Remote shore power monitoring - circuit breaker issue

[Bugsworth Tippler]

When on shore power the circuit breaker on the boat occasionally trips and I'm at a loss to discover why. There is an in-line galvanic isolator (Galvanic Isolator Co Gi-120/P) connected to the shore-line (attached to external socket on boat which is undercover) and the only thing left on is a battery charger (12v 20A 7 Stage Connect & Forget Automatic Battery Charger as sold by Alpha Batteries).

I'm thinking of buying and plugging in a Remote SMS Control/Monitor SMS-ENVIROTXT which would send me a text when the power fails (or when the temperature gets low). I could then go to the boat and reset the breaker (I live 20 minutes away) when necessary rather than two or three times a week just to check on things. The shore power column breaker doesn't trip just the one one the boat.

Obviously it would be nice if the circuit breaker didn't trip and not being around when it does so means I have limited info about when it is doing so. Comments and suggestions welcome. Does anyone use the SMS-ENVIROTXT or anything similar to monitor/control boat?

 

[rusty69]

I have been trialling the envirotxt thing for the last month with a giffgaff sim. Primarily I have been using it to remote monitor temperature, for which it has been faultless so far. It has also notified me of power loss on a couple of occasions, but is in a house not a boat (although it did work on the boat too). 

 

I have it set up to automatically advise the temperature on an hourly basis by auto texting from my giffgaff phone. 

 

Spose you could achieve the same thing with an smartphone. There a was thread a while back discussing just that. 

 

A 10 quid topup on giffgaff gives 3 months giffgaff to giffgaff texts "free".

 

ETA, I would try changing the circuit breaker, and ensuring all external plugs/sockets are dry internally and watertight.

 

 

Edited October 22, 2018 by rusty69

[Robbo]

Which breaker, RCD or MCB?   If RCD and you have a calorfier connected check that first.

[WotEver]

21 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

I would try changing the circuit breaker,

Me too. Try the simple fixes first. 

[jonathanA]

I think your saying it’s the RCD on the boat ? If so what’s connected. Might be worth unplugging everything to see if that stops the tripping. 

 

Never easy if it’s intermittent tripping....

[Detling]

My washing machine causes this when it gets cold.

[Robbo]

10 minutes ago, Detling said:

My washing machine causes this when it gets cold.

Try putting it on a hot wash then  

[Bugsworth Tippler]

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

I have been trialling the envirotxt thing for the last month with a giffgaff sim. Primarily I have been using it to remote monitor temperature, for which it has been faultless so far. It has also notified me of power loss on a couple of occasions, but is in a house not a boat (although it did work on the boat too). 

 

I have it set up to automatically advise the temperature on an hourly basis by auto texting from my giffgaff phone. 

 

Spose you could achieve the same thing with an smartphone. There a was thread a while back discussing just that. 

 

A 10 quid topup on giffgaff gives 3 months giffgaff to giffgaff texts "free".

 

ETA, I would try changing the circuit breaker, and ensuring all external plugs/sockets are dry internally and watertight.

 

 

Useful info. Thanks. I hadn't realised that you could get temperature updates.

Unfortunately, I won't be near the boat for a few days but I'll certainly check sockets for moisture and may well replace the circuit breaker. In reply to another posting - I'm not sure of the circuit breaker type but will find out as soon as I can.

 

Thanks for all the suggestions so far.

 

When the trips occur there is nothing attached to the circuit apart from the battery charger.

Edited October 22, 2018 by Bugsworth Tippler
Edited to add further comment

[Bugsworth Tippler]

Looking at on-line images of circuit breakers leads me to believe that the one I have on the boat is a RCD device.

[Boater Sam]

An RCD has a test button, an MCB does not. Totally different things, RCD may stop you killing yourself, MCB may save the boat burning.

 Unless you have an RCBO which is both combined.

 

Let's have a photo please.

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, Bugsworth Tippler said:

Useful info. Thanks. I adn't realised that you could get temperature updates.

Yes.You can set min and max temperature alerts for the unit itself, and also the supplied plug in temperature sensor.The unit will then send a text message to designated numbers (up to 4 iirc) when the temperature falls outside that range.

 

You can also send a text message #01 to the unit to receive an alert from the inbuilt  temperature sensor, or #16 for the plug in temperature sensor.

 

I have an app on my phone which sends a message on an hourly basis. The unit responds straight away with the temperture(s).

 

I think there is also a rapid temperature alert which indicates your house/boat is potentially on fire.

[Bugsworth Tippler]

Thanks Rusty69, very useful info.

 

And here's a photo for Boater Sam (taken after a trip to the boat where I discovered the RCD had tripped again). The Circuit Breaker is made by SAIP which a quick Google reveals is a cheap offering from China. Though not necessarily negative points I may try changing it for a reputable British make (if there is one).

 

The case seems to be SAIP and the RCD made by Doepke.

 

Edited October 22, 2018 by Bugsworth Tippler
Adding more details.

[WotEver]

There are only two possibilities of course. One is that it’s doing its job correctly and tripping due to a small leakage current somewhere and the other is that it’s faulty. If you swap it and the fault remains then you know you have to go searching for dampness and you now have a spare breaker

[GUMPY]

That looks like a 32amp RCBO fed with what looks like 2.5sqmm cable  so should be changed anyway for a 16amp version.

 

[David Mack]

The Envirotxt thing seems to require a mains power supply. Does that mean you leave the inverter on, with the attendant power use?

On Fulbourne we have one of these configured to sent text messages when the automatic bilge pump operates. It also sends a daily "I am alive" message, so we know it is still working.

[rusty69]

The envirotxt requires a mains supply. I believe it notfies loss of power using energy stored in a capacitor via the sim card.

[PaulJ]

Why not use one of these - be cheaper, will still notify you when the power goes off and give you peace of mind too.

I use several of these each doing a variety of different things-high water level in the bilge on a wooden boat for example is very useful..

On eBay 
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352469829892

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, PaulJ said:

Why not use one of these - be cheaper, will still notify you when the power goes off and give you peace of mind too.

I use several of these each doing a variety of different things-high water level in the bilge on a wooden boat for example is very useful..

On eBay 
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352469829892

Love the description:-

(I always try to keep my private area away from danger)

 

Edited October 23, 2018 by rusty69

[PaulJ]

59 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Love the description:-

(I always try to keep my private area away from danger)

 

And very wise too  ?

[Sea Dog]

The Envirotext thing sounds interesting, but fitting it to mitigate for an on going electrical fault on your boat is the wrong reason to fit it. Fix the fault, because who knows where that's going to lead. Fit Envirotext to keep you better informed should you then think it sensible. 

[Bugsworth Tippler]

4 hours ago, Sea Dog said:

The Envirotext thing sounds interesting, but fitting it to mitigate for an on going electrical fault on your boat is the wrong reason to fit it. Fix the fault, because who knows where that's going to lead. Fit Envirotext to keep you better informed should you then think it sensible. 

Agreed. I will replace the RCD as soon as I can and then consider the Envirotext or Rusty69's suggestion to monitor temperature and/or whatever.

[Bugsworth Tippler]

While I'm away from the boat and unable to do anything practically, I was wondering if there might be problems with SMS/text messaging equipment being inside a steel boat far from any openings. Would the signal get through? Any observations? 

[Bugsworth Tippler]

It's interesting to note that the incredibly cheap alarm system mentioned previously operates on 12v, so the adaptor could be discarded if you wanted. 

[rusty69]

15 minutes ago, Bugsworth Tippler said:

While I'm away from the boat and unable to do anything practically, I was wondering if there might be problems with SMS/text messaging equipment being inside a steel boat far from any openings. Would the signal get through? Any observations? 

Yes.It will depend on your network and signal strength in your location. If you are in a fixed location,try one of the network coverage maps before opting for one.Some will be better than others.

 

The Giffgaff sim I trialled was plugged in well below the waterline with no significant problems.I also tried it in the engine room and it was fine. The envirotxt thingy also gives you a signal strength reading when you ping it.

 

 

 

 

Being in a steel box can significantly impact on mobile phone reception though.

[PaulJ]

On 24/10/2018 at 10:18, Bugsworth Tippler said:

It's interesting to note that the incredibly cheap alarm system mentioned previously operates on 12v, so the adaptor could be discarded if you wanted. 

Yep-they are very basic but have built in relay so with a bit of enginuity could fire up your webasto etc too by txt. And suprisingly reliable-I have one that has been on 8-10 years now and its still working fine. Was about 8 times the price at the time though.