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Water Rat.

Boat blacking

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£450, so £10 per foot length. That was last year, at The Slipway just North of Cropredy, and included the haul-out and the push-in.

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2 minutes ago, Athy said:

£450, so £10 per foot length. That was last year, at The Slipway just North of Cropredy, and included the haul-out and the push-in.

 

Did that include the bottom?

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4 minutes ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

 

Did that include the bottom?

I believe Athy dod by mistake sit down in a puddle of bitumen.

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15 minutes ago, bizzard said:

I believe Athy dod by mistake sit down in a puddle of bitumen.

No I dod nit!

Mac, I don't think so. very few blackers paint the base plate as far as I know. They did take care to get in all the crevices and I think they did the inside of the weed hatch.

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3 minutes ago, Athy said:

No I dod nit!

Mac, I don't think so. very few blackers paint the base plate as far as I know. They did take care to get in all the crevices and I think they did the inside of the weed hatch.

They don't do up the rudder stock tube though, another waterline, the achillies heel, which technically makes doin the rest of it a bit futile.

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24 minutes ago, bizzard said:

They don't do up the rudder stock tube though, another waterline, the achillies heel, which technically makes doin the rest of it a bit futile.

But can't rusted rudder stock tubes be replaced a lot more easily than hulls?

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3 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

But can't rusted rudder stock tubes be replaced a lot more easily than hulls?

Yes but its still mighty expensive.    The tube can be painted by removing the stock and rudder. Run a steel bristle flue brush up and down it then paint it with a brush on a long stick or spray up in it with a paint spray lance.

Edited by bizzard

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2 hours ago, Machpoint005 said:

But can't rusted rudder stock tubes be replaced a lot more easily than hulls?

 

On most modern narrow boats the rudder tube passes through the integral fuel tank at the back of the counter.  So the first you will know of a leaking rudder tube will be the film of diesel you leave on the canal behind you. And replacing the tube will require draining down of the fuel tank.

Edited by David Mack

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13 minutes ago, David Mack said:

 

On most modern narrow boats the rudder tube passes through the integral fuel tank at the back of the counter.  

Some older n/b's, certainly some Springers, didn't have one at all.

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I think that the specification of the work is relevant to the price, so posta commenting on exactly what is done are relevant and useful. You might find a very cheap company, but if they don't pressure-wash the hull, if they apply only one coat of bitumen, then these factors should be taken into account.

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9 hours ago, Water Rat. said:

How much did anyone pay recently? 

I doubt you will beat Dan at Langley mill boatyard. Had mine done there this year. Brilliant clean dry dock. Power washed off and two coats of bitumen put on and time to dry between coats and an extra day to make sure it was dry before floating all for the princely sum of £ 7.50 a foot and a nice easy run up there from Trent lock. Highly recommend.

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nb Willpower,  50 ft cruiser stern:  at Grendon Dry dock in Jun 2018

- Scrape hull & pressure wash - 5,000psi  and 3 coats of bitumastic         £720 inc vat           

4 x 2.8 magnesium anodes    £272     inc vat         

 

Separate full 'out of water' hull inspection and valuation  £600.

Or half an inspection - the hull was so rusty that the superstructure and interior didn't make much difference to the overall value, according to the surveyor, so didn't bother with looking inside.

The survey was a waste of money. It was needed for fully comp insurance - but the hull was rusted too much in places and below industry standards for 'thickness' (whatever that is) - so that only third party insurance is available.

 

.....I am making enquiries about that.

My current policy is Fully Comp.  .... or at least that is what I am paying for.

.... the brokers say the insurance companies will not pay out anyway ...

 Is that a known fact?                                 

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18 hours ago, Water Rat. said:

How much did anyone pay recently? 

The missing part of with that question is "where are you, and how far are you prepared to travel?".

 

It seems to be pretty universal that the closer to London you are the more expensive it gets, whereas if you could go a long way North it gets a whole heap cheaper.   I'm not suggesting any "pricing gradient" is linear, but I'll bet you can't find anything to match say that Langley Mill price anywhere near London.

Also as ha been said you need to compare like with like.  Many quotes will be for 2 coats, not 3, and if they don't allow at least a day between coats, and ideally a couple of days after the last one, (which many don't) it is likely to be an inferior job to one done by a yard that does.

However I have no recent recommendations.  Neither of our boats would go into Grendon Dock when they were supposed to be being blacked in July - the canal was silted, and the level down, and we came nowhere close!

  • Greenie 1

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7 hours ago, Horace42 said:

nb Willpower,  50 ft cruiser stern:  at Grendon Dry dock in Jun 2018

- Scrape hull & pressure wash - 5,000psi  and 3 coats of bitumastic         £720 inc vat           

4 x 2.8 magnesium anodes    £272     inc vat         

 

Separate full 'out of water' hull inspection and valuation  £600.

Or half an inspection - the hull was so rusty that the superstructure and interior didn't make much difference to the overall value, according to the surveyor, so didn't bother with looking inside.

The survey was a waste of money. It was needed for fully comp insurance - but the hull was rusted too much in places and below industry standards for 'thickness' (whatever that is) - so that only third party insurance is available.

 

.....I am making enquiries about that.

My current policy is Fully Comp.  .... or at least that is what I am paying for.

.... the brokers say the insurance companies will not pay out anyway ...

 Is that a known fact?                                 

At Furness Vale marina, steam cleaning and blacking with Rylard Premium, 30ft boat was £545 inc dry dock cost.

The insurers will cover on the basis of what your surveyor says. In my case the summary said,  "with the surface pitting of the hull monitored,the craft should represent a normal risk for the purpose of insurance."

Somewhere in the small print of your insurance documents,there will be a clause that says that the boat must be maintained in good condition,and if your surveyor recommended localised overplating for your rusty bits,then your comprehensive insurance may well have been issued assuming that you have done any remedial work recommended by your surveyor.

If you have not,and you have a claim,then I can see that as a reason for your insurers to reject your claim.

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4 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

Somewhere in the small print of your insurance documents,there will be a clause that says that the boat must be maintained in good condition,and if your surveyor recommended localised overplating for your rusty bits,then your comprehensive insurance may well have been issued assuming that you have done any remedial work recommended by your surveyor.

If you have not,and you have a claim,then I can see that as a reason for your insurers to reject your claim.

 

Which leads on to the perennial debate about comprehensive insurance. If you fail the get the overplating done as recommended then have a total loss unrelated to the overplating advice (e.g. you sill the boat in a lock and sink it), can the insurance co use your failure to overplate to decline your claim?

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Which leads on to the perennial debate about comprehensive insurance. If you fail the get the overplating done as recommended then have a total loss unrelated to the overplating advice (e.g. you sill the boat in a lock and sink it), can the insurance co use your failure to overplate to decline your claim?

 

 

I suspect that some will try!

 

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11 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Which leads on to the perennial debate about comprehensive insurance. If you fail the get the overplating done as recommended then have a total loss unrelated to the overplating advice (e.g. you sill the boat in a lock and sink it), can the insurance co use your failure to overplate to decline your claim?

 

 

Which reminds me of the story of the Lamborghini.

 

Shortened version :

Carefully driving down a country lane at under 30mph, he was hit by a 'hooligan' in an old Mini doing about 60mpg as he came around a blind bend on the wrong side.

The Mini was not insured and the Lambo drivers insurers would not pay out as the car was not in accordance with specifications.

The tyres were HR tyres (130mph rated) and not VR (in excess of 130mph), the vehicle was capable of in excess of 130mph so he was not insured.

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34 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

Which leads on to the perennial debate about comprehensive insurance. If you fail the get the overplating done as recommended then have a total loss unrelated to the overplating advice (e.g. you sill the boat in a lock and sink it), can the insurance co use your failure to overplate to decline your claim?

When Sickle failed a survey, I was still able to secure comprehensive insurance, but with a cause that said it wouldn't apply if the claim could be attributed to something the survey had picked up.

That sounded a sensible compromise to me, and a rare occasion of an insurance company acting very reasonably.

 

Mind you they have since just withdrawn from covering historic boats at all, so perhaps not that reasonable a company,after all.

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1 hour ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Which leads on to the perennial debate about comprehensive insurance. If you fail the get the overplating done as recommended then have a total loss unrelated to the overplating advice (e.g. you sill the boat in a lock and sink it), can the insurance co use your failure to overplate to decline your claim?

 

 

Parallel to this, apart from a couple of months ago, I have not had an 'out-of-water' survey/condition/valuation done and only blacked twice, since I bought my boat 31 years ago - hence the poor result of the survey I guess.

..... and now we hear about the 'quality' and effectiveness of blacking - and and the cost - and how often......?

...and not wishing to be cynical - but pertinent to the question - my surveyor did a better 'blacking' job than the boatyard ......!

 

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Also worth checking how much of the 'black' the quote covers. In particular, what does it say about the area between the lowest rubbing strake and the gunnels.

 

Last blacking we had done was at Oxley Marine (Wolverhampton). We were very satisfied. I cannot recall the cost of the blacking as we had several other things done at the same time.

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On 06/12/2018 at 13:52, Water Rat. said:

How much did anyone pay recently? 

Aqueduct Marina on the Shroppie, October, £57 per foot, for trailer lifts, shotblast, 2 pack, in sheds for a week, on hard standing for a week.  Yes it was a lot of money but they did an excellent job at very short (i.e. no) notice.

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