Webasto\Eberspacher 4 or 5 KW?

[Motters79]

Hey peeps!

 

I'm gonna get either Webasto or Eberspacher but cannot decide whether I need  4 or 5 KW. I have a 55ft boat and intend to run 3 or 4 rads and heat the Calorifier, though I may only actually heat the Calorifier in summer and the rads in winter (plan to have rads and Calorifier plumbed in parallel so can isolate either) In the summer my batteries are charged by solar so no need to run engine. In the winter, not so much power from panels so while running engine to charge, may as well heat Calorifier with that. Only really want the rads for first thing in the morning and when coming back to boat late at night in the winter (I have a wood stove).  I've been advised by someone that its better to have a 4kw working hard than a 5kw that is working less hard. Its better for for the health of the unit apparently.

 

What does experience say is the best option to go for?

 

Thanks

[mrsmelly]

4 is the better option but not critical. Just ensure you keep it working and put big double rads in and no thermostat.

[Naughty Cal]

Do not oversize it as it will just be ticking over and will coke up.

 

Better to have the smaller one working hard.

 

And from our experience Webasto would be the better bet over the Ebersplutter.

[Sea Dog]

I'd echo the reasoning above, except I'd be hard over on a 4kw.  Eberspacher in particular, but they all suffer from the same issue, had their reputation tarnished through many failures in boats and it turned out that they were being caused by the units short cycling having achieved the temperature demanded.  Working them hard and in bursts of demand rather than continual use on a room thermostat prolongs both their life and need for intervention.  My Eber is now 10 years old and untouched. (Commentators curse will kill it now I suppose!)

[mattcyp]

Whilst this isn't quite on topic, I was on the verge of buying a Webasto when I stumbled upone someone discussing Huricanes on here and have never looked back since!

 

http://www.calcuttboats.com/hurricane.html

 

Apart from (so far!) being as tough as can be, the nice thing about pressure jet burners (like huricanes) is that they can short cycle an awful lot without any issues, which makes them great for heating a calorifier in summer without having to dump any other heat through radiators. 

Edited September 4, 2018 by mattcyp
spelling

[MtB]

40 minutes ago, mattcyp said:

Whilst this isn't quite on topic, I was on the verge of buying a Webasto when I stumbled upone someone discussing Huricanes on here and have never looked back since!

 

http://www.calcuttboats.com/hurricane.html

 

Apart from (so far!) being as tough as can be, the nice thing about pressure jet burners (like huricanes) is that they can short cycle an awful lot without any issues, which makes them great for heating a calorifier in summer without having to dump any other heat through radiators. 

 

£2,640 though!

[TheBiscuits]

7 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

£2,640 though!

+ £600 for the narrowboat installation kit.

[mattcyp]

Yep, the price is high, to put it mildly!  I got a discount voucher of ~£200/250 for chatting to them about it at Crick in 2013, so perhaps there is some wiggle room there. 

 

 

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, mattcyp said:

Yep, the price is high, to put it mildly!  I got a discount voucher of ~£200/250 for chatting to them about it at Crick in 2013, so perhaps there is some wiggle room there.

So maybe up to 10% off... not exactly a blisteringly good deal. 

[mrsmelly]

2 hours ago, WotEver said:

So maybe up to 10% off... not exactly a blisteringly good deal. 

My boat had hurricane it was brill but went tits up. I took it to Calcutt who were very good but it was a case of needing a total refurb which was going to cost seven billion pounds. I purchased a refurbed webasto with full fitting kit for less than four hundred quid from a chap on eBay which has worked faultlessly now for two years. It is secondary heating as the only way to heat a steel narrow boat is a Morso stove or similar. But for the money has proved so far unbeatable value.

[Robbo]

5 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

£2,640 though!

Don’t even think of looking at Kabola’s then.

[MtB]

14 minutes ago, Robbo said:

Don’t even think of looking at Kabola’s then.

 

I’ve got one of those lying around. I paid £100 for it...

[Robbo]

5 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

I’ve got one of those lying around. I paid £100 for it...

Presumably not a PJ version.

[Tonka]

Isn't there a new style of Webasto coming out which may be of interest 

[Robbo]

3 minutes ago, Tonka said:

Isn't there a new style of Webasto coming out which may be of interest 

 

[Cheshire cat]

I've got a Webasto  Thermo E which is 4.2KW and it used to cycle because the radiators were too small. I've replaced three of them with radiators that are 50% larger and now it doesn't cycle but I start to melt after an hour! 

 

All in all its not exactly the result I was hoping for. I'm not sure what to do next.

[CV32]

2 hours ago, Robbo said:

Don’t even think of looking at Kabola’s then.

We have a Kabola HR300 and it is superb .... We did not fit it though (and subsequently pay the huge price for it), it was already installed when we bought the boat.

[Matt&Jo]

What about hot air blowers.......like planar....

[Motters79]

Thanks everyone or your comments, it seem there is a definate consensus on going for the 4KW. I will also make sure I go for double rads as per peoples comments. There also seems to be a general preference for Webasto as per the other 2 I mentioned. That's good as its the cheaper option ?

[blackrose]

What's the difference between the Thermotop E 4.2kW narrowboat kit and the standard kit? 

[Sea Dog]

11 hours ago, Cheshire cat said:

I've got a Webasto  Thermo E which is 4.2KW and it used to cycle because the radiators were too small. I've replaced three of them with radiators that are 50% larger and now it doesn't cycle but I start to melt after an hour! 

 

All in all its not exactly the result I was hoping for. I'm not sure what to do next.

Sounds perfect to me!  Run it for an hour (or even a bit less), get a tank of hot water and a toasty boat, by which time the stove is back up to running temperature and the Webasto can go back to sleep.  That's exactly how I run my Eberspacher - theres a 1 hour button on the programmer by the bed to make it really easy too.

 

[Boater Sam]

The programming of a Thermotop is different between what is intended as a lorry kit and a boat kit in that the basic one will shut down when the battery is only slightly discharged so that the vehicle can be restarted.

The boat kit keeps going longer on a reducing voltage to account for the other drain from the rest of the boat electrics, like pumps, lights etc

[eid]

11 hours ago, Cheshire cat said:

I've got a Webasto  Thermo E which is 4.2KW and it used to cycle because the radiators were too small. I've replaced three of them with radiators that are 50% larger and now it doesn't cycle but I start to melt after an hour! 

 

All in all its not exactly the result I was hoping for. I'm not sure what to do next.

Open a window.

[Naughty Cal]

35 minutes ago, eid said:

Open a window.

Thats what we do with our blown air Webasto. We keep it running on full power but then regulate the temperature by opening windows and hatches.

 

For what little diesel it uses anyway, 0.25 litres per hour on full power, it isn't worth messing around and having it cycling in and out and coking up.

[Cheshire cat]

I installed the bigger radiators over the summer so it's earl days yet. Maybe when the colder weather arrives a combination of windows and letting the stove take over will be the answer. 

 

I don't think the control that comes with a Webasto has a +1 hour feature. Just on, off and a simple timer so I tend to operate it manually.