Complete newbies

[aracer]

2 minutes ago, David Chapman said:

Electrics, gas, plumbing I already do so not much issue there, I now make furniture so my skill base is improving, if it doesn't workout I hang my head in shame and we go back to living in our house 

TBH you've probably got all the skills required for it not to be a complete nightmare then. I'm a newbie and my reasons for jumping aboard aren't too dissimilar to yours and it's not a bad set of reasons IMHO. I'm nearly 2 months into ownership, so past the initial honeymoon period, and also now I think past the questioning whether I've done the right thing period - I'm fairly sure now that I have done the right thing. I don't have quite the necessary skills and experience to want a project myself - though having thought I'd bought a boat which perfectly suited my needs and needed nothing doing to it, I am now coming up with a list of stuff which will require electrical, plumbing and woodwork skills, which I can manage to a DIY level (my electrical skills are a bit better than normal DIY standard, but I'm not touching gas).

 

Anyway I thought I'd add a bit of positivity - it sounds to me like you have your head screwed on and it's not all a dream, you're not the typical person they'll all try to put off on here (though do pay attention to all the negativity realism from everybody else).

[doratheexplorer]

17 minutes ago, David Chapman said:

 

I'm Manchester and as my wife wants to carry on working we can't travel during the week yet

 

Meaning what?  Why would you need to travel during the week?  Also, why does working prevent travelling during the week.  I work and I travel during the week.

[Athy]

10 minutes ago, LadyG said:

 

OH, I see you have a mortgage, you must check if you can rent it out without problem, insurance will be yet another complication ...........................

Loads of people, including this writer and others on this forum, rent houses out. We haven't got mortgages on our rental properties, but I know people who still have. There are landlord insurance policies easily available. You don't need to insure the contents, it's buildings-only and the tenant pays the council tax. Not a problem as long as the tenant has been vetted and found to be suitable.

Edited November 20, 2018 by Athy

[Tony Brooks]

In Manchester you will be  in the clutches of The Bridgwater Canal Company (Peel Holdings) and I understand they have very firm views on how long ans where you can moor so check. If you move out a bit you are into CaRT waters and their rules are you must move every 14 days unless signs say less and should be on a continuous journey. Both will make fitting out while living ashore somewhat difficult if not impossible. As far as CaRT are concerned failing to observe their requirements may end up in having your boat confiscated. You need to get the boat into/on a mooring that allows you to carry out major work. Check that last bit.

 

I know from fitting out GRP cruisers fr the hire trade it takes far longer than most people thing - even experienced ones - I would say 5 time longer. Remember spirit levels and plumb lines are virtually useless on a boat that is afloat.

 

Then, where ever you are moored where do you store things like sheets of ply etc so they do not get damaged or stolen.

[doratheexplorer]

Just now, aracer said:

TBH you've probably got all the skills required for it not to be a complete nightmare then. I'm a newbie and my reasons for jumping aboard aren't too dissimilar to yours and it's not a bad set of reasons IMHO. I'm nearly 2 months into ownership, so past the initial honeymoon period, and also now I think past the questioning whether I've done the right thing period - I'm fairly sure now that I have done the right thing. I don't have quite the necessary skills and experience to want a project myself - though having thought I'd bought a boat which perfectly suited my needs and needed nothing doing to it, I am now coming up with a list of stuff which will require electrical, plumbing and woodwork skills, which I can manage to a DIY level (my electrical skills are a bit better than normal DIY standard, but I'm not touching gas).

 

Anyway I thought I'd add a bit of positivity - it sounds to me like you have your head screwed on and it's not all a dream, you're not the typical person they'll all try to put off on here (though do pay attention to all the negativity realism from everybody else).

After 2 months you most definitely not through the honeymoon period.  You haven't even had a winter yet.  The honeymoon period is between 5-10 years depending on the individual.

[LadyG]

2 minutes ago, David Chapman said:

yes it is a tricky one but I am determined to give it a go, not sure how or when but I'll figure it out and expect it's going to be hard at times

OK, start researching, all technical answers can be found on here, so you need to use the search facility. 

This could be a mid life crisis and you will get over it, but if you want your marriage to survive you both need to be enthusiastic.

 

[doratheexplorer]

1 minute ago, Tony Brooks said:

In Manchester you will be  in the clutches of The Bridgwater Canal Company (Peel Holdings) and I understand they have very firm views on how long ans where you can moor so check. If you move out a bit you are into CaRT waters and their rules are you must move every 14 days unless signs say less and should be on a continuous journey. Both will make fitting out while living ashore somewhat difficult if not impossible. As far as CaRT are concerned failing to observe their requirements may end up in having your boat confiscated. You need to get the boat into/on a mooring that allows you to carry out major work. Check that last bit.

 

I know from fitting out GRP cruisers fr the hire trade it takes far longer than most people thing - even experienced ones - I would say 5 time longer. Remember spirit levels and plumb lines are virtually useless on a boat that is afloat.

 

Then, where ever you are moored where do you store things like sheets of ply etc so they do not get damaged or stolen.

There are CRT waters right in Manchester too.

[aracer]

1 minute ago, doratheexplorer said:

After 2 months you most definitely not through the honeymoon period.  You haven't even had a winter yet.  The honeymoon period is between 5-10 years depending on the individual.

Oh good - I've got that to look forward to then, I wasn't sure I would last more than a year! In my case the initial honeymoon period was the week and a half trip bringing my boat back here and living the boating life properly. Now on a mooring it's not so exciting and I was really worried it would soon seem like a bad idea, but it doesn't. I know there's much more winter to come, but it's been fairly cold the last few nights and not even close to being uncomfortable (and I can't recall where I am having ever frozen over in the 20 years I've lived in the area).

 

Regarding renting a house out, I should have the capital to buy a house mortgage free myself when everything works out, and am seriously considering buying and renting out - having looked at renting a house myself as an alternative to moving onto the boat I have worked through all the sums carefully and I'm fairly sure I'm not being unrealistic about the costs of living on a boat (yes I am allowing reasonable amounts for maintenance). I've not gone into all the costs involved in renting out a house but it seems possible I might be able to make enough income from that to cover most of my living costs (ie mooring, CRT licence, running a car, heating, food, blacking, boat insurance, servicing, general boat maintenance; in rough order of decreasing cost).

[Tumshie]

Hi David and welcome to the forum, I've posted a link for you just to help with your research.

 

Apolloduck is a fun place to look at a large number of different narrowboats on the market, and this link takes you straight to the complete listings fro narrowboats so it might be worth bookmarking - https://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/listings.phtml

 

I also suggest looking at the YouTube channel for Rugby Boats they sell boats and have a walk through video of all/most of the boats they have and have had for sale, it's worth watching just to get a feel and learn about the different type of boats and the different layouts and how much space they offer. 

 

ETA It's not as worth while as seeing the boats in real life but it's good for a start. 

 

Good luck with your adventure. 

Edited November 20, 2018 by Tumshie

[David Chapman]

21 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

In Manchester you will be  in the clutches of The Bridgwater Canal Company (Peel Holdings) and I understand they have very firm views on how long ans where you can moor so check. If you move out a bit you are into CaRT waters and their rules are you must move every 14 days unless signs say less and should be on a continuous journey. Both will make fitting out while living ashore somewhat difficult if not impossible. As far as CaRT are concerned failing to observe their requirements may end up in having your boat confiscated. You need to get the boat into/on a mooring that allows you to carry out major work. Check that last bit.

 

I know from fitting out GRP cruisers fr the hire trade it takes far longer than most people thing - even experienced ones - I would say 5 time longer. Remember spirit levels and plumb lines are virtually useless on a boat that is afloat.

 

Then, where ever you are moored where do you store things like sheets of ply etc so they do not get damaged or stolen.

at the moment the best plan seems to be for us to pay for 12 months mooring as close as possible, (Worsley, Sale etc), I have a big caged trailer for my DIY Business so will bring and take tools and materials

[doratheexplorer]

5 minutes ago, aracer said:

Oh good - I've got that to look forward to then, I wasn't sure I would last more than a year! In my case the initial honeymoon period was the week and a half trip bringing my boat back here and living the boating life properly. Now on a mooring it's not so exciting and I was really worried it would soon seem like a bad idea, but it doesn't. I know there's much more winter to come, but it's been fairly cold the last few nights and not even close to being uncomfortable (and I can't recall where I am having ever frozen over in the 20 years I've lived in the area).

 

If you're in Worcester as your profile suggests, then I'd be amazed if the canal there hasn't frozen over in the last 20 years.  The River is a different matter but there aren't many river moorings in Worcester.  Last winter the ice was around 2" thick up the canal near Bromsgrove.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, aracer said:

I might be able to make enough income from that to cover most of my living costs (ie mooring, CRT licence, running a car, heating, food, blacking, boat insurance, servicing, general boat maintenance; in rough order of decreasing cost).

Do you honestly think that (for example) taking your 'decreasing costs', that the insurance will cost more than boat maintenance, it is also very unlikely that your licence will be cheaper than maintenance.

 

If you don't do any maintenance one year, then it may be, but if you average out the maintenance over say 10 years you are looking at ( I work on) an overall average of about £3000 per annum.

You should budget for a 'major expense' (in excess of £1000) every year and have cash set aside.

It could be repainting (£8000), a new engine (£10,000) a Gearbox problem (£1000)  new batteries (my battery bank costs £1300) etc etc

[Athy]

5 minutes ago, aracer said:

. I've not gone into all the costs involved in renting out a house but it seems possible I might be able to make enough income from that to cover most of my living costs (ie mooring, CRT licence, running a car, heating, food, blacking, boat insurance, servicing, general boat maintenance; in rough order of decreasing cost).

That does sound feasible. As a rough guide, income from one of our properties (a 3-bedroom house) pays for three overseas holidays per year for 2 people, income from the other (a 1-bedroom flat) pays for boat moorings, licensing, insurance and servicing. In both cases, that's after tax and property agents' fees have been deducted, and in both cases there's usually a bit left over.

[mrsmelly]

1 hour ago, David Chapman said:

Me and my wife Margarita are so new the only experiance we have is 2 days reading and watching youtube.  Our intention is to buy a narrow boat (hopefully as a project) and liveaboard.

 

We need loads of advice, signposting and information so we're looking forward to talking to everybody

My strong advice is..................Dont watch you tube, nearly all of them are newbies with less than ten years living aboard often even in their first year and have little enough experience than to give anyone else the whys and wherefors.

[doratheexplorer]

2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Do you honestly think that (for example) taking your 'decreasing costs', that the insurance will cost more than boat maintenance, it is also very unlikely that your licence will be cheaper than maintenance.

 

If you don't do any maintenance one year, then it may be, but if you average out the maintenance over say 10 years you are looking at ( I work on) an overall average of about £3000 per annum.

You should budget for a 'major expense' (in excess of £1000) every year and have cash set aside.

It could be repainting (£8000), a new engine (£10,000) a Gearbox problem (£1000)  new batteries (my battery bank costs £1300) etc etc

I repainted myself last year (£300).  New battery bank (£250)....

[rusty69]

Just now, doratheexplorer said:

I repainted myself last year (£300).  New battery bank (£250)....

I have never painted myself.Do you need a primer?

[David Chapman]

28 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

Meaning what?  Why would you need to travel during the week?  Also, why does working prevent travelling during the week.  I work and I travel during the week.

if my wife is working I will also keep my full time job which means we have to moor somewhere and both travel to work each morning

[Tumshie]

Just now, rusty69 said:

I have never painted myself.Do you need a primer?

I believe if you have quite rosie skin you can buy green stuff from Boots  then just paint liberally and accordingly but don't ask me what that is. 

[David Chapman]

14 minutes ago, aracer said:

Oh good - I've got that to look forward to then, I wasn't sure I would last more than a year! In my case the initial honeymoon period was the week and a half trip bringing my boat back here and living the boating life properly. Now on a mooring it's not so exciting and I was really worried it would soon seem like a bad idea, but it doesn't. I know there's much more winter to come, but it's been fairly cold the last few nights and not even close to being uncomfortable (and I can't recall where I am having ever frozen over in the 20 years I've lived in the area).

 

Regarding renting a house out, I should have the capital to buy a house mortgage free myself when everything works out, and am seriously considering buying and renting out - having looked at renting a house myself as an alternative to moving onto the boat I have worked through all the sums carefully and I'm fairly sure I'm not being unrealistic about the costs of living on a boat (yes I am allowing reasonable amounts for maintenance). I've not gone into all the costs involved in renting out a house but it seems possible I might be able to make enough income from that to cover most of my living costs (ie mooring, CRT licence, running a car, heating, food, blacking, boat insurance, servicing, general boat maintenance; in rough order of decreasing cost).

I really hope it works out for you, I think you've done the hardest part GETTING STARTED

[mrsmelly]

34 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

After 2 months you most definitely not through the honeymoon period.  You haven't even had a winter yet.  The honeymoon period is between 5-10 years depending on the individual.

True enough.

[David Chapman]

8 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Do you honestly think that (for example) taking your 'decreasing costs', that the insurance will cost more than boat maintenance, it is also very unlikely that your licence will be cheaper than maintenance.

 

If you don't do any maintenance one year, then it may be, but if you average out the maintenance over say 10 years you are looking at ( I work on) an overall average of about £3000 per annum.

You should budget for a 'major expense' (in excess of £1000) every year and have cash set aside.

It could be repainting (£8000), a new engine (£10,000) a Gearbox problem (£1000)  new batteries (my battery bank costs £1300) etc etc

Yes there has to be the expectation and provision for "when it goes wrong"

[doratheexplorer]

7 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

My strong advice is..................Dont watch you tube, nearly all of them are newbies with less than ten years living aboard often even in their first year and have little enough experience than to give anyone else the whys and wherefors.

I'd agree with this.  It's always excitable newbies who start vlogging and the same people then turn up in articles in 'lifestyle' magazines.  I was approached myself in my early days.  Those same people typically dissapear after a short while (wonder why).

[David Chapman]

9 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

My strong advice is..................Dont watch you tube, nearly all of them are newbies with less than ten years living aboard often even in their first year and have little enough experience than to give anyone else the whys and wherefors.

thanks I'll take your advice

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

Another suggestion is to avoid "projects" like the plague, esp if you are "innocents"

To true, its not like house DIY You need to know how systems work, 12 volt DC as well as mains AC, Plumping that is a pressurised system and if you are employing people to do the work it would probably be cheaper to buy one ready to go.

[doratheexplorer]

10 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

I have never painted myself.Do you need a primer?

Start with your toes and work up.

9 minutes ago, David Chapman said:

if my wife is working I will also keep my full time job which means we have to moor somewhere and both travel to work each morning

And then, every 14 days you move along a couple of miles.  Not too hard really.