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Winter Diesel Additive


Ace 01

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Hi.  During the winter season road diesel has an additive put in by the refineries to prevent waxing in freezing temperatures. I assume that red diesel also has a similar additive. As most of the diesel in my tank is from the summer cruising period and topped up prior to mooring my boat in the Marina for winter then that additive will not be present. Is there an after market anti waxing additive that can be added to winterise the existing fuel?

 

Cheers

 

David

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I think you are right Arthur, the tank is sitting in water and ice in winter, barely below zero whereas a truck is up in the wind getting colder.

Never had a gelling problem either and we used to be up on the Macclesfield too, 488 ft above sea level, coldest place in Cheshire.

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1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

This last winter (Feb / March 18) Both of my tractor's diesel 'gelled' up, I replaced the filters but nothing worked until the temp rose for long enough to 'thaw it out' fully.

Strangely, the Digger (parked next to the tractors) wasn't affected.

I remember you saying about it at the time. it must be as others have said the exposure to the cold windy air?

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This article suggests that winter grade diesel will be available to end users from 16th November until 15th March.

 

https://www.crownoil.co.uk/news/avoid-potential-problems-winter-red-diesel-recommendations/

Edited by cuthound
To unmangle the effects of autocorrect.
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Many years ago I used to light a bucket of oily rags under the tractor in really cold weather. Never had an issue with the boat, even after arriving after  several days of -15c with six inches of ice on the canal. I've always assumed it was because most of the engine 'ole was below the water level. 

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33 minutes ago, dor said:

Many years ago I used to light a bucket of oily rags under the tractor in really cold weather. Never had an issue with the boat, even after arriving after  several days of -15c with six inches of ice on the canal. I've always assumed it was because most of the engine 'ole was below the water level. 

 

Just as well, assuming your boat has the tank in the counter, it would be extremely difficult to light a fire under it.  ?

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7 hours ago, Ace 01 said:

Hi.  During the winter season road diesel has an additive put in by the refineries to prevent waxing in freezing temperatures. I assume that red diesel also has a similar additive. As most of the diesel in my tank is from the summer cruising period and topped up prior to mooring my boat in the Marina for winter then that additive will not be present. Is there an after market anti waxing additive that can be added to winterise the existing fuel?

 

Cheers

 

David

Davd, the refineries dont add additives to prevent waxing, they just change the blending ratios to put less 'waxing' materials in. See Cuthound's  link above which describes it quite well. A number of refineries also do an 'intermediate grade for the month before and month after the winter 'period'. If you buy your diesel from somewhere that turns it over fast, ie a hire boat base then you may be able to ascertain if you are getting 'winter' diesel but most of the hire boat bases have given up by end of October so they may not be getting any of the 'cold' stuff.

I filled my tank up with diesel in September so unfortunately have 'summer' stuff in the tank now. Not too bothered as it is very near the water line so is likely not to drop to very low temps like the exposed fuel tanks on Alan's tractor.

I am sure there are additives you can buy but I wouldnt bother.

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Antarctic bases are typically only supplied with one major  liquid fuel in bulk, Kerosene Based AN8 aviation grade turbine fuel. They then add a lubricant additive only when used in diesel engines. Limited amounts of mogas is shipped for portable equipment and skidoos 

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48 minutes ago, DandV said:

Antarctic bases are typically only supplied with one major  liquid fuel in bulk, Kerosene Based AN8 aviation grade turbine fuel. They then add a lubricant additive only when used in diesel engines. Limited amounts of mogas is shipped for portable equipment and skidoos 

Interesting.  We were ladling lubricity additive into F34 and F35 for aviation use in the late 80's. It was easy to handle and dispense, which was not the case for the Icing Inhibitor. That was pofentially lethal.

 

N

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3 hours ago, BEngo said:

Interesting.  We were ladling lubricity additive into F34 and F35 for aviation use in the late 80's. It was easy to handle and dispense, which was not the case for the Icing Inhibitor. That was pofentially lethal.

 

N

Aviation turbine fuel is additive free. From refinery to aircraft there is a continuous custody chain with testing at each stage, and once the test results are in, an authorised person, (A release note signatory) signs the release to the next stage of the chain. An extremly sensitive water test is a major part of the release proceedure.

Because the fuel is still slightly hydroscopic however some water always remains. This remnant water was the cause of the nearly catostrophic landing on the extreme edge of Heathrow by a BA 777 from Hong Kong some years ago. The flight path involved an ascent to very high over the Tibetan Plateau in extremly cold conditions, and then a sustained low power cruise before further reducing power for the descent. The fuel had  became totally cold soaked and the remnant water formed minute ice crystals that migrated to the engine filters and  then grew . Normally a burst of power would clear these crystals through but on this flight the first demands for more power were on short finals, and the ice blocked filters starved the engines. Now such flights periodically require some altitude changes to flush the filters. 

 

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Yes that was an interesting AAIB report. ISTR the driver felt he was hard done by BA and wrote a book.

NATO Military Aviation fuel definitely comes with additives.  Lubricity additive, often added at bulk fuel installations and Fuel System Icing Inhibitor added at the refinery (FSII).  There are different Fxx designators for AVTUR with and without FSII.  Without is not suitable for high altitude or cold weather ops.  Usually means the rotary wing world use it.

There is a different higher flashpoint version for shipboard use. IIRC that now always has FSII but did not once.

N

 

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4 hours ago, DandV said:

Aviation turbine fuel is additive free. From refinery to aircraft there is a continuous custody chain with testing at each stage, and once the test results are in, an authorised person, (A release note signatory) signs the release to the next stage of the chain. An extremly sensitive water test is a major part of the release proceedure.

Because the fuel is still slightly hydroscopic however some water always remains. This remnant water was the cause of the nearly catostrophic landing on the extreme edge of Heathrow by a BA 777 from Hong Kong some years ago. The flight path involved an ascent to very high over the Tibetan Plateau in extremly cold conditions, and then a sustained low power cruise before further reducing power for the descent. The fuel had  became totally cold soaked and the remnant water formed minute ice crystals that migrated to the engine filters and  then grew . Normally a burst of power would clear these crystals through but on this flight the first demands for more power were on short finals, and the ice blocked filters starved the engines. Now such flights periodically require some altitude changes to flush the filters. 

 

Ah yes, the incident where they interviewed a taxi driver who was by the perimeter fence at the place and time the aircraft went over.  "I heard this noise," he said, "and I knew it was a plane right away".  Fred Housego would have been proud.

 

 

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