BWML Announcement May Be Imminent

[Alan de Enfield]

Representatives of a potential buyer visiting marinas and undertaking 'due diligence'.

Have sets of marina plans and details and noting that everything is as specified in the selling details.

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Representatives of a potential buyer visiting marinas and undertaking 'due diligence'.

 

 

Grammar which truly grates in the way so many expressions originating in football do! (“The boy done good” is another fave of mine). 

 

Its hard to think of a better term though. “Representatives of the buyers are visiting the marinas and being duly diligent” doesn’t convey they same meaning. 

 

(How was that for dragging a thread off topic immediately?!) 

[Alan de Enfield]

 

 

Edit to add : Have you noticed 'that' job has become available again (banner headline across the top of the forum) You can re-submit your CV

 

The 'buyers' are only 'potential buyers' until the agreements are signed.

 

Undertaking due diligence is a legal term.

 

 

due diligence

noun

Law

noun: due diligence

1.  

   • a comprehensive appraisal of a business undertaken by a prospective buyer, especially to establish its assets and liabilities and evaluate its commercial potential.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Mac of Cygnet]

14 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Grammar which truly grates in the way so many expressions originating in football do! (“The boy done good” is another fave of mine). 

 

Its hard to think of a better term though. “Representatives of the buyers are visiting the marinas and being duly diligent” doesn’t convey they same meaning. 

 

(How was that for dragging a thread off topic immediately?!) 

 

"Due diligence"   originating in football????    It's a perfectly normal business and legal term.

 

I see Alan just pipped me.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Mac of Cygnet

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

 

"Due diligence"   originating in football????    It's a perfectly normal business and legal term.

 

I see Alan just pipped me.

 

It is now, but it still grates and you have told us nothing about its origins. 

 

My memory tells me football managers first started using it when the transfer market became formalised about 50 years ago, then it caught on in every walk of life including business and law. 

[Athy]

25 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Grammar which truly grates in the way so many expressions originating in football do! (“The boy done good” is another fave of mine). 

 

Its hard to think of a better term though. “Representatives of the buyers are visiting the marinas and being duly diligent” doesn’t convey they same meaning. 

 

(How was that for dragging a thread off topic immediately?!) 

It's not off topic at all: it comments upon a part of the original post

But, if you'd like an off-topic tangent, how about another legal expression, "fit for purpose". Why isn't it "Fit for ITS purpose"?

I also wonder why, as BW has become CART, they are still BW Marinas and not CART Marinas.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Athy

[Alan de Enfield]

14 minutes ago, Athy said:

also wonder why, as BW has become CART, they are still BW Marinas and not CART Marinas.

Because BWML has always been a separate legal entity (Limited Company)

 

We are a wholly owned subsidiary of the Canal & River Trust, CRT (formally British Waterways), a national charity formed in 2012, whose primary role is the custodian and navigation authority for around 2,000 miles of canals and rivers across England and Wales.

BWML, along with all other commercial interests of CRT, has a responsibility to generate commercial income to support the running of the waterways within CRT’s care.

In addition to remitting profits back to Canal & River Trust, BWML operates 14 marinas on leases from CRT for which it pays open market rents.

In the year 2014/15 BWML paid Canal & River Trust around £900,000 for leases, network access fees and business support costs as well as £290,000 in respect of profits generated the previous year.

 

Much as we still have BW in Scotland (they were/are also a separate legal entity)

 

On 2 July 2012, British Waterways ceased to exist in England and Wales and in its place Canal & River Trust was set up to care for 2,000 miles of historic waterways.

In Scotland British Waterways continues to exist as a legal entity caring for the canals under the trading name 'Scottish Canals'.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Athy]

10 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

It is now, but it still grates and you have told us nothing about its origins. 

 

My memory tells me football managers first started using it when the transfer market became formalised about 50 years ago, then it caught on in every walk of life including business and law. 

The S.O.D. gives no clue as to the expression's origin, but does remind us that "Diligence" can mean "Stagecoach". So,   "undertaking due diligence" obviously means that they are promising to run the local 'buses on time.

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Because BWML has always been a separate legal entity (Limited Company)

 

 

O.K., but it would have been consistent to rename one if they were renaming the other. But, bearing this news in mind, I suppose they'll be Virgin Marinas before long.

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, Athy said:

O.K., but it would have been consistent to rename one if they were renaming the other. But, bearing this news in mind, I suppose they'll be Virgin Marinas before long.

Not really - a business has a brand and a recognised name in the market place so changing the name of the parent 'holding company' does nothing to enhance the reputation of the trading arm.

 

The company I worked for had a long history and its name was a 'brand leader', it was bought out in 1962 by a 'group', the company name never changed to the 'group' name. When the group changed its name again (around the year 2000) to give a 'modern, technical, inspiring identity', again the operating company name remained.

 

C&RT would do well to learn from industry - don't go messing with brands and logo's !!!!!

[Alan de Enfield]

10 minutes ago, Athy said:

The S.O.D. gives no clue as to the expression's origin, but does remind us that "Diligence" can mean "Stagecoach". So,   "undertaking due diligence" obviously means that they are promising to run the local 'buses on time.

 

24 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

My memory tells me football managers first started using it when the transfer market became formalised about 50 years ago, then it caught on in every walk of life including business and law. 

You must have a very long memory if you can remember its first usage :

 

The phrase due diligence is a combination of the words due, derived from the Latin word debere which means to owe, and diligence, derived from the Latin word diligentia, which means carefulness or attentiveness. The term due diligence has been in use in a legal sense since the mid-1400s.

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You must have a very long memory if you can remember its first usage :

 

The phrase due diligence is a combination of the words due, derived from the Latin word debere which means to owe, and diligence, derived from the Latin word diligentia, which means carefulness or attentiveness. The term due diligence has been in use in a legal sense since the mid-1400s.

 

Please don't be patronising. Mike and I obviously know the meanings of each word.

 

Using the phrase incorrectly as a verb is what I believe orginated in football, as you probably realise but obtusely fail to acknowledge. 

[Tanglewood]

9 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You must have a very long memory if you can remember its first usage :

 

The phrase due diligence is a combination of the words due, derived from the Latin word debere which means to owe, and diligence, derived from the Latin word diligentia, which means carefulness or attentiveness. The term due diligence has been in use in a legal sense since the mid-1400s.

one of its earliest first recorded uses, illustrating it's meaning of exercising reasonable care, is in a poem/prayer from the

The Day of Doom by Michael Wigglesworth, a New England Calvinist, a ‘morbid, humorless, selfish busybody’ in the eyes of a recent Yale professor, but in his day (the 1660s), a bestselling author. Some of this long poem is in the metre of the Psalm text set by Thomas Tallis which inspired Vaughan Williams, but a different metre takes over for the rhyming couplet: ‘Oh, wait upon him with due diligence,/ And trembling fear in every Ordinance.’

 

Taken from  an article in The Spectator

Edited September 21, 2018 by Tanglewood
to add source

[Athy]

4 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Please don't be patronising. Mike and I obviously know the meanings of each word.

 

Using the phrase incorrectly as a verb is what I believe originated in football, as you probably realise but obtusely fail to acknowledge. 

But it wasn't used as a verb. The verb in that sentence is "undertaking".

The post which you quoted wasn't made by anyone called "Mike", good name though it may be, and the  post was neither patronising nor obtuse.

That apart, I'm with you 100%.

[Tim Lewis]

20 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Not really - a business has a brand and a recognised name in the market place so changing the name of the parent 'holding company' does nothing to enhance the reputation of the trading arm.

 

The company I worked for had a long history and its name was a 'brand leader', it was bought out in 1962 by a 'group', the company name never changed to the 'group' name. When the group changed its name again (around the year 2000) to give a 'modern, technical, inspiring identity', again the operating company name remained.

 

C&RT would do well to learn from industry - don't go messing with brands and logo's !!!!!

 

Doesn't always happen like this, the construction industry is littered with famous old names that, even if not immediately, have gotten consumed by the name of the group that bought them. My first employer was John Mowlem ltd, a company with a history second to none, unfortunately the eventual buyer was Carillion who almost immediately dropped the Mowlem brand (Carillion also took over the equally historic Alfred McAlpine and dropped the name like a shot)

Edited September 21, 2018 by Tim Lewis

[Alan de Enfield]

10 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

Doesn't always happen like this, the construction industry is littered with famous old names that, even if not immediately, have gotten consumed by the name of the group that bought them. My first employer was John Mowlem ltd, a company with a history second to none, unfortunately the eventual buyer was Carillion who almost immediately dropped the Mowlem brand (Carillion also took over the equally historic Alfred McAlpine and dropped the name like a shot)

Agreed - and it often ends up damaging the original business,

But - sometimes a struggling brand can be re-vitalised by a new name.

 

Never say never.

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

17 minutes ago, Athy said:

But it wasn't used as a verb. The verb in that sentence is "undertaking".

The post which you quoted wasn't made by anyone called "Mike", good name though it may be, and the  post was neither patronising nor obtuse.

That apart, I'm with you 100%.

 

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The term due diligence has been in use in a legal sense since the mid-1400s.

Had football been invented then?

[Mac of Cygnet]

14 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Had football been invented then?

 

Dunno about football, but round here they have annual free-for-alls called the 'Ba' Game'  which are said to have originated several hundred years ago using Englishmen's heads.

[Kawayuppie]

It has happened, announced today.

 

https://www.ldc.co.uk/news/2018/12/ldc-invests-in-british-waterways-marinas

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

20 minutes ago, Kawayuppie said:

It has happened, announced today.

 

https://www.ldc.co.uk/news/2018/12/ldc-invests-in-british-waterways-marinas

 

 

And only a few weeks ago BWML was telling its staff "do not spend any money, do not use the company credit card and do not use petty cash" when asked what they should use to buy toilet rolls etc from the warehouse there was no answer.

 

So it looks like an MBO supported by Lloyds Bank

Edited December 17, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Athy]

Sounds good - LDC is a part of Lloyd's Bank. I've been with Lloyd's since my student days and have always found them trustworthy.

 

But why is CART selling these marinas? Surely they are profitable and provide useful income for repairs and maintenance?

 

(I have a vague memory of this question arising before, but can recall neither the context nor the answer).

[croftie]

8 minutes ago, Athy said:

Sounds good - LDC is a part of Lloyd's Bank. I've been with Lloyd's since my student days and have always found them trustworthy.

 

I'm with Lloyds, maybe people with a Club Lloyds account will get a 50% mooring discount ?

In my dreams......................................

[Chewbacka]

7 minutes ago, Athy said:

Sounds good - LDC is a part of Lloyd's Bank. I've been with Lloyd's since my student days and have always found them trustworthy.

 

But why is CART selling these marinas? Surely they are profitable and provide useful income for repairs and maintenance?

 

(I have a vague memory of this question arising before, but can recall neither the context nor the answer).

The way it reads to me is that they are not selling the business but they don’t have the money to expand and improve the business so they have taken on an investor that is providing the cash to fund the future plans, obviously in return for a share of the profits and increased valuation of the business.  Better and improved facilities for existing marinas is sort of good news, BUT presumably for a higher cost mooring.

[Alan de Enfield]

2 minutes ago, Athy said:

Sounds good - LDC is a part of Lloyd's Bank. I've been with Lloyd's since my student days and have always found them trustworthy.

 

But why is CART selling these marinas? Surely they are profitable and provide useful income for repairs and maintenance?

 

(I have a vague memory of this question arising before, but can recall neither the context nor the answer).

BWML is reported to be loss-making, but when you look at the accounts this is due to the huge 'management charges' that were paid to C&RT.

 

If you 'fiddle around with the accounts they certainly seem to be profitable, but, they then have very little 'management facilities' 'Human Resources', payroll, accounting services, pension provision (for example) are provided by C&RT)

 

BWML have previously made a 'gift aid' of around £1 million to C&RT.

 

2015

Turnover was £7,115 k

Administration costs £6,252k

Loss on year £878k (after £1m gift aid.

 

[Athy]

Ah, thank you CB. Rather after the manner of 'Dragons' Den', then: "I'll offer you £20 million for a 40% share of the business".

Edited December 17, 2018 by Athy