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LED halogen replacement bulbs


jetzi

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Our lighting is mostly LED at 0.2A / 2.4W each, except for 3 halogen ceiling lamps at 1.67A / 20W. Since one of the halogens just blew I am thinking of replacing them with this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B077Z1T5DD

image.png.62e889596980af51e8615a814509d032.png

I don't see a name on the housing or the bulb for the type of fitting, but it looks exactly like the picture.


Is this "2-spike" halogen fitting standard or is it possible to buy the wrong thing?

 

These are 2W versus the 20W of the original halogens which sounds like a yummy saving. Does anyone have any experience with these or recommendations for or against? Any particular brand/model of halogen replacement bulbs you'd recommend?

Edited by ivan&alice
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3 minutes ago, Boater Sam said:

Aren't these LED?

The product is LED units that fit into the "2-spike" or "Bi-Pin" (I don't know what it's officially called) halogen fittings.

That way you can keep your halogen fittings but insert LED replacements and save 90% of the leccy. Similar to those fluorescent, LED and halogen bulbs they make in the bayonet incandescent bulb form factor, so you don't have to replace your household lighting.

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I suspect these are basically domestic bulbs that are designed to be driven by a 12V driver. As such they may not take too kindly to a boat's electrical system if it suffers any spikes as inductive loads turn on and off like the water pump. Very much suck it and see as long as they are cheap enough or fit a voltage stabiliser thing to their supply.

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1 hour ago, Boater Sam said:

They are "G" range, these look to be G4, 4mm between pins.  There are other sizes. G9 for instance.

Yep, my money is on G4 too - G9 are bigger and have little loops as the terminals. There are versions available for use on boat systems (where the voltage may rise to 14v + when charging the batteries) from places such as Bedazzled, but they cost a fair bit more.  Mine are now over 5 years old and none have failed.

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They are G4 

G9 are usually 240v 

 

G4 at 10 or 20W on 12v is quite common in desk lamps and kitchen cabinet down-lighters. 

 

The issue about stabilised versus unstabilised is much exaggerated on here IMHO, but so long as you are aware you can make your choice. 

 

I bought a cheapo LED one (CPC £1.50) for a fitting I have in a cupboard years ago and it’s fine that said it’s not on for hours and hours most times 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I suspect these are basically domestic bulbs that are designed to be driven by a 12V driver. As such they may not take too kindly to a boat's electrical system if it suffers any spikes as inductive loads turn on and off like the water pump. Very much suck it and see as long as they are cheap enough or fit a voltage stabiliser thing to their supply.

 

23 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Tony just beat me to it. At 4 for £7, I suspect they won't be voltage stabilisers, or filters for spikes in them. On a boat they may not last very long with the noisy and variable voltage.

 

Jen

 

Ah interesting. Yeah when certain pumps kick in (looking at you, shower waste pump) the halogens do tend to dim a little. But yes, they are pretty cheap, the ones I think I've settled on are a pound each (and the 5 pack gives me two spares).

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07DKYVDGY

Whoever installed the electrics was obviously of the opinion that it was OK for halogens. That said, I have blown one so far in the last 3 months! Are LEDs much more sensitive to voltage fluctuations?

Alternatively, I could buy and fit a voltage regulator to the lighting circuit - something like this perhaps?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B06Y52C65W

For now I'll get the 5 pack for a fiver, and if I lose two of them I'll install a regulator and I'll still have all my lights on.

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4 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

 

Ah interesting. Yeah when certain pumps kick in (looking at you, shower waste pump) the halogens do tend to dim a little. But yes, they are pretty cheap, the ones I think I've settled on are a pound each (and the 5 pack gives me two spares).
 

The dimming halogens isn't a symptom of voltage spikes, more likely to be elderly batteries. You won't notice the spikes, but they will damage unprotected LED's. The regulator you link to should provide protection, if it works as advertised. Always a risk with cheapo no-name stuff off The Big River web site, or Ebay.

 

Jen

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8 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

The dimming halogens isn't a symptom of voltage spikes, more likely to be elderly batteries. You won't notice the spikes, but they will damage unprotected LED's. The regulator you link to should provide protection, if it works as advertised. Always a risk with cheapo no-name stuff off The Big River web site, or Ebay.

 

Jen


The halogens dim slightly whenever high draw items kick in (e.g. drain pumps), even if the alternator is running. This has always been the case even when the battery was brand new. So it seems to me to be quite corellated with the voltage dip. Or perhaps as we have just 1 cheap 110Ah battery it can't push out enough current to run multiple things at once.

I don't know much about brands of this kind of equipment, just wanted to make sure I was on the right track with a 12V DC to 12V DC regulator. Could you recommend a regulator (or brand of regulator) that wouldn't be risking it? We run the whole boat off 12V so it might be worth it for us to get a large, efficient 12V DC regulator that we can use for our entire 12V circuit?

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3 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:


The halogens dim slightly whenever high draw items kick in (e.g. drain pumps), even if the alternator is running. This has always been the case even when the battery was brand new. So it seems to me to be quite corellated with the voltage dip. Or perhaps as we have just 1 cheap 110Ah battery it can't push out enough current to run multiple things at once.

I don't know much about brands of this kind of equipment, just wanted to make sure I was on the right track with a 12V DC to 12V DC regulator. Could you recommend a regulator (or brand of regulator) that wouldn't be risking it? We run the whole boat off 12V so it might be worth it for us to get a large, efficient 12V DC regulator that we can use for our entire 12V circuit?

You would just want a regulator for the lighting circuit, rather than the entire 12V system. Things like shower and water pumps generate the spikes that cause damage, so you don't want them on the same circuit as your LED's, downstream of the regulator.

Sorry, can't recommend a suitable one. LED's on my boat have built in regulators.

 

Jen

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1 hour ago, ivan&alice said:


The halogens dim slightly whenever high draw items kick in (e.g. drain pumps), even if the alternator is running. This has always been the case even when the battery was brand new. So it seems to me to be quite corellated with the voltage dip. Or perhaps as we have just 1 cheap 110Ah battery it can't push out enough current to run multiple things at once.

I don't know much about brands of this kind of equipment, just wanted to make sure I was on the right track with a 12V DC to 12V DC regulator. Could you recommend a regulator (or brand of regulator) that wouldn't be risking it? We run the whole boat off 12V so it might be worth it for us to get a large, efficient 12V DC regulator that we can use for our entire 12V circuit?

Its just the resistance of the wiring, the surge as the bulb comes on causes a small voltage drop. It won't happen with LEDs, too little current. Some of your lights wiring or connections are a bit slight.

Do you use the lights a lot when the engine is running? Otherwise it won't be a problem that they are unregulated.

So no cruising with cabin lights on and no battery charging when its dark, you shouldn't anyway!

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1 minute ago, Boater Sam said:

Its just the resistance of the wiring, the surge as the bulb comes on causes a small voltage drop. It won't happen with LEDs, too little current. Some of your lights wiring or connections are a bit slight.

Do you use the lights a lot when the engine is running? Otherwise it won't be a problem that they are unregulated.

So no cruising with cabin lights on and no battery charging when its dark, you shouldn't anyway!

3 sweeping statements

 

1 Volt drop on the entire boat not lighting circuits due to load of pump

2 Shore supply and battery charger

3 it dark at 4 pm in the winter months and you can run an engine while moored until 8 pm also it helps the misses not trip over when going through tunnels

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2 hours ago, Boater Sam said:

So no cruising with cabin lights on and no battery charging when its dark, you shouldn't anyway!

I don't know about you Sam, but my cabin lights go on when transiting tunnels where it's always dark - as a rule I'm also charging as my engine is on too! ;)

 

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33 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

I don't know about you Sam, but my cabin lights go on when transiting tunnels where it's always dark - as a rule I'm also charging as my engine is on too! ;)

 

 

Yup, that's what I do, and so do almost all boaters too.

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2 hours ago, Boater Sam said:

Its just the resistance of the wiring, the surge as the bulb comes on causes a small voltage drop. It won't happen with LEDs, too little current. Some of your lights wiring or connections are a bit slight.

Do you use the lights a lot when the engine is running? Otherwise it won't be a problem that they are unregulated.

So no cruising with cabin lights on and no battery charging when its dark, you shouldn't anyway!

Yes we do use the lights with the engine running, as @ditchcrawler points out it's dark early in winter so we use it to charge. When the engine is on we use the leccy liberally (including when cruising). We don't have any shore power or inverter power though as yet.

 

I've ordered the LED units (halogen replacements) and I won't try to be careful with them, at least until the first one or two failures. I'll report back if they blow quickly!

In the long term I'll install nice regulated LED lighting throughout, but this is a cheap attempt at making our demands on our iddy biddy battery a little lighter.

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I think that’s a sensible approach Ivan.

 

i don’t really get why you would spend £20 quid on a stabiliser thing to protect a £1 bulb...

 

you could buy well 20 new bulbs.... 

 

i would (and have) spend a couple of quid to see how the cheapos last before adding complexity....

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36 minutes ago, jonathanA said:

i don’t really get why you would spend £20 quid on a stabiliser thing to protect a £1 bulb...

Which is fine when you can be certain that the list of possible failure mechanisms from exposing them to an over voltage will definitely not include causing an electrical short circuit or bursting into flames.  Are cheap Chinese products noted for their safety record?

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6 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Which is fine when you can be certain that the list of possible failure mechanisms from exposing them to an over voltage will definitely not include causing an electrical short circuit or bursting into flames.  Are cheap Chinese products noted for their safety record?

Or have to change all of them every week in the winter and every time you go through a tunnel, It could soon add up to £20

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There is a lot of overthinking going on here.

I use similar  G4 Led capsules in the caravan no problems when the charger is on.

I have just fitted one in the boat as well again no problems when the charger is on or off. 

Both work for me between 12 and 14.9v 

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