WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 5 hours ago, nb Innisfree said: Just to be clear I arranged a link to enable boat RCD when off SP and on inverter power. 57 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: I provided a manual link immediately after the Victron, that way I had the choice of RCD or not when using the Victron off grid. So what were you talking about when you wrote Boat E/N link could be anywhere between SP inlet and onboard RCD ? The boat shouldn’t have a N-E link. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 1 hour ago, WotEver said: So what were you talking about when you wrote ? The boat shouldn’t have a N-E link. Ever. Well it could be anywhere between those two points, someone may have installed one. How can onboard RCD work without a N-E link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 11 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: Well it could be anywhere between those two points, someone may have installed one. How can onboard RCD work without a N-E link? If someone has installed one then he/she shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near mains wiring. The SOURCE should be N-E linked, just like shore power mains; whether it be a genny, inverter or whatever, (unless it’s centre-tapped). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, WotEver said: If someone has installed one then he/she shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near mains wiring. The SOURCE should be N-E linked, just like shore power mains; whether it be a genny, inverter or whatever, (unless it’s centre-tapped). Well I linked our inverter, on its load side, if someone wanted to plug into shore power it would need to be disabled. How do you differentiate between shorepower link, and one onboard? Boat N-E link, onboard N-E link, onboard inverter N-E link, onboard off grid power source N-E link? Sorry but I'm being a bit thick here, are you saying that there should never be a N-E link on board a boat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 46 minutes ago, WotEver said: If someone has installed one then he/she shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near mains wiring. The SOURCE should be N-E linked, just like shore power mains; whether it be a genny, inverter or whatever, (unless it’s centre-tapped). Easy, it only needs 30ma to flow, a genny sitting in wet grass on the bank and a boat with a 60 foot earth rod sitting in water would probably give a good enough path to trip it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 43 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: Well I linked our inverter... Absolutely as it should be. You don’t put some random N-E bond at an indeterminate location within the wiring, you bond the source. Just as you have done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 45 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: are you saying that there should never be a N-E link on board a boat? As part of the boat’s wiring? Yes. I’m saying that the source should be N-E linked (unless it’s centre-tapped). You link N-E on a genny at the genny (usually with a link within the plug although you could also do it internally). You N-E link an inverter at the inverter output, either with a link in the plug or, if the output is on studs, with a link across the relevant studs (or indeed internally). What you don’t do is to introduce an N-E link in the wiring which could have shore power connected to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 28 minutes ago, WotEver said: As part of the boat’s wiring? Yes. I’m saying that the source should be N-E linked (unless it’s centre-tapped). You link N-E on a genny at the genny (usually with a link within the plug although you could also do it internally). You N-E link an inverter at the inverter output, either with a link in the plug or, if the output is on studs, with a link across the relevant studs (or indeed internally). What you don’t do is to introduce an N-E link in the wiring which could have shore power connected to it. I think you're being pedantic over my use of the word 'boat', our inverter output was wired into the consumer unit and N-E link was installed in that circuit so it was part of the boat's wiring, therefore I referred to it as the boat N-E link, and it was between SP inlet and consumer unit RCD, so my post to the OP was correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 42 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: I think you're being pedantic over my use of the word 'boat', our inverter output was wired into the consumer unit and N-E link was installed in that circuit so it was part of the boat's wiring, therefore I referred to it as the boat N-E link, and it was between SP inlet and consumer unit RCD, so my post to the OP was correct. Then you did it wrong. The link should be on the inverter output. That way, if the inverter is disconnected, as it would be if you were using shore power (unless it has a pass-through function) then the link is also disconnected. The N-E link is only relevant to the source, not the destination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 7 minutes ago, WotEver said: Then you did it wrong. The link should be on the inverter output. That way, if the inverter is disconnected, as it would be if you were using shore power (unless it has a pass-through function) then the link is also disconnected. The N-E link is only relevant to the source, not the destination. Read my post, it was in the inverter output, and it did have a pass through function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 3 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: Read my post, it was in the inverter output, and it did have a pass through function. Then there is nothing to disconnect, is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 15 minutes ago, WotEver said: Then there is nothing to disconnect, is there? Yes, it needs disconnecting if Victron inverter is switched on and therfore on PowerAssist/pass-through to prevent shorepower RCD tripping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 5 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said: Yes, it needs disconnecting if Victron inverter is switched on and therfore on PowerAssist/pass-through to prevent shorepower RCD tripping. A poor implementation of a bond that is quite probably unique to your boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 Just now, WotEver said: A poor implementation of a bond that is quite probably unique to your boat. It's a manual switchable bond as opposed to an automatic one, why is it a poor implementation? Probably more reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 3, 2018 Report Share Posted September 3, 2018 Just now, nb Innisfree said: It's a manual switchable bond as opposed to an automatic one, why is it a poor implementation? Probably more reliable. Anything which requires memory and human intervention is inherently less reliable than an automated solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted September 4, 2018 Report Share Posted September 4, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, WotEver said: Anything which requires memory and human intervention is inherently less reliable than an automated solution. And so easy to make automatic as well in that situation. Edited September 4, 2018 by Robbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted September 4, 2018 Report Share Posted September 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Robbo said: And so easy to make automatic as well in that situation. Absolutely. A 230V NC contactor powered by the shore power input. Sorted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 4, 2018 Report Share Posted September 4, 2018 6 hours ago, Robbo said: And so easy to make automatic as well in that situation. Not so easy if ccing and components are not readily to hand and necessitates a special trip. Sometimes it's a case of utilising available stuff, better a manual link than none at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted September 4, 2018 Report Share Posted September 4, 2018 1 hour ago, nb Innisfree said: Not so easy if ccing and components are not readily to hand and necessitates a special trip. Sometimes it's a case of utilising available stuff, better a manual link than none at all. Screwfix has the components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nb Innisfree Posted September 4, 2018 Report Share Posted September 4, 2018 53 minutes ago, Robbo said: Screwfix has the components. Maybe now but prob not 10+ yrs ago, and trying to locate without Internet or transport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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