Blacking and resulting problem

[KenK]

In November 2017 my boat was blacked inside a covered dry dock by a company who not only run their own hire fleet but also offer all aspects of maintenance for private boats. We had left the boat there on a winter mooring and it made sense to have the blacking done whilst it was there, we collected the boat at the end of March 2018 and set off for our seasons cruising. A few weeks into our cruise I noticed a patch of blacking missing near the front of the boat above the waterline. Investigation showed the blacking had separated from the hull leaving clean metal behind and that the blacking in the area around the hole was lifting away from the metal. I scraped the area until I had blacking fixed to the hull and sealed the area with fresh blacking, we carry a tin for patching as required. Over the next few weeks various areas of blacking also decided to part company with the hull, lifting away leaving clean metal behind. It was beginning to look as if the blacking had never actually been attached to the hull but just held in place by surrounding blacking which was attached. This process continued throughout the summer, obviously we could only see what was happening above the waterline, so the concern was what about the blacking we could not see. We decided the only sensible solution was to arrange to take the boat out of the water when we finished cruising. The boat came out in October 2018 and after power washing the slime away it was clear that no blacking remained below the waterline, just the metal hull covered by a white powder, which came away easily with the application of a scraper. Fortunately any rust was just light surface and easily dealt with by scraping and a Vactan application, the boat was then reblacked.

The owner of the dry dock wasn't able to shed any light on why the blacking had failed in such a short period of time he had never seen a boat come in with all the blacking missing below the waterline. I spoke to a friend who works in the paint industry to obtain his take, if any, on the cause and he responded "it is always the preparation or incompatible products which cause this type of problem". Well the product used was standard bitumen which we had always requested each time the boat was blacked and  which had previously lasted at least three years. He suggested that the most likely reason was the temperature and / or the dampness of the hull when the blacking was applied, also given we are talking about a boat, possibly it was returned to the water before the new blacking had completely dried.

Normally I would not disclose the name of the company who did the job but in this case I am prepared to do it because of their response when I wrote to them with my complaint, enclosing lots of photographs taken during the summer and in the dry dock. Snaygill Boats director contacted me and asked for a few days to allow him to investigate what had gone wrong as his employee who had done the job was on holiday, obviously I agreed to that as it is only reasonable. He came back to me a few days later and said that unfortunately his employee could not give any reason why the blacking had failed but then requested my bank account details. The money I paid for the blacking was refunded the next day, it is nice to deal with a company who are prepared to take responsibility when things go wrong and do their best to put things right. We all make mistakes, it is how the mistake is address which separates the good from the bad.

 

Finally if you do decide to black your boat or have it done for you try and do it when the weather is nice and warm, I can't guarantee you won't have problems but I suspect it will be less likely.

 

Ken

 

[rusty69]

Thanks.Will make sure I avoid them.

[Rebotco]

56 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Thanks.Will make sure I avoid them.

On the contrary, I would recommend them.

Things can go wrong for the best of them.  The vital test is how they respond.

In this case a prompt and full refund was rightly given.

So they took full responsibility and suffered the loss themselves.  I give them full marks for that and would have confidence in any other work they might do in the future.

[Nut]

nice to see the company shelling out well done them

[Traveller]

Yes - an excellent result from a clearly honourable company.

[Bee]

Its the white powder bit that's the puzzle. I am ( most certainly) not an expert but there is a type of bacteriological corrosion that does that. (google microbial corrosion), I have seen a boat with little patches of what could have been that but I don't really know for sure.  You say the blacking also came off above the waterline too. I use some sort of cheap and cheerful blacking above the waterline (epoxy below) and its been applied with poor preparation, poor skill and in poor weather and it only flakes a tiny bit here and there. So, sorry, no answers but maybe the paint was a bit badly mixed at the factory?

[MtB]

3 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Thanks.Will make sure I avoid them.

 

Well like Rebotco, I would be happy to use them. Things go tits up occasionally for all companies. The shyte ones usually argue black is white that its the customer's fault not theirs, usually in a well-rehearsed way developed to fend off a continuous dribble of dissatisfied punters.. A decent, honest firm doing a good job usually will be rather taken aback, and will either put it right or offer a refund.

 

Snaygill clearly fall into the latter category. What more would you have them do, once a problem has arisen?!

 

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

Snaygill clearly fall into the latter category. What more would you have them do, once a problem has arisen?!

 

If the refund was given due to a faulty paint product,then fair enough.

 

 

[MtB]

Just now, rusty69 said:

If the refund was given due to a faulty paint product,then fair enough.

 

 

 

My bet is Snaygill are as puzzled as the OP. What should they do in your opinion?

 

 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

My bet is Snaygill are as puzzled as the OP. What should they do in your opinion?

 

 

My opinion is that i wouldn't use their services. I have no opinion on how they deal with complaints. 

[WotEver]

36 minutes ago, Bee said:

Its the white powder bit that's the puzzle...

Agreed. But it doesn’t sound even remotely like MIC. That occurs in localised areas and manifests itself as shiny pits; it doesn’t cover a large area as a powder. 

 

I suspect the hull was cold and damp resulting in zero adhesion between the bitumen and the steel. 

 

Top marks for Snaygill’s handling of the matter and I would have no hesitation in using them myself. 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, WotEver said:

suspect the hull was cold and damp resulting in zero adhesion between the bitumen and the steel. 

 

Top marks for Snaygill’s handling of the matter and I would have no hesitation in using them myself

If you suspect they applied product to a cold damp surface, why would you use their services? 

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

If you suspect they applied product to a cold damp surface, why would you use their services? 

 

Because having done it once and issued a refund, they are pretty unlikely to do it again.

 

[WotEver]

7 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

If you suspect they applied product to a cold damp surface, why would you use their services? 

Because they obviously don’t make a habit of it and were prepared to refund the cost when it appeared (although not proven) that they made a boo-boo. 

[MtB]

 

I notice you avoided my question though.!

[rusty69]

5 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Because having done it once and issued a refund, they are pretty unlikely to do it again.

 

Sure. But why would i take that risk?

 

It can't be that difficult to meet the application requirements of the product. If they can't be met, the service shouldn't be offered. 

 

It could of course have been a faulty batch of paint, in which case the company acted honourably and i hope they managed a claim against the paint supplier. 

[TheBiscuits]

3 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Thanks.Will make sure I avoid them.

That should save you a lot of money on haulage and cranage.

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

That should save you a lot of money on haulage and cranage.

I have more than one boat, so i would hope so. 

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Sure. But why would i take that risk?

 

 

Because having done it once and issued a refund, they re HIGHLY unlikely to do it again, duh.

 

I don't think you're thinking this through properly!

 

I'd say they are less likely to do it again than some other company chosen at random, given their expensive experience.

 

[TheBiscuits]

3 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

I have more than one boat, so i would hope so. 

You don't black the yot though (or do you?!)

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

You don't black the yot though (or do you?!)

Nope. Just the narrowboats. 

3 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Because having done it once and issued a refund, they re HIGHLY unlikely to do it again, duh.

 

I don't think you're thinking this through properly!

 

I'd say they are less likely to do it again than some other company chosen at random, given their expensive experience.

 

Oh, i see, the penny has dropped. You mean they would have learnt by their mistakes. 

 

Thats a horse of a different colour, and has given me renewed confidence in their ability. 

[Wanderer Vagabond]

45 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Nope. Just the narrowboats. 

Oh, i see, the penny has dropped. You mean they would have learnt by their mistakes. 

 

Thats a horse of a different colour, and has given me renewed confidence in their ability. 

For me, after sales service is worth greater consideration than the actual job itself, and Snaygill seem to have epitomised the perfect after sales service, I'd certainly use them on the basis of this. I have known boat painters with an excellent reputation having done a singularly crap job on a fellow boater's boat, there is always a risk, no matter how good their reputation is. How they react is what is important.

 

As an example of rubbish after sales service this blog is worth a look (   http://noproblem.org.uk/blog/  ) on the basis of Sue's experience with the company mentioned, I wouldn't consider putting any trade their way.

[Tacet]

The odd thing with this type of blacking problem is why the recent application has stripped back the older layers underneath - for that is what seem to have happened.

 

It seems reasonable that blacking poorly applied or applied in the wrong conditions should fail, but quite what could you do to make it as as a paint stripper?

 

[Alan de Enfield]

17 minutes ago, Tacet said:

The odd thing with this type of blacking problem is why the recent application has stripped back the older layers underneath - for that is what seem to have happened.

Did it ?

 

18 hours ago, KenK said:

It was beginning to look as if the blacking had never actually been attached to the hull but just held in place by surrounding blacking which was attached.

 

[Tacet]

5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Did it ?

 

 

Well, its a little ambiguous but:

 

"after power washing the slime away it was clear that no blacking remained below the waterline, just the metal hull covered by a white powder.....r"

 

Unless there was no blacking below the waterline before the most recent was applied. Which would be odd and probably point towards Something Else other than the blacking process.