Bristolfashion
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Posts posted by Bristolfashion
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Just to complete this thread - and in case anyone else is looking for the same thing, we used Darrell Broscomb (dbmarinesurveyco.uk) and he was excellent. Darrell is based in Oxfordshire.
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We're just moving onto a narrow boat to do a few years of genuine, full-time cruising after doing similar on yachts. As part of the process, we've checked out all the rules, costs and options. It's not really that hard.
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Hi all, well, it's getting exciting - having sold the yacht, we've now made an offer on a narrow boat. We now need a surveyor. The suggested list from the marina is,
Wilkinson Marine Surveys - Paul Wilkinson
DB Marine Survey - Darrell Brosomb
Butcher Marine Surveys - Nick Butcher
Aft To Bow Marine Surveys - Tony Nother
I'd love to know if any forum members have used any of these surveyors (or any other surveyor covering this South of London area) and would recommend them.
As ever, thank you very much in advance for any advice given.
Cheers and, hopefully, see you on the water soon!
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I noticed the comment above that poor boat handling was one of the prime causes of sinking.
In Australia, to use a powered boat, I had to pass my boat licence - a basic theory test checking knowledge of the rules and then a short on water test.
Perhaps it's time to introduce a basic boat licence for the inland waterways?
To avoid the inevitable squeaking, I'd suggest a "grandfathering" process. Current boaters simply fill in a form outlining experience, qualifications and training and, unless they have none of the above, get a licence. New boaters have to pass the qualifications in order to be in control of a boat so, over time, standards should improve.
Licence holders would be able to supervise new boaters.
Of course, the UK has traditionally resisted any training requirements in these areas - to take our yacht around Britain & Ireland required precisely no qualifications!
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15 minutes ago, jonathanA said:
from a BSS point of view - your understanding is wrong or the source your using is...
if you look back up the thread there is clarification of the BSS requirements and what fusing is /is not needed
Er, I think I was rubbish at explaining what I meant - 3.6.1 requires isolators, 3.6.2 makes certain exceptions, allowing direct connection to the battery, where a suitable fuse or circuit breaker must be fitted. D'oh!
3.5.3 requires that battery charging devices connected directly to the battery are fuse / circuit breaker protected. Excludes engine driven alternators.
Fortunately, my wiring up appears to be better than my writing as I've just had an installation inspected against this standard without any changes required - except that one piece of equipment was marked as non operational by the examiner. I wasn't there at the time, but when the purchaser queried this with me, I pointed out & then engaged the large, clearly marked circuit breaker on the obvious switchboard and, bingo, the equipment is now operational (this piece of equipment was defined by the manufacturer as requiring direct battery connection
I was also just wondering whether going "above & beyond" would be ok. I was thinking of a situation where family, hirers or friends borrowing the boat were rubbish at ever turning off the isolators - would fitting a suitably sized fuse to a supply even though going through an isolator, provide extra protection & be BSS acceptable - I can't see why not? I know some yachties do this.
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It is my understanding that every wire coming from the positive terminal of the battery bank should have a fuse rated to protect the wire (except a heavy duty connection to crank an engine). This fuse should be as close as practical to the battery.
If there is a change to a lower rated wire at some point in the circuit, then a lower rated fuse may be needed.
Every device should have a fuse rated to protect that device (invariably specified by the manufacturer) either in a switch board / panel or in the wire. For lighting circuits & similar a load calculation and installation of a fuse slightly higher than normal load (but still low enough to protect the wire) would be used.
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The pontoons are quite short - our local online magazine suggested that they are designed for boats up to 10m, which rules out a lot of canal boats. I'd assumed that this was for navigation reasons (they stick out into the harbour) - and, possibly, they were going to have a shuffle around to optimise mooring around the harbour.
Anyway, getting a few more moorings into the harbour is a good idea - let's hope the boats are used a bit to add to the life of the place - I watched a narrow boat & a wide beam chugging up the harbour the other day and a bit of boat movement adds some colour to the place.
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12 hours ago, David Mack said:
Be aware that if you have paid a deposit to a broker or boatyard the contract will state specific conditions when you can back out of the purchase and get your deposit back. Just changing your mind because of a somewhat negative survey is not always sufficient grounds.
Yes, a good point, thank you.
I would, have, thought, however, that a plate that was advertised at 10mm, but is approaching 4mm would be adequate to withdraw (yes, I know all the broker caveats about their "details"), but I'll make sure I'm fully across the contractual details.
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I've worked on nature reserves carrying out tree / woodland management and it's rewarding and popular - especially if you can tie it in with providing materials for woodland crafts / charcoal burning / bean poles / firewood / hedging materials etc.
However, it can be dangerous, requires some skilled supervision and would be more difficult due to the water nearby & constant public access. It wouldn't be impossible, but a well organised & trained volunteer group would be needed.
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We are embarking upon our first narrow boat purchase (the yacht is sold, so we are in a watery worry free zone for the first time in years!).
We'll be looking for a boat in decent condition, not a project (the project is to go boating!)
Now, broker's details often quote the steel thickness as 10/6/4 or 10/6/5/4, but this is presumably just the original manufacturer's specification. I appreciate that one should have a good old poke about to spot obvious problems, but there's no way of being sure about thicknesses in water and without a survey.
A survey will probably come up with some other, lower numbers. My question is what are your ranges for,
1. That's fine,
2. That's very minor, but is worth a few quid off
3. That's minor, but some work needs to be done by the vendor (or an equivalent cash reduction) before purchase.
4. Run away - and give me my deposit back.
I'm aware of the 4mm for insurance issue. I'd have thought that a surveyors recommendation to overplate (on a decent boat) would be option 4.
As ever, thank you for reading and for any advice given. I hope not to disprove the adage, "there's no such thing as a stupid question" during this process.
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There are a couple of wide beams in Cardiff Bay - now that's a limited cruising area.
At least one came down from Sharpness - the mind boggles!
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The use of HVOs (which claim a 90% reduction in CO2) is certainly an interesting development for "greening" the diesel engine.
One of the problems of deciding how green the lifestyle is is comparing like for like. How do we include transport, holidays etc as well as the usual gas,diesel & electricity? Do we, as a couple, compare ourselves to the average UK household, the average UK 2 person household or some theoretical lifestyle that we'd live in a house?
I wonder if, in highly populated areas concerned about pollutants, more compulsory shore power is an answer - we're moored in the centre of a city with pollution issues and a ULEZ zone, it would seem churlish to run a diesel engine or a wood burner as there is shore power available.
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On 11/04/2024 at 19:46, David Mack said:
What are theses "non essentials" and how much money could be redirected as you suggest?
Yes, this sort of thing is often used to beat an organisation around the head with - but what are they and, equally importantly, are they of any financial significance?
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1 minute ago, Ronaldo47 said:
My understanding is that, because road tax is not hypothecated, motorists pay more in road tax than the government spends on roads, so motorists subsidise general taxation. Even if my understanding about riad tax is not correct, I believe that it is certainly so if what motorists pay in fuel duty is included.
I think you're missing the point - we all pay various forms of tax, which goes into a big pot from which government provides services - such as roads. The more tax you pay, irrespective of the type of tax, the more you contribute to each head of expenditure.
Of course, many motorists don't have to pay VED anyway,
https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-exempt-from-vehicle-tax
It is expects that around 10,000 will be added to the exempt list under the historic car (I E. Old banger) exemption.
And, of course, not everyone pays it when they should
"Statistics published by the Department for Transport shows an estimated 719,000 vehicles are being used despite their vehicle excise duty (VED) not being paid."
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32 minutes ago, MtB said:
Whatever next? Motorists paying for upkeep of the roads, I bet!
Um, motorists don't pay for the upkeep of the roads - tax is not hypothecated in the UK, so those that pay more tax pay more for road upkeep even if they don't have a vehicle.
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4 hours ago, magnetman said:
He's got a sea going boat
Having said that I have seen standard wide bean canal Boats in Ramsgit harbour and also at on the Hamble near Southampton, Tollesbury I am sure there are others. Newhaven.
There are a couple in Cardiff bay as well.
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17 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:
The only things really worth buying are things you use regularly. Ignoring food and fuel, that leaves books, trombones, melodeons and guitars. Everything else is just keeping the economy going so rich people can get richer.
But once you've got a King 2B, a Conn 88H and a pBone, what more do you need?
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13 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:
Must have been built in a yard.
Drum roll .... Cymbal crash!
Boom boom!
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Just now, magnetman said:
Our yacht was built in Southampton by C&N.
So, its in feet - but never yards.
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8 hours ago, magnetman said:
This is England. Metrication has not fully taken over.
Or has it ?
My trains still travel in MPH.
Yes, but many boats are made in Europe where they tend to use metres.
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12 hours ago, magnetman said:
Indeed. Feet? That seems a little on the small side we usually measure our Boats in yards.
The French based yacht is 39 yards at the waterline. I agree the salt water is a terrible nuisance but needs must if one wants to recuprate in the med rather than at the country estate.
I feel it is wise to have a number of different options in this regard.
Steel Boats are generally alright if maintained well.
I'm not entirely sure that you own a yacht if you think they are measured in yards! Even whoppers are measured in feet - it's often included in the name - Sadler 29, Fisher 34, Oceania 60 etc.
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1 hour ago, Riverdee said:
Maybe thats a good thing? Then perhaps the cyclists will start contributing?!
Didn't there used to be a permit of some sort for cycling on the towpath? I've got some dim memory of it. Personally (as a keen cyclist) I'm in favour of the idea - perhaps the cycling organisations / insurers could negotiate a bulk discount and then include it in their membership/policy? I also pay a monthly donation to CRT, perhaps that could include the cycle permit (if at least a certain number of quids).
1 hour ago, magnetman said:More likely they will take control of the land over time and put the canal at risk by demanding more space for their highways.
I doubt a cyclist will ever in the history of the world give a penny to the CRT unless they are also a Boat owner.
Ahem, I'm a cyclist - I'd very happily pay for a permit AND I already make a monthly donation.
7 minutes ago, magnetman said:Oh yes the superyacht we have in St Tropez is indeed quite expensive to run. I suppose it would be better if one were to charter it but who would want all those other people on it ?
It's alright for some!
We've got a modest 28 ½', 40 year old yacht in UK waters - salt water bears the hell out of equipment, you need much more gear & safety equipment and the consequences of equipment/maintenance failure are, generally, rather more serious!
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5 hours ago, magnetman said:
Well it makes sense if the aim is to retain canals in working order.
Obviously the answer is regional tolls based on demand.
It would be quite funny to watch all the people who thought they wanted to live on a Boat in London suddenly shifting to Hemel Hempstead which then gets a demand spike.
I sometimes wonder if sailing around the world in a sloop may in fact be the answer.
When I finally get my enormous pecuniary legacy from the contested Will I am going to look into it..
If you think canal boating is expensive, wait till you try a yacht!
3 hours ago, beerbeerbeerbeerbeer said:they could apply for a loyalty card and the more miles they walk the more points they get,
and these points could be spent at Morrison’s, on groceries, booze or petrol 👍
Like most of these things, a "single ticket" might be a quid, but an annual pass on direct debit might only be £25.
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I'm waiting for a "Eureka" moment!
Surveyor recommendation. Pyrford Marina
in General Boating
Posted
Thanks Tonka - having sold our little, 45 year old yacht, we were missing engine problems, blocked heads, frightening weather, inscrutable electrics and mysterious leaks. 😀
As to whether we're yet boat owners, watch this space!