Deck metal thickness

[Rory_d]

Hi,

 

does any body know what thickness the steel deck plates generally are?

 

mine is totally rotten away and covered with a couple of mm of fibreglass .

 

im trying to keep the boat as close to original as possible. I am going to order the steel tonight to I can chop the whole front out and weld in new.

 

unfortunately it’s that far gone I can’t use the thickness gauge on it

[mrsmelly]

20 minutes ago, Rory_d said:

Hi,

 

does any body know what thickness the steel deck plates generally are?

 

mine is totally rotten away and covered with a couple of mm of fibreglass .

 

im trying to keep the boat as close to original as possible. I am going to order the steel tonight to I can chop the whole front out and weld in new.

 

unfortunately it’s that far gone I can’t use the thickness gauge on it

They definately differ. I have had boats that nearly flexed and boats with very sturdy decks. Early boats were generaly lighter than recent stuff. I would use something you feel comfy to handle that will do the job. I am no fabricator but would 3 mil not be thick enough for a smallish area?

[Bee]

Unless it has to span a big unsupported area you should get away with 4mm. Others will suggest thicker but its tough old stuff steel

[Rory_d]

I’m going to cut the entire front deck out with the plasma cutter over the weekend and start replacing the box section framework. 

 

I want the boat to last a very long time so will weld a 5mm deck plate on.

 

just wasn’t sure if there was a standard size, 

 

thanlyou for your responses

[TheBiscuits]

Try and improve the drainage if the existing deck rotted away.

 

If it's the welldeck, consider a bit more angle for runoff and larger scuppers, and make sure you don't leave a standing seam that keeps water on the deck.

[ditchcrawler]

Did Springer go as thick as 5mm for anything?

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, ditchcrawler said:

Did Springer go as thick as 5mm for anything?

Yes.  Quarter inch plate was common on the larger, later ones - 6.35mm in new money.

[Rory_d]

35 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

Try and improve the drainage if the existing deck rotted away.

 

If it's the welldeck, consider a bit more angle for runoff and larger scuppers, and make sure you don't leave a standing seam that keeps water on the deck.

The drain holes are in the sides in line with the doors and are totally rotted away, I think the fiberglass liner was a factory adddition and where it had split near the doors the rain water has got underneath it and totally rotted the deck plate away which in turn now means the water is leaking into the boat and filling the bilges up! I hoovered 4 vax loads out of it this morning! After it being bone dry a couple of days ago. The main base plate under that section and about a foot into the cabin area has also rotted away from the inside out! 

 

Good thing I’m qualified in welding and fabrication!

[alan_fincher]

11 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

Did Springer go as thick as 5mm for anything?

Yes, regularly.

 

It's virtually the same thickness as the hull sides of one of our 1936 working boats are specified on the original Yarwood's drawings, (curiously as 4/20 of an inch), but we were surprised to find when she was being worked on that only some of it was 0.2" (5mm), and much of it was actually 0.25" (6mm).

Edited January 26, 2019 by alan_fincher

[Athy]

12 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

Did Springer go as thick as 5mm for anything?

Yes, that was their standard hull spec. for their regular boats in the 1980s.. I suppose the roofs would have been thinner to avoid top heaviness, so perhaps 5/5/3 was typical. If you paid them more, they'd build your boat with thicker plating.

Edited January 26, 2019 by Athy

[Alan de Enfield]

2 minutes ago, Athy said:

Yes, that was their standard hull spec. for their regular boats in the 1980s.. I suppose the roofs would have been thinner to avoid top heaviness, so perhaps 5/5/3 was typical. If you paid them more, they'd build your boat with thicker plating.

 

Source : "Waterfront"

 

Even in the seemingly egalitarian world of boaters, there’s a social pecking order and this is rarely more pronounced than where Springer boats are concerned. Springer was a company based in the Midlands that began mass-producing cheap and cheerful live-aboard narrowboats in the 1960s. While their affordability allowed countless people to join the boating lifestyle, the standard of their construction is sometimes, perhaps unfairly, questioned by the sniffier residents of converted working boats or higher-spec residential craft. But there’s still something hugely endearing about the Springer. These are boats made solidly and entirely without pretension, and as a consequence Springer boats have provided a friendly and affordable introduction to the canal network for thousands of boaters.

Sam Springer spotted the growing market for purpose-built live-aboard boats in the late 1960s when he was working as a steel fabricator making water tanks in Market Harborough, close to the Grand Union and River Welland. He decided to move into boat-building later claiming “I used to build water tanks, building boats is the same thing but in reverse”. Although his boats were well constructed, Springer had a reputation for using whatever steel was available, meaning that his hulls weren’t always as thick as they could have been. His approach can be summarised by the popular yarn that early in his career, Springer acquired some scrap steel that had once formed an old gasometer and drove back and forwards over it with a truck to remove the bend so it was flat enough to use. Because of such shortcuts, his boats were recognised as providing great value for money and his yard was soon knocking out 400 a year, accounting for almost 50 per cent of the market and at a much lower price than any competition.

Springer boats were built to all sizes but most have two distinguishing features: a raised splash board at the bow and, less visibly, a v-shaped hull rather than the usual flat bottom. They were also among the first boats to be built entirely out of steel rather than with a wooden cabin. Springers do have a tendency to look a little boxy, which does nothing for their reputation among waterways connoisseurs, but they are still lovable boats with a colourful history that, as the years have passed, has lent them a certain rakish charm. Belying their reputation, Springer boats also appear to be impressively hard-wearing with thousands still in use despite the fact the company closed down in the mid-1990s. And Springer boats aren’t just confined to the English waterways – in 1990, the boatyard built the Typhoo Atlantic Challenger, a 37-foot craft shaped like a bottle that crossed the Atlantic from New York to Falmouth. Not bad for a company whose first boats were made from a scrapped gasometer.

[GUMPY]

41 minutes ago, Athy said:

Yes, that was their standard hull spec. for their regular boats in the 1980s.. I suppose the roofs would have been thinner to avoid top heaviness, so perhaps 5/5/3 was typical. If you paid them more, they'd build your boat with thicker plating.

I beg to differ.

The two springers I have had the hulls were 3/16" plate or 4.76mm in new measurement.

Caused a big argument when a surveyor told a purchaser that boat had lost 0.25mm all over!

 

Edited January 26, 2019 by Loddon

[Athy]

There's not much difference!

I got the information from a specification in a mid-1980s Springer advert. Perhaps they just rounded up the imperial measurement to the nearest metric one. Or it may be that your Springers were earlier builds and were still measured in imperial. My Springer was a 1987 build (as far as was known) but I have no idea of the steel thickness. She felt very solid, though.

 

The "Water Bug" had 3/3/3 steel as standard.

[GUMPY]

One was 84, one was 87 both 3/16"

0.25mm makes a big difference when a "surveyor" picks up on it and says the boat has corroded !

[Rory_d]

Well I spent all day yesterday on the deck! I built a temporary cratch cover to keep it all dry and stop and rain water gushing in! 

 

I removed the fiberglass liner which I thought was a factory job to find it was actually a bodge job added at a later date! There were 2 big holes, one had a piece of thin metal loosely covering it and the other had a piece of ply !

 

heres some pictures of what I have found!

 

i am getting thickness readings under 2mm in the best places so I will cut the entire deck out and rebuild the lot with new steel,

 

the first picture is the fiberglass liner the rest are after it was all removed 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

I'm sorry to say but I think you have bought yourself a large dose of trouble and expense.

 

If one part of the boat is like that, what is the rest like ?

I hesitate to suggest it, but before spending much time and money on it, it may be worthwhile having a hull survey to determine the state of the rest of the metal.

 

A 'normal' boat is a 'hole in the water in which you pour money', but in this case I think that it will take money faster than you can burn £20 notes.

[Rory_d]

It’s not that bad, I’m a welder by trade and will order the steel through my business .

 

as for a hull survey the main hull is absolutely fine,

 

ive done thickness gauge readings all over, it’s literally just the front area under the deck which I will address as soon as the deck is all removed.

 

i only paid 5k for the boat so a grand of steel, and a few weeks worth of welding and fabrication should see it effectively a dam good boat

[Stilllearning]

It can be worth double checking the thickness in places like under the shower tray, baseplate just forward of the engine hole bulkhead.

[Rory_d]

I have tested the thicknesses throughout the entire boat, the lowest reading on the main hull was 4.7mm at the front under cabin area the lowest was 2.5 which busted straight through, so may end up replacing the base plate throughout but I am not a fan of overplaying,

 

having spent most of my working career doing classic car restoration I will literally cut out the bad and replace with new. Plus it looks a lot better.

 

i would imagine that the base plate would have been 6mm thick and the deck floor about 3mm.

 

i will replace the deck with 5mm, that should sort it for another 50 plus years done right

[BWM]

On 25/01/2019 at 19:52, Rory_d said:

Hi,

 

does any body know what thickness the steel deck plates generally are?

 

mine is totally rotten away and covered with a couple of mm of fibreglass .

 

im trying to keep the boat as close to original as possible. I am going to order the steel tonight to I can chop the whole front out and weld in new.

 

unfortunately it’s that far gone I can’t use the thickness gauge on it

 

On 25/01/2019 at 20:28, Rory_d said:

I’m going to cut the entire front deck out with the plasma cutter over the weekend and start replacing the box section framework. 

 

I want the boat to last a very long time so will weld a 5mm deck plate on.

 

just wasn’t sure if there was a standard size, 

 

thanlyou for your responses

Just curious, why did you ask about a suitable thickness of steel if you had settled on using 5mm anyway? Being a welder i'd imagine you would have a reasonable idea anyway.

 

[Rory_d]

I did have an idea, however I wanted to keep the boat as original as possible and due to the state of it I want able to get a good reading.

 

i was wondering if it was Common practice  to  use a certain gauge of steel or whatever was available at the time.

Edited January 27, 2019 by Rory_d

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, Stilllearning said:

It can be worth double checking the thickness in places like under the shower tray, baseplate just forward of the engine hole bulkhead.

I met a boater on his way to Streethay for some new plating on the hull side, the toilet tank had been leaking for a few years, it looked lovely on the outside, he had even repainted it all

[Rory_d]

The whole interior has been stripped out and ballast removed and readings taken from inside too. I was lucky in the respect that the readings are continuos through out as the bathroom was that full the water was at the height of the ply floor boards