GILow

Good tips thank you. I must say, I kind of envy someone who makes a living delivering canal boats. I am sure it is not all sunny days of rumbling along the canal, but there are worse ways to spend the working day. I am still not good enough at the geography of the UK to understand how various mooring locations might fit in with our travel plans, and of course our travel plans will be dictated, in part, by the location of the boat we end up buying and whether, as you suggest, we make use of a delivery skipper. Thankfully my wife is a London girl so she will know how it all relates. What I can say, if it makes others here feel any better, is that the cost of keeping a narrowboat at a mooring appears to be less than half the cost of keeping a similar sized sailing boat in Australia, even allowing for exchange rates and relative costs of living. Matt

Thanks Loafer, it is a bit of a home away from home, but as my wife would point out, you don't get sea sick on a canal boat, which is not always the case for the eloquently named "rag and stick" boats. Currently looking at doing the grand circle in two instalments, the first over three months, the second over whatever time we can scrape together for that holiday. Then if time and inclination permits, we would toss in some side journeys along the way. Both of my outlaw inlaw branches of the family would be keen to use the boat while we are away, so that makes the buying idea much more appealing. My only question so far, and I have not had a look to see if this has been answered, is if we are doing a big loop, how hard is it to arrange a longer term mooring at relatively short notice (say a couple of weeks). I would like to remain flexible with our journey, and having to pre plan the winter storage of the boat would take away some of that flexibility. Matt

Er... yes... that too.

Let's see if I have this right... It seems the smartest option is to start looking at boats in the sub 47 foot range (to keep our travel options open), but closer to that end of the scale in size (mainly to make resale easier, but also to have a bit more living space), and plan to keep the boat for two years at the maximum, probably more like one year and a half (which equates to one initial three month visit, plus another return visit a year later), plus whatever it takes in time to sell the boat. I will certainly follow up the various suggestions on purchasing ex hire boats etc, and come back to check my assumptions over time. Taking this logic I will now start looking harder at all of the lovely charts/books we purchased on our last trip (or are they called maps when dealing with canals?) to see if we can make a sensible plan with options for a minor circumnavigation (correct term?). One thing we learned from the last trip was that a loop would have been nicer than returning along the same path. We had originally planned a small loop but flooding had closed one section of the proposed route, (near Stratford Upon Avon) so that option had to be abandoned. I assume we will end up with the boat some significant distance from where we started after the first three month instalment, and clearly where we start will be, at least in part, dictated by the location of the boat when we buy it, so I will start the route planning with this in mind. Thank you all for your advice, it feels a lot less daunting knowing people are so willing to share their experience and wisdom when tackling a project like this. Matt

Yes, I sure can relate to that, I am often dashing down to the marina when the strong winds hit to see if I still have a boat.

Oops, I feel silly.

Sorry, newbie parlance question here... CWDF... Canal World Forum...? Are you saying members here would be willing/able to act as a spotters? Matt Ha ha, I just read this carefully! That made me smile. After nearly 30 days over 40 degrees this summer at home, that sounds quite attractive to us. Matt

RIGHT, if we buy, I'll be tough... er.. at least I'll try. To be honest, I reckon I am crap at negotiations. Shouldn't play poker, just don't have the unreadable demeanour. If it is anything like buying boats in Oz, usually the eventual purchase price ends up around two thirds of the advertised price... but I don't seriously expect anyone to confirm or deny that one. Matt Matt

Just mixing it up a little more, my wife asks the sensible question... what if we kept the boat for a year or two and had multiple holidays? Then family in the UK could use it while we are back in Oz and we could get a bit more use from the boat for the effort involved in buying and selling... I will look at the costs associated with storing the boat when not in use, bound to be some pointers on this forum. Matt

Hmmm, must be an Aussie perspective thing... but I can't imagine anyone trying to pinch our boat. Most of the yacht clubs have absolutely token security, there's practically nothing to stop you walking aboard a boat of your choice and sailing away, except for the fact that there's nowhere to hide once you are under way. But interesting point about people's concerns about boat swapping. Funnily enough, from our perspective I would have thought the sailing boat was a much more daunting proposition than a canal boat. After all, we got a five minute introduction to the canal hire boat, just explaining where the various bits of plumbing were, how to tell if the toilet tank needed emptying and how to clear the propeller. Mind you, some of the rental boats were being driven into the sides of the locks, and into each other... so maybe I can understand the concern for the boat owners. I certainly would worry about renting mine out if I owned one. Matt

Well thank you all again, I will contact the suggested hire firms, some do look promising, but it does seem my idea of buying makes more sense than I first thought. Good point about the bigger boat being easier to sell later too. Overall, I suspect we will need to buy simply to have the flexibility to travel where we want to, when we want to. I don't want to appear a wimp, but the thought of winter on the Canals does not entirely appeal. We came over in Spring last time and it was terrific. Plenty of water in the canals, which I gather can be a problem in summer, and not too many boats under way at once, which I could imagine would make things less relaxing. Finally, one thought has struck me from a comment made early on: There might be people looking to do some kind of swap deal, which could work well for all parties. The boat owner gets a holiday by the beach in Australia with a blue water sailing boat included and we get a holiday on the canals in the UK. Not sure if that is against the rules but I assume if no money changed hands and the insurance issues could all be sorted out it would work? Matt Sorry, I just have to say, great login name, our last boat was called Haggis.

VERY promising, thank you. Thank you, that's good to know. I didn't realise the boats could be that big and still compatible with the majority of the canals.

Thank you all, much to digest there... We hired a 60 footer last time, and it seemed enormous to us. I agree that our sailing boat is much beamier, but it's also pointy at the ends (canoe stern), so we lose the first and last 6 feet from each end. Still, point taken, I will go with the experts on size, sounds like 30 - 35 might be something we would regret. I gather a 45 footer would not limit our options much on which bits of the canal we could visit? Matt An agreed buyback would be a dream come true, if the price was right, but I can't imagine anyone offering that... still worth checking, I will ask the brokers when I am talking to them. I am resigned to the fact that if we buy we will be selling in a weak position, but we have lots of family in England who might be able to assist. I have no idea of the ongoing storage costs while waiting for the boat to sell, so much more research for me to do. Anyway, at least it SOUNDS like I am not missing something obvious in the way of long term rentals, so it is worth doing more work on the numbers involved in buying and reselling. Thank you all for the pointers so far. Matt

Hello, newbie poster from Australia with a question about longer term boat hire. My wife, who is English, suggested we should look at spending three months on the canal system as part of our long service leave, due in a year or two. This would work well as we both love boats, we could catch up with relatives, and we have previously hired a canal boat and we loved the experience. As yet we have not worked out which parts we would like to visit over that time, or at what time of year, but one significant factor will be whether we can hire a boat at a reasonable rate for that period, or if we would be better off buying something and selling it afterwards. We have spent two weeks on a hire boat on the canals near Stratford Upon Avon a few years ago, so we have a bit of experience to base out boat requirements on. We also have an old but comfortable blue water cruising boat at home, so living on boats is something we are comfortable with and we know how to live without lots of STUFF. We are also both very capable of performing repairs and maintenance as we go (old blue water boats need a LOT of that), and one reason we would consider buying a boat is that the boat we hired for our last holiday had a list of niggling faults that we would have fixed had it been our boat, not a hire boat. From this we think a 30 - 35 footer would be more than adequate for us (a fit middle aged couple travelling without the children) So with this in mind, I would love to know whether people can recommend a hire company that might specialise in smaller long term hire boats (I have looked but have not found anyone yet, but part of the problem I face is that I suspect I do not yet understand some of the terminology around the boats in general) or whether we should consider buying a boat for the duration. If the latter, a pointer to calculating the buying and selling costs would be very helpful. Finally, I apologise if this has been asked and answered before, but with my limited grasp of the language of the canals, I have not been able to find an answer to this sort of question so far. Matt