cosy enough, the main drawback was the windows being huuuuge, and the standing height inside once insulated.

As a point of utter pedantry, I bet you haven't seen a Highbridge with portholes as Leviathan (relatively widely published and nicely done) was actually a fake Highbridge not made by the original builder (Bob Smith). I had the pleasure of chatting to him at some length about how they were designed etc.

So yeah, in answer to the original question GRP cruisers are a good option, once my current boat build is on the water I'm planning to get something trailable (Highbridge 23 would be ideal but good luck finding one) and use that to go cruising with as 4hrs on a trailer gets you to very different parts of the network. Go and look at some, see whether you like his they feel.

October 21, 2023

I got to know the owner of Hermitage relatively well about 6 years ago as I bought my boat off him and lived in his back garden for 2 months. Interesting place, I'd moor there without concerns.

"Stayalot" is their code word for live aboard

October 21, 2023

1 hour ago, matty40s said:

Above Barrow Deep, or Birstall??

I have saved more than a few boats there when moored in the area!!

Barrow Deep on the CRT winter mooring, we spoke at the time (still very grateful for you alerting me to it), I believe you may have been part of moving the sunken boat to Sileby Mill? 2017/18 would make sense.

Mine was the yellow and orange Highbridge cruiser

October 21, 2023

Haven Knox- Johnson seemed pretty reasonable about this sort of thing, I had a very good read of my policy after a near miss on the Soar a few years ago (was absent from the boat for Christmas, moored on a canalised section, river levels rose rapidly, boat next door sunk due to ropes too tight, I just got away with it, lesson learned!)

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