London whiteout

[joe hoyle]

So I’ve heard this mentioned a couple of times. I think I get the gist. But do people really get this antagonised about interior styles? 

Personally I really like both the traditional and the modern “whiteout” looks..... 

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, joe hoyle said:

So I’ve heard this mentioned a couple of times. I think I get the gist. But do people really get this antagonised about interior styles? 

Personally I really like both the traditional and the modern “whiteout” looks..... 

 

Buying a knackered out old narrowboat and painting EVERYTHING inside with white emulsion is the "London Whiteout" It lasts a month or two before looking tatty and raises the resale value of the boat for the undiscerning buyer looking for cheap accommodation in the capital by about £10k for a weekend's work.

 

If you actually like white interiors like this, then excellent. You get more boats to choose from! 

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, joe hoyle said:

So I’ve heard this mentioned a couple of times. I think I get the gist. But do people really get this antagonised about interior styles? 

Personally I really like both the traditional and the modern “whiteout” looks..... 

The problem is that the "London Whiteout" is, in the majority of instances, applied to boats that are really ready for retirement (sinking) to get folks uneducated in the ins and outs of boats to think it has 'clean & modern lines' and is the same as a floating flat.

[Ian F B]

Personal taste is exactly that,so it's not easy to please all of the people all of the time.

Perhaps it's not a good idea to furnish a traditional boat with the best of Swedish design,but if it's what the owner likes then who are we to judge.????

[Tony1]

I don't like small interior spaces at all, and I have also been thinking that one way to make a narrowboat interior feel more spacious would be via the liberal application of a light/neutral colour. 

Brilliant white might be a bit stark perhaps, but a very light colour is certainly something I want to try when I finally make the move onto water. 

The other thing I'm going to be on the lookout for is an adjoining dinette and saloon area, so that I can rip out the dinette, replace it with something that folds away somehow when not in use, and try to create a single lounge area of perhaps 15-20 feet in length, which might make the interior feel more comfortable and open plan, for my admittedly OTT preferences. 

I might get two of those nabru sofas into that sort of lounge space, perhaps one with a corner section so I can go a bit 'chaise longue' when the mood strikes... 

The interiors I've seen and spent time in that have lots of wood have felt cosy, but to me cosy is not a good thing. 

I fear this will be heresy to many, but I don't particularly want it to look like a boat inside, and I'm not really attracted to the virtues of 'trad' accoutrements like Lister engines, boatmen cabins, and Roses and Castles artwork. 

I'm very glad that there are people who want to keep those traditions alive, but I won't be one of them. Give me a modern quietish diesel with a hospital silencer over a hammering old Lister any day.

I holidayed with a Lister equipped boat a couple of years ago, and it felt like people could hear me coming from a mile away even at tick over. 

I got an early start before 8am on the Ashby one morning, and I felt like a criminal as I pulled away from the mooring at low revs, as the Lister pounded away like a jackhammer, waking everyone up within a half mile radius. Meanwhile I enviously watched a modern 60 footer glide past almost at a whisper through the morning mist. It had to have been a diesel, but it was lovely and quiet, even in the quiet of the morning...

Sorry.

You were talking about paint there, werent you? Don't know how I got onto slagging off Listers (and probably collecting mortal enemies at an alarmingly high rate in the process) . 

They're works of art really. It's like the roof of the Sistine Chapel. Beautiful and majestic creations, but I wouldn't have my own ceiling done out that way.

Anyway, rather than dig my execution pit any deeper, I'll get my coat. 

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Tony1
Teeny tiny typo

[aracer]

11 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

I don't like small interior spaces at all

Are you sure narrowboating is for you?

11 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

The other thing I'm going to be on the lookout for is an adjoining dinette and saloon area, so that I can rip out the dinette, replace it with something that folds away somehow when not in use, and try to create a single lounge area of perhaps 15-20 feet in length, which might make the interior feel more comfortable and open plan, for my admittedly OTT preferences.

I have adjoining saloon and dinette on mine - it's a fairly common thing - in my mind it already makes an open plan living area, along with the kitchen which is the far side of the dinette. Though I can understand your thinking here - more often than not I eat sitting on the sofa by the stove (as I used to eat sitting on the sofa when I lived in a house) - but I like having an area with a table for other reasons (and for me having all the storage space under a raised dinette is invaluable).

[Tony1]

I think that's a reasonable observation Mr Racer, and I have thought long and hard about the benefits of a widebeam in terms of space, and about my dislike of small living spaces. 

I guess there are lots of compromises accepted in a decision to live in a narrow beam boat, but ultimately the proximity of a wide range of cruising areas close to the locations I will be visiting has convinced me that my first boat should be a narrowboat. But it wasn't an easy decision, and with almost 2 years before I get my own boat, it's possible that other factors could come into play to make me reconsider.

After spending time in different boats over the last few years I do think I will be psychologically comfortable on a narrowboat, but I will try to make the interior as open plan as is possible.

 

[joe hoyle]

Ah I get it more now. It’s not so much the look, more the “quick sale / hide the fact it’s a sh*t boat” lick of paint job! 

I really did think it was a bit of hatred for anything not ‘traditional’ styling! 

 

[TheBiscuits]

2 minutes ago, joe hoyle said:

Ah I get it more now. It’s not so much the look, more the “quick sale / hide the fact it’s a sh*t boat” lick of paint job! 

I really did think it was a bit of hatred for anything not ‘traditional’ styling! 

That's it exactly.

 

There was a boat on the Trent last year that had been sold on the condition it was delivered to London 2 weeks later.  Three chaps onboard; one steering with a road atlas to navigate by, one painting the outside while underway, and one painting the inside.

 

They were a classic example of the breed of sellers we are not that fond of.

[joe hoyle]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

  Three chaps onboard; one steering with a road atlas to navigate by, one painting the outside while underway, and one painting the inside.

 

They were a classic example of the breed of sellers we are not that fond of.

 

You get them everywhere. I was one once! The first flat the OH and I got together we thought we’d do the same. A good lick of paint and we thought we’d make an extra 20k! 

 

Of course then we realised we needed new wiring before selling. Then we realised the boiler was basically pointless. Then we had to replace all the rads and pipes. 

 

We did make 20k on the original purchase price, but after we’d spent a pretty penny making it look nice with the paint and “London whiteout” look, and then after realising nothing actually worked and getting it all fixed, we ended up on a loss of about 4K. 

 

I do do miss that naivety though. Maybe that’s why we’re planning on moving onto a narrow boat! 

[TheBiscuits]

1 minute ago, joe hoyle said:

 

You get them everywhere. I was one once! The first flat the OH and I got together we thought we’d do the same. A good lick of paint and we thought we’d make an extra 20k! 

 

Of course then we realised we needed new wiring before selling. Then we realised the boiler was basically pointless. Then we had to replace all the rads and pipes. 

 

We did make 20k on the original purchase price, but after we’d spent a pretty penny making it look nice with the paint and “London whiteout” look, and then after realising nothing actually worked and getting it all fixed, we ended up on a loss of about 4K. 

 

I do do miss that naivety though. Maybe that’s why we’re planning on moving onto a narrow boat! 

It's amazing how many folk think because they have done up a few flats or houses that doing up a boat will be a doddle.  It's also why the usual rule of thumb is that it will cost twice as much and take three times as long as you expect.

 

To be fair, it is very easy to strip a boat back to a bare shell.  There are a lot of them for sale in that exact state ...

 

The old cynics amongst us have already been through the process at least once.  I am now allowed to spend more money on better boat(s), but only if I promise not to "improve" them.  I also have to finish this one first!

[X Alan W]

10 hours ago, Tony1 said:

I don't like small interior spaces at all, and I have also been thinking that one way to make a narrowboat interior feel more spacious would be via the liberal application of a light/neutral colour. 

Brilliant white might be a bit stark perhaps, but a very light colour is certainly something I want to try when I finally make the move onto water. 

The other thing I'm going to be on the lookout for is an adjoining dinette and saloon area, so that I can rip out the dinette, replace it with something that folds away somehow when not in use, and try to create a single lounge area of perhaps 15-20 feet in length, which might make the interior feel more comfortable and open plan, for my admittedly OTT preferences. 

I might get two of those nabru sofas into that sort of lounge space, perhaps one with a corner section so I can go a bit 'chaise longue' when the mood strikes... 

The interiors I've seen and spent time in that have lots of wood have felt cosy, but to me cosy is not a good thing. 

I fear this will be heresy to many, but I don't particularly want it to look like a boat inside, and I'm not really attracted to the virtues of 'trad' accoutrements like Lister engines, boatmen cabins, and Roses and Castles artwork. 

I'm very glad that there are people who want to keep those traditions alive, but I won't be one of them. Give me a modern quietish diesel with a hospital silencer over a hammering old Lister any day.

I holidayed with a Lister equipped boat a couple of years ago, and it felt like people could hear me coming from a mile away even at tick over. 

I got an early start before 8am on the Ashby one morning, and I felt like a criminal as I pulled away from the mooring at low revs, as the Lister pounded away like a jackhammer, waking everyone up within a half mile radius. Meanwhile I enviously watched a modern 60 footer glide past almost at a whisper through the morning mist. It had to have been a diesel, but it was lovely and quiet, even in the quiet of the morning...

Sorry.

You were talking about paint there, werent you? Don't know how I got onto slagging off Listers (and probably collecting mortal enemies at an alarmingly high rate in the process) . 

They're works of art really. It's like the roof of the Sistine Chapel. Beautiful and majestic creations, but I wouldn't have my own ceiling done out that way.

Anyway, rather than dig my execution pit any deeper, I'll get my coat. 

 

Are you really sure you want to get your self a boat? narrow beam tips your stated aims further away  How about a 'Gin Palace"on the Thames

[Alan de Enfield]

10 hours ago, Tony1 said:

After spending time in different boats over the last few years I do think I will be psychologically comfortable on a narrowboat, but I will try to make the interior as open plan as is possible.

Have you considered having a 'River boat' and moving up onto the Rivers and Northern canals (which were built for Gurt Fat Boats). With a suitable boat you can even get in some coastal cruising.

 

 

We have had several narrowboats, and they are fine for what they are designed for - the narrow canals of the Midlands, but no one would build a boat, by choice that is only 6' 10" wide (externally) so not much more than 6 feet wide internally when you take the tumbleholme and gunwhales into account.

Take 2x 2' 6" deep sofas and face the together and you have about 12" 'corridor' between them - not even enough room to put your legs down (like being squashed into the back of a 'sports car'.

We thoroughly enjoyed our NB years, but decided we needed a bit of 'comfort' so have gone "Fat" (to match my ever increasing waistline) with a 14 foot beam boat.

The difference is unbelievable.

You can actually sit in a comfy chair and watch TV 'across the room' and it is not 3 foot in front of your face.

A 'walk around' queen sized bed with dressing tables and wardrobes each side (his and hers)

A separate galley (kitchen)

A separate dining room

A separate saloon (lounge)

 

Fat is the new thin !!!!

 

Dining Room 

Kitchen

Master Bedroom (On-Suite toilet & Basin one side and on-suite shower the other side)

 

 

 

[MtB]

10 hours ago, joe hoyle said:

Ah I get it more now. It’s not so much the look, more the “quick sale / hide the fact it’s a sh*t boat” lick of paint job! 

I really did think it was a bit of hatred for anything not ‘traditional’ styling! 

 

 

Yes you have it exactly now.

 

I fear I inadvertently misled you when I made my disparaging and slightly inappropriate "London Whiteout" comment in the thread about the dave Harris boat for sale for £87k. The all-white interior was probably applied to a very high standard from new, not completed in four hours flat. It just looks that way to me in the photos. Unfortunate as it was probably done long before the London Whiteout technique took hold. 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by Mike the Boilerman
Spelling!

[X Alan W]

13 hours ago, Tony1 said:

I think that's a reasonable observation Mr Racer, and I have thought long and hard about the benefits of a widebeam in terms of space, and about my dislike of small living spaces. 

I guess there are lots of compromises accepted in a decision to live in a narrow beam boat, but ultimately the proximity of a wide range of cruising areas close to the locations I will be visiting has convinced me that my first boat should be a narrowboat. But it wasn't an easy decision, and with almost 2 years before I get my own boat, it's possible that other factors could come into play to make me reconsider.

After spending time in different boats over the last few years I do think I will be psychologically comfortable on a narrowboat, but I will try to make the interior as open plan as is possible.

 

Keep your eye out for an unconverted ex working boat they don't come much more open plan than that or as an alternative how about a sail away shell & leave as is

[Murflynn]

reminds me of 1969 when I worked with a group of flower power surveyors.  They rented a cottage and immediately followed the Rolling Stones' advice - 'paint it black'.  ....................  everything, including the light bulbs.    Wacky Baccy was involved.

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

.....................immediately followed the Rolling Stones' advice - 'paint it black'.  ....................  everything, including the light bulbs.

Remember Miss max ?

Painted the whole boat (including windows) and blocking up the vents with 'Bitumin Blacking'.

[Athy]

I too thought of her when I read Murflynn's post. I wonder how she is - I don't think she was the happiest of bunnies. Ditto Brassy alias Brassed Off alias Grey Lady, who seems to come and go.

[Alan de Enfield]

20 minutes ago, Athy said:

I too thought of her when I read Murflynn's post. I wonder how she is - I don't think she was the happiest of bunnies

I had a lucky escape, I had arranged to visit her and try and sort out some of (boat) problems, but another forumite was closer - visited & ended up taking all the 'stick' & accusations.

[Rickent]

18 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I had a lucky escape, I had arranged to visit her and try and sort out some of (boat) problems, but another forumite was closer - visited & ended up taking all the 'stick' & accusations.

It was a rather unfortunate state of affairs. Do hope she is ok though.

[Tumshie]

59 minutes ago, Athy said:

Ditto Brassy alias Brassed Off

Brassy was my friend, one of the first I made here, but she took poorly and stop posting quite abruptly so I didn't get the chance to ask her to stay in touch. She had such a big heart and I miss her.

 

If you're reading Chucky Egg come back. 

 

 

[cuthound]

10 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Yes you have it exactly now.

 

I fear I inadvertently misled you when I made my disparaging and slightly inappropriate "London Whiteout" comment in the thread about the dave Harris boat for sale for £87k. The all-white interior was probably applied to a very high standard from new, not completed in four hours flat. It just looks that way to me in the photos. Unfortunate as it was probably done long before the London Whiteout technique took hold. 

 

 

 

So, could you scumble the interior and make a quick £20k to the Dave Harris boat? ??

[magictime]

22 hours ago, Tony1 said:

I don't like small interior spaces at all, and I have also been thinking that one way to make a narrowboat interior feel more spacious would be via the liberal application of a light/neutral colour. 

Brilliant white might be a bit stark perhaps, but a very light colour is certainly something I want to try when I finally make the move onto water. 

The other thing I'm going to be on the lookout for is an adjoining dinette and saloon area, so that I can rip out the dinette, replace it with something that folds away somehow when not in use, and try to create a single lounge area of perhaps 15-20 feet in length, which might make the interior feel more comfortable and open plan, for my admittedly OTT preferences. 

 

Just my own perspective, but the more boats I viewed when shopping around (in the flesh and in photos) the more I came to the conclusion that the 'open plan' thing, far from creating a feeling of space, just emphasises a narrowboat's narrowness. A space of say 10' or 12' by 6' looks just about in proportion as a room; a space of 16' or 18' by 6' just looks like a corridor to me. Hence we quite consciously went for a boat where the living space is broken up into dinette, then galley, then saloon (albeit without floor-to-ceiling walls between them; it is somewhat open feeling, just not corridor-y, I hope!)

 

On the 'white paint' thing, I have a pet theory that the more traditional wood panelling look is a carry-over from the 70s when the first purpose-built leisure narrowboats were being designed; a time when I guess it would have looked terribly modern and on-trend, and flat painted walls (rather than papered/textured walls) weren't really a thing. Personally I much prefer the painted look to the 'wood, wood and more wood' look, although our own boat's interior is only painted above the level of the gunwales.

[nbfiresprite]

4 hours ago, magictime said:

. Personally I much prefer the painted look to the 'wood, wood and more wood' look, although our own boat's interior is only painted above the level of the gunwales.

Quite agree since I started to redo the inside using cream satin paint with dark oak trim, the inside of the boat is much lighter now conpared how it was built with varnished wood panels which darked over time.

 

 

 

[Grebe]

Before we had Grebe built we had spent some holidays on 'traditional' Broads Yachts.  These tended to have ceilings/deck-heads painted white.

The normal Sea Otter practice was bench seats at the bows to convert to a double bed across the boat.  Interior Ash veneer wall panels and either T&G  strips on the ceiling (extra cost)or the standard Ash panels with a longtiudinal seam along the roof, plus side-to-side seams, all seams covered in trim.  SWMBO said I'm not having this it looks like a tram.

 

So we ordered the roof to be Ash panels across the roof, they were concerned that it would use an extra panel, we said get on with it we know what we want and are paying.  Then e dropped the W bomb.... paint the ceiling white.  After spluttering they did it.

 

SWMBO then selected a dark (red) carpet.  The effect on the finished boat was superb,  it may have been illusory but on a 26ft boat, the tiny cabin 16ft by 6ft (ish) was no bigger than two garden sheds but seemed massive.  The roof line did not appear to close in at the top and we put the bed at the back of the cabin.

 

So we reckon white in the proper place/places is good...but no Whiteout please.