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inflatable canoe - slow puncture


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A friend of mine, Lady Em, as a 3 seater inflatable canoe, normally used with her two boys but occasionally I've been out with her, or with the boys. It's was bought (I think) late 2016 so is out of its one year warranty. I'm going to take up the issue of the warranty as the fault I am about to describe was first reported within the warranty period and the canoe returned to the manufacturer but they denied there was a problem

 

The canoe has three bladders contained in a fabric skin, one for each side and one for the base, each inflated independently. When we took it out in April and then again in June it seemed to have a very slow puncture in the left bladder, but we canoed from Brynich Lock to Pencelli Court Bridge and back, being out for about four hours, and it was okay with that although a tendency to pull to the left by the end due to the slightly deflated bladder.

 

Now all three bladders go down within about an hour, to the point where whilst not completely deflated, the canoe is distinctly floppy and bendy, rather tricky if one is now an hour's travel from the car...

 

Let us assume that the manufacturer doesn't want to know, or at least wants a lot of money to fix this. What's a good way (doesn't need to be quick, a reliable fix is needed) of finding the problem and fixing it? I realise it may be the valves but that's actually pretty straight forward - order new ones.

 

I had thought of submerging the canoe and inflating it to see where the bubbles come up, but that may be a bit cumbersome!

 

Any ideas?

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21 minutes ago, Robbo said:

Cover it with soapy water, watch for the bubbles?

Thanks, I'd pondered that - I suppose to be specific

 

How soapy? In a washing up bowl would it be a squirt of washing up liquid or the entire bottle?

 

Anyone got any suggestions how to fix the leak(s) when I find them? I've only ever done this on bike tires, which are smaller but take more of a hammering

 

I'd prefer the answer didn't involve giving the manufacturer many tens of pounds to do it!

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58 minutes ago, 1st ade said:

I'll PM you - sounds like exactly the trouble we had fixing slow ingress of water in a dry suit. And the next dive due in four hours...

Why a PM. Is it a secret on how to fix a puncture in an inflatable? Quite a few of us have inflatable crafts and this is supposed to be a help forum. If you PM someone with a fix then it might be better if you shared that fix with the rest of the forum.

  • Greenie 2
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2 hours ago, Robbo said:

Cover it with soapy water, watch for the bubbles?

If you get washing up liquid on the rubber would it affect the adhesion of a repair patch?

For bike tyre punctures I just immerse the partially inflated inner tube in plain water - easy enough to see a stream of bubbles from the puncture.

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5 minutes ago, David Mack said:

If you get washing up liquid on the rubber would it affect the adhesion of a repair patch?

For bike tyre punctures I just immerse the partially inflated inner tube in plain water - easy enough to see a stream of bubbles from the puncture.

A inner tube is a little easier to immerse in water!

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24 minutes ago, pete.i said:

Why a PM. Is it a secret on how to fix a puncture in an inflatable? Quite a few of us have inflatable crafts and this is supposed to be a help forum. If you PM someone with a fix then it might be better if you shared that fix with the rest of the forum.

1st Ade is my brother  - PM (which also happen to be my initials) might cover everything from a message on this forum to telling me next time we speak on the phone. 

 

If I get a successful fix I'll be sure to tell everyone how I did it

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1 hour ago, magpie patrick said:

How soapy? In a washing up bowl would it be a squirt of washing up liquid or the entire bottle?

It will be easier to spray it on the solution, you’ll have to experiment on the ratio, but enough to get bubbles easily of course. :)

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8 minutes ago, David Mack said:

If you get washing up liquid on the rubber would it affect the adhesion of a repair patch?

For bike tyre punctures I just immerse the partially inflated inner tube in plain water - easy enough to see a stream of bubbles from the puncture.

 

1 minute ago, Robbo said:

A inner tube is a little easier to immerse in water!

 Indeed! 

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28 minutes ago, pete.i said:

Why a PM. Is it a secret on how to fix a puncture in an inflatable? Quite a few of us have inflatable crafts and this is supposed to be a help forum. If you PM someone with a fix then it might be better if you shared that fix with the rest of the forum.

I will share the fix - but as I'm his brother I might offer much more than advice...

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Inflate,  fill with stuff for emergency puncture repairs, roll on a hard surface, and quickly sell on Ebay.

My skipper did this with the semi-permeable Black Avon [circa 1950], and got a few quid for it. 

Hint, don't buy inflatables from Ebay.

Edited by LadyG
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OK - as others have said - same principle as an inner tube. One difference (for both canoes and dry suits) is that when inflated they are unwieldy. Another is that they normally operate at a much lower pressure (Our dive boat was inflated to 4psi, typical car tyres are 35-40

So, soapy water - enough soap that bubbles are stable and your slow leak is visible (pure water, unless submerged far enough to see the bubbles doesn't work). work over the whole surface, especially the bits it can't possibly be and pay attention to seams. Keep the pressure on as above, inflatable boats are low pressure at teh best of times.

When you find the leak, make sure you have clean water, dry cloth and a marker to hand. Put finger on where bubbles are coming out, wash the area well and wipe dry. Then mark it so you can find it again!

Make sure it's totally dry before attempting repair. I'll go and look in the garage later see what glue we used for dry suits - for pin-pricks a drop of glue and allow to dry is enough; for a more obvious hole a patch is needed.

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18 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Inflate,  fill with stuff for emergency puncture repairs, roll on a hard surface, and quickly sell on Ebay.

My skipper did this with the semi-permeable Black Avon [circa 1950], and got a few quid for it. 

Hint, don't buy inflatables from Ebay.

I got a hypalon avon off ebay about 5 years ago. Brilliant dinghy, still going strong!

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

A fellow boater found one (fully inflated) on a trip to the Royal Docks a few years back.

I hope he kept it as a figurehead ,or at the very least an additional bow fender.

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I find with mine if I infllate on a really hot day the cooling effect of putting it in the water causes quite a drop in pressure, it may just be you need to re pump it once it has been in the water for five minutes....also in my experience taking the bladder out and immersing it or part of it in water is not too difficult, it could well be the valve or valve seating, valves are easy to change, unfortunatly if its the seating you need a new bladder which can be expensive, 

 

And actually just inflating and listening for a hissing sound can work well for finding punctures.

 

If it is a Sevylor boat then 

https://aquascene.co.uk/

 

will sell you a new bladder or valve as needed. I have alweays found them really helpful. 

 

One other top tip is don't leave it sat in direct sunlight out of the water when inflated as the heat causes a pressure increase which can cause it to puncture. (don't ask how i know this!) I always let a bit of pressure out of mine of I am going to leave it inflated but out of the water.

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If the air chambers are contained within an outer skin, Its possible the leak to atmosphere may not be where the inner chamber leak is. would one of the cycle type inner tube "snot" compounds seal the leak. As an aside if you locate the leak would you not have to strip away/ remove the outer fabric to be able to repair if a patch is the way to go.

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54 minutes ago, X Alan W said:

If the air chambers are contained within an outer skin, Its possible the leak to atmosphere may not be where the inner chamber leak is. would one of the cycle type inner tube "snot" compounds seal the leak. As an aside if you locate the leak would you not have to strip away/ remove the outer fabric to be able to repair if a patch is the way to go.

Yes you need to take the "bladder" out to repair. Usually you undo a zip, untie a couple of retaining strings and pull it out.  Much like with a bike inner tube you then repair or replace the bladder before re-assembling.

 

I replaced one of my bladders several years ago and have been absolutely fine since!

Edited by NickF
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We had a few leaks in a zodiac inflatable on our trip to the med. No chance seeing bubbles by immersion. Pull it out the water and use soap bubbles. Easy to see even small leaks. We repaired ours with patches but by the time we got to Portugal they were leaking. Got a local guy to do a vulcanising repair. Fine after that. Patches and glue don't always work if it gets vary hot.

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