Jump to content

Electric boats - the future???


Guest

Featured Posts

44 minutes ago, MJG said:

I think the future will as for cars be a hybrid solution.

 

Pure electric propulsion is simply not viable for lots of reasons and lots of people for both cars and boats. The govt. have been careful to say Hybrids (that can achieve a certain mileage under pure electric propulsion) will not be banned in the future thus paving the way for makers to create even more efficient hybrid systems. There is also the potential for cars and boats to share hybrid technology.

I can see how hybrid might work for those who live in a marina and mostly cruise short journeys, and for those who moor near a CaRT charging point (that are not springing up all over the canal system), but for CCers and those who go on journeys that last several days I can't see how it works....cruise silently for three hours, moor up and run engine to recharge batteries????  

 

...............Dave

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, dmr said:

I can see how hybrid might work for those who live in a marina and mostly cruise short journeys, and for those who moor near a CaRT charging point (that are not springing up all over the canal system), but for CCers and those who go on journeys that last several days I can't see how it works....cruise silently for three hours, moor up and run engine to recharge batteries????  

 

...............Dave

But you would run on the IC engine if you needed to, much like some hybrid cars.

 

Overall fuel consumption and emmisions would be lower than pure IC alone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, dmr said:

I can see how hybrid might work for those who live in a marina and mostly cruise short journeys, and for those who moor near a CaRT charging point (that are not springing up all over the canal system), but for CCers and those who go on journeys that last several days I can't see how it works....cruise silently for three hours, moor up and run engine to recharge batteries????  

 

...............Dave

No. The diesel engine takes over and charges the batteries whilst propelling the boat. In the summer the large solar array also gives you some charge.

 

There are quite a few hybrid hire boats on the Norfolk Broads already.

Edited by Naughty Cal
  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, MJG said:

But you would run on the IC engine if you needed to, much like some hybrid cars.

 

Overall fuel consumption and emmisions would be lower than pure IC alone.

 

How? Cars can use regenerative braking to charge the barteries,  boats cannot.

 

Also factoring in the charging inefficiencies, unless you have solar panels to top up the batteries, then reshaping from the diesel engine will consume more fuel than if the diesel was driving the prop directly, as in a normal boat.

Edited by cuthound
Clarification
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

How? Cars can use regeneration stove braking to charge the barteries,  boats cannot.

 

Also factoring in the charging inefficiencies, unless you have solar panels to top up the batteries, then reshaping from the diesel engine will consume more fuel than if the diesel was driving the prop directly, as in a normal boat.

Most hybrids and electric boats have solar as NC says it works on the broads. Me my boat works for me it might not work for others but I don't care. The future for cars will be either all electric or range extenders I don't think hybrids will survive the new regs proposed, though for boats all electric/hybrids will more than likely be the norm especially in towns and cities

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

How? Cars can use regeneration stove braking to charge the barteries,  boats cannot.

 

Also factoring in the charging inefficiencies, unless you have solar panels to top up the batteries, then reshaping from the diesel engine will consume more fuel than if the diesel was driving the prop directly, as in a normal boat.

0h I agree things need more work but given hybrid boats exist already the tech. is possible.

Edited by MJG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, MJG said:

0h I agree things need to more work but given hybrid boats exist already the tech. is possible.

JohnV had a hybrid narrowboat years ago which worked well, he would have had solar but in those days it was prohibitively expensive. Now days it's as cheap as chip's my 3300 watts cost 930 squids and the midnite mppt controller 618 squids this provides my electrical needs

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

How? Cars can use regeneration stove braking to charge the barteries,  boats cannot.

 

Also factoring in the charging inefficiencies, unless you have solar panels to top up the batteries, then reshaping from the diesel engine will consume more fuel than if the diesel was driving the prop directly, as in a normal boat.

The trick is to have an electric motor driven prop with a separate small silent diesel generator just the right size for optimum efficiency to charge a smaller bank of batteries (whilst cruising).  This will avoid the need for a huge bank of batteries and the associated larger and noisy charging generator intended to be used whilst moored, usually to the annoyance of nearby boats during antisocial hours.

 

   

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Horace42 said:

The trick is to have an electric motor driven prop with a separate small silent diesel generator just the right size for optimum efficiency to charge a smaller bank of batteries (whilst cruising).  This will avoid the need for a huge bank of batteries and the associated larger and noisy charging generator intended to be used whilst moored, usually to the annoyance of nearby boats during antisocial hours.

 

   

 

However you still have conversion losses.

 

If you connected the diesel directly to tne prop it would use even less fuel (but may not have much power in reserve).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Horace42 said:

The trick is to have an electric motor driven prop with a separate small silent diesel generator just the right size for optimum efficiency to charge a smaller bank of batteries (whilst cruising).  This will avoid the need for a huge bank of batteries and the associated larger and noisy charging generator intended to be used whilst moored, usually to the annoyance of nearby boats during antisocial hours.

 

   

This was exactly the conversion that was applied  to the Wherry The White Moth, a small diesel charger which comes in on demand, you can't hear it running . The boat was due to be re-engined but with the available grant for going electric the conversion worked out less than the new engine. This over 10 years ago so nothing new .

Phil 

13 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

However you still have conversion losses.

 

If you connected the diesel directly to tne prop it would use even less fuel (but may not have much power in reserve).

I don't think I would want to rely on a tiny diesel engine for propulsion, it's only to run as a battery charger.

Phil 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, Phil Ambrose said:

This was exactly the conversion that was applied  to the Wherry The White Moth, a small diesel charger which comes in on demand, you can't hear it running . The boat was due to be re-engined but with the available grant for going electric the conversion worked out less than the new engine. This over 10 years ago so nothing new .

Phil 

I don't think I would want to rely on a tiny diesel engine for propulsion, it's only to run as a battery charger.

Phil 

 

I realise that, hence my commnet about not having any power in reserve, but was making the point that there will still be conversion losses.

Edited by cuthound
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Phil Ambrose said:

This was exactly the conversion that was applied  to the Wherry The White Moth, a small diesel charger which comes in on demand, you can't hear it running . The boat was due to be re-engined but with the available grant for going electric the conversion worked out less than the new engine. This over 10 years ago so nothing new .

Phil 

I don't think I would want to rely on a tiny diesel engine for propulsion, it's only to run as a battery charger.

Phil 

I seem to remember from the early days that efficiency was not the objective (although important now, together with pollution avoidance) - it was more of a silent cruising issue - to emulate the silence and speed of horse drawn boats, and so as not to frighten the wildlife.  All encouraged by the promise of charging points everywhere. 
 

If I was not faced with giving up boating (age related physical limitations in strength and agility) I would look at it again....but as I said in an earlier post, I was disturbed by the high pitched whine, that I assumed would be characteristic of electric boats, arising from a trip I had on one .I lost interest and did not bother.

 

But I think there is great potential because with modern equipment - exploiting advances in hybrid car design - that cost and efficiency can be met economically.

 

Which leaves the lack of charging points to be accommodated by on-board chargers running  automatically to top up batteries when cruising. .

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, cuthound said:

 

I realise that, hence my commnet about not having any power in reserve, but was making the point that there will still be conversion losses.

In all honesty conversion losses are more than offset by silent running.

The White Moth was a trading Wherry that is now on hire with a crew and the hirers pay about £1200-00 a day so if there is no wind she would normally be quant poles and anyone paying that sort of money would not want to be poling the boat along. Her original 1.8BMC obviously made a noisy intrusion if she could not make way if windless.

That was the reason they opted for silent electric drive.

Phil 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, MJG said:

Slightly different way of doing it....

 

 

Clever - I bet its not a cheap option, and with only 25 miles range its not going to set the world alight - fine if you are going back into a marina each night to recharge the batteries, or, you have to run the generator, in which case you may as well run the main engine.

 

I'm not convinced yet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Clever - I bet its not a cheap option, and with only 25 miles range its not going to set the world alight - fine if you are going back into a marina each night to recharge the batteries, or, you have to run the generator, in which case you may as well run the main engine.

 

I'm not convinced yet.

People were not convinced about the diesel engine once upon a time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

People were not convinced about the diesel engine once upon a time.

Agreed - but an 'early adopter' I am not.

Once others have taken the risks, then I'll be happy to embrace new technology - but currently there are far to many un answered questions, (mainly where are all the charging points and how is the UK going to have sufficient generating capacity for all the electric vehicles, boats and houses when we are currently paying businesses to run their generators at peak times to avoid 'black-outs'.

 

Add in all the hype and plans to remove diesel powered vehicles and replace much of the car-pool with electric vehicles adds even more problems to the lack of capacity and infrastructure.

 

The hopes that 'industry' will find and fund new ways of electricity generation are rapidly diminishing.

 

 

“Under current [government] policy, it is almost impossible for UK electricity demand to be met by 2025,” said Jenifer Baxter, head of energy and environment at the Institution of Mechanical Engineers (IMechE), which published the report, entitled "Engineering the UK’s Electricity Gap".

 

“The UK is facing an electricity supply crisis,” Baxter warned. “As the population rises, and with greater use of electricity in transport and heating, it looks almost certain that electricity demand is going to rise. However, with little or no focus on reducing electricity demand, the retirement of the majority of the country’s ageing nuclear fleet, recent proposals to phase out coal-fired power by 2025, and the cut in renewable energy subsidies, the UK is on course to produce even less electricity than it does at the moment.”

She said: “We have neither the time, resources, nor enough people with the right skills to build sufficient power plants. Electricity imports will put the UK’s electricity supply at the mercy of the markets, weather and politics of other countries, making electricity less secure and less affordable.”

The supply gap could be equivalent to about 40% to 55% of electricity demand by the middle of the next decade, according to the study. Only four new gas-fired power stations have been built in the last 10 years."

Edited by Alan de Enfield
  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.