Sterndrive knocking

[Mister P]

Hi all

 

well my boat search continues, a couple of months in now, and we're supposed to be taking a look at one later this week. It ticks all the boxes and looks in excellent nick cosmetically having had a full refit just a couple of years ago but as a boating novice I need some informed advice from you lovely people here. I've been in email contact with the seller and had a lot of questions answered and there is one matter of concern:

 

She has a Watermota Sea Panther diesel engine with a Transadrive outleg.  The seller has described the Transadrive as having a "worn forward gear". I've asked for further info and it appears that there is sometimes a bit of a "crunch" selecting forward gear and that the drive is knocking at high revs. I don't like the sound of any of that and to my mind if that was a car gearbox I'd be looking at a rebuild or a new one. I expect the same with this.

 

So my questions - assuming worst case scenario and the drive is close to buggered what are the approximate costs of either getting this one stripped and rebuilt or buying a new/refurb one and having that fitted. A ballpark figure or two would do as I don't have a clue. And apologies for my ignorance but are new sterndrives readily available that would fit the Watermota?

 

I'm quite happy to walk away from this boat but as everything else seems in such good order I'm prepared to buy it if the price reflects the situation with the Transadrive.

 

Cheers all.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Mister P

[Naughty Cal]

It depends what is wrong with it. 

 

Crunching into gear could just be a bad adjustment on something.

 

The knocking doesn't sound great though.

 

It isn't a drive I am that familiar with other then having seen one in older boats.  But a quick Google suggests the parts are readily available and second hand units can be bought for under £1k.

 

With this in mind I would just use it as bargaining power against the asking price and budget for replacing the drive if necessary.

[Alan de Enfield]

16 minutes ago, Mister P said:

I'm quite happy to walk away from this boat but as everything else seems in such good order I'm prepared to buy it if the price reflects the situation with the Tr

Apparently these guys have some knowledge about Transadrive legs

 

https://www.sillette.co.uk/documents/sonic_drives_price_list.pdf

[Mister P]

Thanks guys - not cheap new ones are they?! ?

 

What would you regard as a reasonable labour cost to have someone fit one? Any mechanical engineers on here?

 

[Naughty Cal]

29 minutes ago, Mister P said:

Thanks guys - not cheap new ones are they?! ?

 

What would you regard as a reasonable labour cost to have someone fit one? Any mechanical engineers on here?

 

Depends who you get to do the work. The engineers at our yard charge £80 per hour!

[Alan de Enfield]

£65 + VAT per hour. for skilled engineer.

£45 + VAT for a 'yard boy' (sanding down, putting chocks under the hull etc)

 

You probably won't get a 'price for the job' as on old boats with old equipment they never know what is going to come off easily, what is going to be 'stuck' and what else will break whilst they are doing the job.

 

I'd guess (assuming straight out and straight in and allowing for disconnecting everything) 1.5 hours each way.

You will also need to factor in lifting out and lifting back into the water (say 200-£300) unless you can do it whilst it is out for survey - but then you risk paying to have it done and the surveyor comes up with other major problems and suggests you don't buy it. The owner then gets a nice new Drive leg.

Edited November 12, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[cereal tiller]

1 hour ago, Mister P said:

Hi all

 

well my boat search continues, a couple of months in now, and we're supposed to be taking a look at one later this week. It ticks all the boxes and looks in excellent nick cosmetically having had a full refit just a couple of years ago but as a boating novice I need some informed advice from you lovely people here. I've been in email contact with the seller and had a lot of questions answered and there is one matter of concern:

 

She has a Watermota Sea Panther diesel engine with a Transadrive outleg.  The seller has described the Transadrive as having a "worn forward gear". I've asked for further info and it appears that there is sometimes a bit of a "crunch" selecting forward gear and that the drive is knocking at high revs. I don't like the sound of any of that and to my mind if that was a car gearbox I'd be looking at a rebuild or a new one. I expect the same with this.

 

So my questions - assuming worst case scenario and the drive is close to buggered what are the approximate costs of either getting this one stripped and rebuilt or buying a new/refurb one and having that fitted. A ballpark figure or two would do as I don't have a clue. And apologies for my ignorance but are new sterndrives readily available that would fit the Watermota?

 

I'm quite happy to walk away from this boat but as everything else seems in such good order I'm prepared to buy it if the price reflects the situation with the Transadrive.

 

Cheers all.

 

 

Watermota Sea Panther is a Diesel conversion of the 1960's Ford Crossflow 1600 cc Petrol vehicle Engine.as for Sillette /Transadrive it is as basic as an Outdrive can be, fragile and Expensive to repair.they are both now rare ,for good reason.

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, cereal tiller said:

Watermota Sea Panther is a Diesel conversion of the 1960's Ford Crossflow 1600 cc Petrol vehicle Engine.

Is that one with Tony's dislikes, a cam belt? I take it you mean its the diesel equivalent and that they didn't actually convert a petrol engine to run on diesel, I cant see that being cost effective.

[cereal tiller]

1 minute ago, ditchcrawler said:

Is that one with Tony's dislikes, a cam belt? I take it you mean its the diesel equivalent and that they didn't actually convert a petrol engine to run on diesel, I cant see that being cost effective.

No Belt but Timing Chain.the Cortina 1600 Crossflow was a 60's Petrol Engine which Ford "Dieselised" but no more than one Thousand Running hours could be achieved before the Crankshaft expired .Watermota bought the Tooling and marketed it as Marine unit.Hard to start and often with neat Engine Oil leaking out of the Wet Exhaust .the later Ford XLD had the Cambelt.

[ditchcrawler]

2 minutes ago, cereal tiller said:

No Belt but Timing Chain.the Cortina 1600 Crossflow was a 60's Petrol Engine which Ford "Dieselised" but no more than one Thousand Running hours could be achieved before the Crankshaft expired .Watermota bought the Tooling and marketed it as Marine unit.Hard to start and often with neat Engine Oil leaking out of the Wet Exhaust .the later Ford XLD had the Cambelt.

Ta.

[Tony Brooks]

52 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Is that one with Tony's dislikes, a cam belt? I take it you mean its the diesel equivalent and that they didn't actually convert a petrol engine to run on diesel, I cant see that being cost effective.

Very much the contemporary of the BMC 1.5 diesel with similar antecedence but for once BMC seemed to get the conversion more or less right. Ford did not even seem to provide an  extra oil jet for the injector pump skew drive gear so I suspect the pump timing went out as the gears wore.

[Boater Sam]

Seen one of the Ford 1600 "conversions" to diesel on a generator long ago. Don't even think of using it, terrible cocked up thing, it didn't work.

 

Buy the boat but only on the principle of ripping it all out and converting to a sensible engineered inboard power unit or at least a BMC 1.5D on a recon outdrive leg.

[Naughty Cal]

1 hour ago, Boater Sam said:

Seen one of the Ford 1600 "conversions" to diesel on a generator long ago. Don't even think of using it, terrible cocked up thing, it didn't work.

 

Buy the boat but only on the principle of ripping it all out and converting to a sensible engineered inboard power unit or at least a BMC 1.5D on a recon outdrive leg.

Or move on to the next boat which will certainly work out cheaper.

[Alan de Enfield]

5 hours ago, Mister P said:

I'm quite happy to walk away from this boat but as everything else seems in such good order I'm prepared to buy it if the price reflects the situation with the Transadrive.

If you want a cheap boat that is a fixer-upper then have a look here :

 

https://www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk/view-trader/commercial-boat-services/1673

[GUMPY]

Watermota/outdrive

Run away as fast as you can

Trouble with a capital T

[Mister P]

Thanks for the above advice folks confirming my gut instinct that this purchase would = grief.

 

Onwards and upwards ?

[cereal tiller]

7 hours ago, Mister P said:

Hi all

 

well my boat search continues, a couple of months in now, and we're supposed to be taking a look at one later this week. It ticks all the boxes and looks in excellent nick cosmetically having had a full refit just a couple of years ago but as a boating novice I need some informed advice from you lovely people here. I've been in email contact with the seller and had a lot of questions answered and there is one matter of concern:

 

She has a Watermota Sea Panther diesel engine with a Transadrive outleg.  The seller has described the Transadrive as having a "worn forward gear". I've asked for further info and it appears that there is sometimes a bit of a "crunch" selecting forward gear and that the drive is knocking at high revs. I don't like the sound of any of that and to my mind if that was a car gearbox I'd be looking at a rebuild or a new one. I expect the same with this.

 

So my questions - assuming worst case scenario and the drive is close to buggered what are the approximate costs of either getting this one stripped and rebuilt or buying a new/refurb one and having that fitted. A ballpark figure or two would do as I don't have a clue. And apologies for my ignorance but are new sterndrives readily available that would fit the Watermota?

 

I'm quite happy to walk away from this boat but as everything else seems in such good order I'm prepared to buy it if the price reflects the situation with the Transadrive.

 

Cheers all.

 

 

The Transmission in the outdrive Leg  uses simple Dogs for engagement the forward one is obviously very worn and the Knocking is probably the gears disengaging momentarily under load.

[Naughty Cal]

11 hours ago, cereal tiller said:

The Transmission in the outdrive Leg  uses simple Dogs for engagement the forward one is obviously very worn and the Knocking is probably the gears disengaging momentarily under load.

Could be a relatively easy and straight forward fix if that is the case.

 

To be fair even if the drive wanted replacing the second hand units were not expensive.