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Condensation again, but on a new build


Kendorr

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The last couple of weeks I've been firing up the little Salamander 'Hobbit' stove, unfortunately this has resulted in condensation on the window frames and bare metal bits. I did read a condensation thread which pointed out that the condensation does reduce after 2 or 3 days. This is very true, but I'm usually only onboard for 2 or 3 days, and it's getting so bad that I hear the drips through the night. There's a couple of pics which show just how bad it it.

I've heard of a person who sticks neoprene foam to the bare metal toy provide some insulation, it won't stick to mine because of how wet the metal is, although I will try again next week and before I light the fire up.

Has anyone got an idea for how I could reduce this?

My low level ventilation is good, 2 vents in the front and back doors, and I have 4 ufo vents in the roof. I've also yet to seal around the doors, so plenty of air movement.

Thanks folks

Kevin

P1020349.jpg

P1020345.jpg

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Anywhere that there is bare metal there will be condensation. This is why spray foam should cover everywhere. Steel that is going to have timber battening on it should be battened then foamed as well , I think, then the foam cut back off the faces to be used.

Others may have differing information, no doubt. 

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The answer is in the pics. No condensation on the foam. Lots on the steel. The solution is to sprayfoam the steel or, if the steel is going to be covered by battens or something then that should stop the problem. Thing is that if its minus 10 outside and plus 20 on the inside and you only have an inch or so of material between those temperatures its asking a lot of any material to insulate that temperature gradient. Condensation is a sod, you need to be as meticulous as possible covering every bit of steel and then you will still get a few iffy bits if you look hard enough.

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I too have a condensation problem on bare steel. Or my boat does anyway :giggles:

 

Its on the undersides of the sliding hatches front and back. As the hatches slide they go over a steel ledge/upstand which would prevent sprayfoam getting past. I can only add 2mm or perhaps 3mm thickness of insulation. Any suggestions? Whatever I might use, the OP could use the same. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mike the Boilerman
Add a bit.
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14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Is that really rust, or staining from the foam ?

Nope, it really is rust!

I'll be hoping it's dry next week when the inside should be as cold as the outside, then I'll get it cleaned up a bit and give the neoprene foam a try.

It does show how much of a menace condensation can be, I'm glad I've seen it before I've hidden it all inside the cladding.

 

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3 minutes ago, Kendorr said:

Nope, it really is rust!

I'll be hoping it's dry next week when the inside should be as cold as the outside, then I'll get it cleaned up a bit and give the neoprene foam a try.

It does show how much of a menace condensation can be, I'm glad I've seen it before I've hidden it all inside the cladding.

 

Not a good start for a new build - try and get the rust off and protect the metal with some 'coating'.

I assume that you will be putting insulation over the bare-metal ? otherwise it will still be occurring but you won't see it, until it starts to stain your linings / cabin walls.

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10 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

I too have a condensation problem on bare steel. Or my boat does anyway :giggles:

 

Its on the undersides of the sliding hatches front and back. As the hatches slide they go over a steel ledge/upstand which would prevent sprayfoam getting past. I can only add 2mm or perhaps 3mm thickness of insulation. Any suggestions? Whatever I might use, the OP could use the same. 

 

The silver bubble-wrap stuff if probably best. I did our front sliding steel hatch with that, topped with 2/3mm faced ply and it looks good and doesn't suffer condensation.

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8 minutes ago, MoominPapa said:

The silver bubble-wrap stuff if probably best. I did our front sliding steel hatch with that, topped with 2/3mm faced ply and it looks good and doesn't suffer condensation.

Just placed over the metal? Or stuck to it?

If so, what have you used to stick it please?

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47 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

I too have a condensation problem on bare steel. Or my boat does anyway :giggles:

 

Its on the undersides of the sliding hatches front and back. As the hatches slide they go over a steel ledge/upstand which would prevent sprayfoam getting past. I can only add 2mm or perhaps 3mm thickness of insulation. Any suggestions? Whatever I might use, the OP could use the same. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3mm ply should cure it or at least reduce it. I have 6mm ply on mine and don't get any condensation.

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52 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

I too have a condensation problem on bare steel. Or my boat does anyway :giggles:

 

Its on the undersides of the sliding hatches front and back. As the hatches slide they go over a steel ledge/upstand which would prevent sprayfoam getting past. I can only add 2mm or perhaps 3mm thickness of insulation. Any suggestions? Whatever I might use, the OP could use the same. 

Cork tiles.

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31 minutes ago, Kendorr said:

Just placed over the metal? Or stuck to it?

If so, what have you used to stick it please?

I stuck the insulation to the metal with evo-stick and then stuck the ply to the insulation with the same stuff. This was done during the summer, so no dampness problems.

 

MP.

 

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Just to clarify, your hobbit stove doesn’t in itself cause condensation, but it warms up the air and evaporates moisture on other surfaces or absorbed into soft furnishings, this warm wet air when it meets a cold surface gives you the condensation, so carry on using the stove and get the boat nice and warm then open the doors from time to time to flush out the warm wet air.  Lack of ventilation will just move the moisture from surface to surface.  Hopefully as the boat dries out the problem will reduce.

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1 hour ago, Kendorr said:

The last couple of weeks I've been firing up the little Salamander 'Hobbit' stove, unfortunately this has resulted in condensation on the window frames and bare metal bits. I did read a condensation thread which pointed out that the condensation does reduce after 2 or 3 days. This is very true, but I'm usually only onboard for 2 or 3 days, and it's getting so bad that I hear the drips through the night. There's a couple of pics which show just how bad it it.

I've heard of a person who sticks neoprene foam to the bare metal toy provide some insulation, it won't stick to mine because of how wet the metal is, although I will try again next week and before I light the fire up.

Has anyone got an idea for how I could reduce this?

My low level ventilation is good, 2 vents in the front and back doors, and I have 4 ufo vents in the roof. I've also yet to seal around the doors, so plenty of air movement.

Thanks folks

Kevin

P1020349.jpg

P1020345.jpg

Why did you/your boatbuilder leave parts of the steelwork uninsulated?  You MUST insulate the entire surface of the hull sides, cabin sides, roof and cabin end bulkheads otherwise you are just asking for trouble.

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2 hours ago, David Mack said:

Why did you/your boatbuilder leave parts of the steelwork uninsulated?  You MUST insulate the entire surface of the hull sides, cabin sides, roof and cabin end bulkheads otherwise you are just asking for trouble.

I have to hold my hands up here, I battened it out and prepared it for the insulation to be applied, so my mistake and I'm trying now to rectify it.

 

Thanks to everyone for the ideas, gives me something to think about and a few ways to go. ?

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The boat I mentioned in a different thread *should I have a survey on a new boat.....

I moved in Winter,  ending up breaking thin ice occasionally.

The boat was dripping inside,  on closer inspection,  the spray foam had only been sprayed up to the under window cross members and the steel round the windows was uninsulated.

The spray foam stopped 3" from every mushroom hole.

Steel with a single coat of paint was visible round all hatches and front mini-doors, the wood hadn't been built out far enough and rust was already visible in all these areas.

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