Are CaRT aiming for a record...

[Midnight]

.. or just incompetent?
Twenty one stoppage notices today.

How many before we get a refund on the license fee?

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Might be easier and quicker now to have openage notices from CaRT and an openage section on CWDF, rather than stoppages, so  you know where you can cruise, rather than where you can't.

 

Jen

[mrsmelly]

2 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Might be easier and quicker now to have openage notices from CaRT and an openage section on CWDF, rather than stoppages, so  you know where you can cruise, rather than where you can't.

 

Jen

Whilst stoppages are a little annoying things are not realy that bad. So far this year we have been from burton on Trent down to Brentford and right across to Bristol then back and up to Lechlade and now at Calcutt. We have been held up only twice, once for an hour on the south Oxford at pigeons lock whilst a bit of work going on and once for an hour and a half on the Thames when divers were in a lock. That's it since March. Yes I know some areas have had it worse but it's not that important as it hasn't affected my boating ? Many areas are badly overgrown this year though. The system is certainly better than for instance the Coventry canal was when I bought my first live aboard their in 89.

[Rob-M]

I was heading down the southern Stratford but not waiting until Monday so will be winding tomorrow and heading elsewhere.

[1st ade]

Still waiting at Wootton Rivers bottom lock as we have been since noonish yesterday. We're told we MIGHT move tomorrow AM which is still going to be tight to return the boat to Great Bedwyn by tomorrow night.

 

It's the only stoppage that's affected us this year but then we've only had the one major trip this year!

[Dave123]

That pump seems to be constantly breaking!

[1st ade]

1 hour ago, 1st ade said:

Still waiting at Wootton Rivers bottom lock as we have been since noonish yesterday. We're told we MIGHT move tomorrow AM which is still going to be tight to return the boat to Great Bedwyn by tomorrow night.

 

It's the only stoppage that's affected us this year but then we've only had the one major trip this year!

I (partly) take it back - four chaps from CaRT, spoke to all hire boats; update (expected to be "open, get on with it") early tomorrow and for good measure a tour of the pumping station!

[David Mack]

5 hours ago, Midnight said:

.. or just incompetent?
Twenty one stoppage notices today.

How many before we get a refund on the license fee?

 

I have had a lot of alerts from CRT today, but not all are 'Stoppage' notices - some are 'Openage' notices indicating a relaxation of restrictions on the Rochdale and Leeds & Liverpool. 

[JohnEW2912]

And the Glasson branch on the Lancaster has also reopened on restricted hours.

[alan_fincher]

You don't actually have to have a stoppage notice to mean that you can't go somewhere.  There is no stoppage notice, (not even an advisory notice), for Napton Locks, but boats like ours cannot go through one of them, because the sides have moved inwards, and it is too narrow.

 

Unlike some replying above, there are certainly places we could not go this year, (and will never be able to, unless CRT find money to fix them).

[john6767]

There have been stoppage notices coming out for the winter works, were these 21 in addition to those?

[StephenA]

2 hours ago, David Mack said:

 

I have had a lot of alerts from CRT today, but not all are 'Stoppage' notices - some are 'Openage' notices indicating a relaxation of restrictions on the Rochdale and Leeds & Liverpool. 

and a pile of them were to do with Sanitary stations....

[Midnight]

6 hours ago, john6767 said:

There have been stoppage notices coming out for the winter works, were these 21 in addition to those?

No only stoppage notices for 28th to 29th August

[rowland al]

14 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

... for Napton Locks, but boats like ours cannot go through one of them, because the sides have moved inwards, and it is too narrow.

.

If it’s the one we went through a few weeks ago, there was very limited clearance. 

 

When you say “boats like ours” what do you mean specifically? Which part of the boat won’t go through? 

[alan_fincher]

5 hours ago, rowland al said:

If it’s the one we went through a few weeks ago, there was very limited clearance. 

 

When you say “boats like ours” what do you mean specifically? Which part of the boat won’t go through? 

Historic boats originally built to a width of 7' 1/2", rather than the modern norm of 6' 10". (Many probably have bits now that are a bit wider than that, due to "old age", ours is estimated at 7' 1".

 

Most of it wouldn't go in, as it was the front of the boat that stuck in the lock mouth.

 

Details here.

 

I have just been told of two other historic boats that didn't stick last year, but did this year, so there is every evidence that the lock wall is continuing to move, and the lock getting narrower.

Edited August 30, 2018 by alan_fincher

[Tuscan]

They had to pull Mikron out very recently I believe

[David Mack]

1 hour ago, Tuscan said:

They had to pull Mikron out very recently I believe

Not surprised. I heard years ago that Tyseley had spread when the cabin front bulkhead was welded in, and so the hull can't be pulled back in (without major work). 

 

I'm curious to find whether Belfast has the same problem. But although I would like to head north from London via the Thames and Oxford Canal, I don't want to get that far and find the boat doesn't fit. So I'll try from the other end first!

[rowland al]

5 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

Historic boats originally built to a width of 7' 1/2", rather than the modern norm of 6' 10". (Many probably have bits now that are a bit wider than that, due to "old age", ours is estimated at 7' 1".

 

Most of it wouldn't go in, as it was the front of the boat that stuck in the lock mouth.

 

Details here.

 

I have just been told of two other historic boats that didn't stick last year, but did this year, so there is every evidence that the lock wall is continuing to move, and the lock getting narrower.

 

So, being in such a minority do C&RT have an interest in fulfilling the requirements of what they may now consider a handfull of oversized boats? 

 

 

 

[alan_fincher]

46 minutes ago, rowland al said:

 

So, being in such a minority do C&RT have an interest in fulfilling the requirements of what they may now consider a handfull of oversized boats?

 

The boats are not oversized, of course, they were built to be able to fit the locks, but CRT (and BW before them) have allowed the locks to become undersized.

 

I'm not expecting you to believe we are doing other people a favour, but the reality is that if the original dimensions of the locks are allowed to be lost, then eventually even modern boats built 2" or more narrower will get stuck.

 

Hurleston bottom lock is the most obvious example, where increasingly newer build boats are getting stuck.

The guy who helped extract us from Napton said that by no means all the call outs for boats jammed  into it are for ex working boats. How many of the modern "fails" are due to ignoring warnings about having pipe fenders dangling I'm not sure though.

Filance lock is another examply that has trapped modern boats, not to mention the current issues at Marple.

I wonder which ultimately will  cost CRT more - constantly turning out to deal with stuck boats, (the guy at Napton says it is now several times a month), or actually ffixing it.

[Allan(nb Albert)]

On 29/08/2018 at 11:14, Midnight said:

.. or just incompetent?
Twenty one stoppage notices today.

How many before we get a refund on the license fee?

I guess this refers to my tweet -
 

Quote

Its the height of the Summer Holidays and @CanalRiverTrust has 21 Emergency Navigation Closures in place. Most are due to infrastructure failure rather than water resources.

... which follows a tweet three weeks ago - 
 

Quote

14 emergency navigation closures today on Canal & River Trust navigations - the majority have nothing to do with drought.

C&RT's response, perhaps deliberately, rather missed the point - 
 

Quote

Unfortunately, we have had closures through our network, mainly due to the weather. We agree infrastructure need maintaining and our local teams are on the case to make improvements. We are a charity though so we have to prioritise things as we don't have unlimited funding.

With apologies to the Jackson Five, perhaps they should be blaming it on the boogie ...

[Allan(nb Albert)]

With regard to the headline - 'Are CaRT aiming for a record...'

I have only been monitoring C&RT's 'Emergency Navigation Closures' for the last 2-3 months. In June and July the number of closures were between 11 and 16. In August  the numbers began to rise as closures due to 'navigational drought' kicked in, culminating in 21 closures. Today's figure is 19.

As such, it seems that 21 is a record. That is , unless anyone knows better!

It is important to remember that overnight closures due to 'navigational drought' are included as as part of the 58 current 'Navigation Restrictions' rather than 'Emergency Navigation Closures'

[john6767]

If the 21 include restrictions on locks with overnight closures as well as full closures, how many of them are actually full closures and not just time restrictions?

[Allan(nb Albert)]

46 minutes ago, john6767 said:

If the 21 include restrictions on locks with overnight closures as well as full closures, how many of them are actually full closures and not just time restrictions?

Sorry, I thought my post made it clear. The 21 emergency navigation closures do not include overnight closures. They are full closures. Most are 'until further notice'.

 

[furnessvale]

15 hours ago, rowland al said:

 

So, being in such a minority do C&RT have an interest in fulfilling the requirements of what they may now consider a handfull of oversized boats? 

 

 

 

Should CRT ever get their way and remove old wider deeper boats from the system, they will then take a massive maintenance holiday from doing things like dredging and pulling out lock walls.

 

Eventually the whole system will be <2ft deep with locks 6' 10" wide.  At that point, all the pleasure boats whose owners scream blue murder if they as much as graze the bottom when coming into the side will have all the fun that ex working boat owners have had for years,  but we won't be there anymore to find the rocks, shallow and tight bits and get CRT to do something about it before others have even noticed.

 

George

[alan_fincher]

2 hours ago, furnessvale said:

Should CRT ever get their way and remove old wider deeper boats from the system, they will then take a massive maintenance holiday from doing things like dredging and pulling out lock walls.

 

Eventually the whole system will be <2ft deep with locks 6' 10" wide.  At that point, all the pleasure boats whose owners scream blue murder if they as much as graze the bottom when coming into the side will have all the fun that ex working boat owners have had for years,  but we won't be there anymore to find the rocks, shallow and tight bits and get CRT to do something about it before others have even noticed.

 

George

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Exactly this!