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Opinions on a 60' trad for sale?


jetzi

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11 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

As far as I can tell, Mike is glued to this forum 24/7

I'm glued 12/6. I have Sundays off for obvious reasons.

16 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

60' is more length than a small girl can handle.

Don't tell Ellen that, she's only 5 foot 2

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15 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I think that is correct, probably to remove the rose glasses

Trojan Batteries, a good make of inverter and other good stuff

 

 

Agree 

Trojan batteries can easily be trashed in three months Ditchie. How old are they and how well looked after? Just sayin like. ?

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1 minute ago, mrsmelly said:

Trojan batteries can easily be trashed in three months Ditchie. How old are they and how well looked after? Just sayin like. ?

I fully agree but so can Marine Leisure dual purpose 110ah at £45 a shot. I am just saying he didn't go and buy the cheapest stuff he could find. I would if I was offloading it.

 

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1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

Post an example then, I'm genuinely interested in what you find for a similar price which would be far better.

It looks a hell of a lot tidier than mine!  I'm pretty jealous actually!

£45k gets you well and truly into ex hire boat territory where you really can't go wrong.  

 

Or something like this https://www.apolloduck.com/boat.phtml?id=566126 - probably sold for about £40k and a Colecraft with a Beta will resell easily if you didn't like it.

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1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

The challenge has been set. Will Mtb rise to the occasion? Is dora genuinely genuinely interested? Is Mtb trawling the internet sites as we speak, or is he up the pub?

 

Tune in next week to find out folk!

 

Nope. 

 

But that KASTAWAY is a superior boat in every respect. Even has a washing machine!

 

And this time last year I bought a cracking Orion tug in immaculate condition, vintage engine, lovely boat, again a better boat in every respect, for less than £45k. 

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1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

£45k gets you well and truly into ex hire boat territory where you really can't go wrong.  

 

Or something like this https://www.apolloduck.com/boat.phtml?id=566126 - probably sold for about £40k and a Colecraft with a Beta will resell easily if you didn't like it.

I reckon the Colecraft edges it but there are aspects in which the London Boat wins. It depends on what your priorities are. Main issue is that the Colecraft isn’t for sale. 

 

Ex-hire boats don’t really work for liveaboards. All beds and no storage. Rarely have the heating and leccy generating stuff needed. So the OP would be forking out a fair bit on altering the interior. Far more than swapping a cross bed for a lengthwise bed. 

 

Best to get something which fits your needs in the first place. 

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1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

I reckon the Colecraft edges it but there are aspects in which the London Boat wins. It depends on what your priorities are. Main issue is that the Colecraft isn’t for sale. 

 

Ex-hire boats don’t really work for liveaboards. All beds and no storage. Rarely have the heating and leccy generating stuff needed. So the OP would be forking out a fair bit on altering the interior. Far more than swapping a cross bed for a lengthwise bed. 

 

Best to get something which fits your needs in the first place. 

I think that's a bit of a sweeping generalisation - hire boats usually have central heating, many have decent inverters (punters bring hair driers etc and expect to use them), modern cooking facilities and mains fridges etc etc. Layouts can be versatile - second beds are often daytime dinettes anyway and a bunk room is very easily turned into an office. Above all, they are solidly built, well maintained and durable.

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9 hours ago, starman said:

I think that's a bit of a sweeping generalisation - hire boats usually have central heating, many have decent inverters (punters bring hair driers etc and expect to use them), modern cooking facilities and mains fridges etc etc. Layouts can be versatile - second beds are often daytime dinettes anyway and a bunk room is very easily turned into an office. Above all, they are solidly built, well maintained and durable.

Both liveaboards I know who bought ex hire boats ended up stripping them out completely and starting again.  The layout just wasn't right for living on and the interiors were pretty worn out because hirers aren't generally going to care as much.  The heating on most hire boats is a gas boiler alone.  Too expensive and impractical (and not really warm enough) for a sole heating source in winter.

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26 minutes ago, Boater Sam said:

Would you buy an ex private hire car that had been run to death? Or an ex taxi?

Yes - I have had several Ex-Company cars, serviced every 4 weeks, high mileage but very well maintained.

My last NB was an ex hire boat - 9000 hours on the engine and immaculate inside, didn't use a drop of oil and engine bay spotlessly clean

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14 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

that KASTAWAY is a superior boat in every respect. Even has a washing machine!

 

13 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

the Colecraft edges it but there are aspects in which the London Boat wins

 

13 hours ago, WotEver said:

MUCH nicer boat than the OP’s link :)

 

I just don't see it! It would be really really helpful if you guys could explain what respects Kastaway is better than the London boat? She's five years younger and a Colecraft, and has a washing machine. But the engine has 10x the hours and sounds like there is no solar. Is there anything I'm missing?

Kind of a moot point as she's not up for sale, but I think Kastaway would have been too small for us anyway, as she apparently has a large cruiser stern. We really were after a 70'er, but the London boat, as a trad and with an appropriate layout, felt like she'd just be big enough.

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1 hour ago, ivan&alice said:

 

 

I just don't see it! It would be really really helpful if you guys could explain what respects Kastaway is better than the London boat? She's five years younger and a Colecraft, and has a washing machine. But the engine has 10x the hours and sounds like there is no solar. Is there anything I'm missing?

Kind of a moot point as she's not up for sale, but I think Kastaway would have been too small for us anyway, as she apparently has a large cruiser stern. We really were after a 70'er, but the London boat, as a trad and with an appropriate layout, felt like she'd just be big enough.

There are others around, this for example

https://www.apolloduck.com/boat.phtml?id=567122

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2 hours ago, ivan&alice said:

 

 

I just don't see it! It would be really really helpful if you guys could explain what respects Kastaway is better than the London boat? She's five years younger and a Colecraft, and has a washing machine. But the engine has 10x the hours and sounds like there is no solar. Is there anything I'm missing?

Kind of a moot point as she's not up for sale, but I think Kastaway would have been too small for us anyway, as she apparently has a large cruiser stern. We really were after a 70'er, but the London boat, as a trad and with an appropriate layout, felt like she'd just be big enough.

Kastaway is (was) a one owner boat that has been well used and it screams quality.   Yes it is a Colecraft and any narrowboater would be proud to own it - who are Wessex Narrowboats?  The interior is top quality and looks pretty much original unlike the London boat where they have painted over the linings - why would they do that?  Forget about engine hours, with diesel engines servicing is all, and you can bet the Kastaway has had oil/filter changes on the nail.  There will be Beta engines around with 20,000 hours and more.  I would buy a well used boat over one that has sat stagnant in the cut any day.  Low engine hours on an older boat is not a good selling point, unless it's a new engine.  Kastaway has no solar because she's obviously been on the move continuously.  But Solar is so cheap these days it really isn't a consideration.  

 

However, probably the most important factor with a boat such as Kastaway is that for a first time buy there is virtually no risk.  If you bought it and it didn't suit, or you found you just didn't take to canal boating, this sort of boat will sell for a decent price all day long - you can't say the same about the London boat.  It's vital as a first time buyer that you get something you know for certain will sell easily. 

 

 

 

 

 

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Regarding the hull builder, I agree more information is needed:

1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

Kastaway is (was) a one owner boat that has been well used and it screams quality.   Yes it is a Colecraft and any narrowboater would be proud to own it - who are Wessex Narrowboats?

 

I did what I could to find out information about the hull, this is what I posted:

On 15/08/2018 at 11:37, ivan&alice said:

I searched the forum and I found hints that Wessex Narrowboats were a hire company (see here and here)  so if they did any work on boats themselves I'd assume it would be the fit out. I also see that Wessex were bought out by Alvechurch (see here and here) who it seems aren't that renowned as hull builders. So that information does support your theory that Dave Clarke built the hull and Wessex fitted it out for hire purposes? That makes the boat more appealing as the fit out seems to have changed quite a bit in the last few years.

 

If anyone could give me any information at all about her pedigree, that would be most helpful.

 

1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

Low engine hours on an older boat is not a good selling point, unless it's a new engine.

I'm sorry but I simply don't buy this. Just because an engine has not been run to death does not mean it has not been well maintained. I may not know boats but I know enough about engines to know that they wear, over and above what general maintenance can fix.
 

 

1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

The interior is top quality and looks pretty much original unlike the London boat where they have painted over the linings - why would they do that?

I believe this is most posters' primary objection to her - folks don't like the non-original interior. Granted, this will make her harder to sell, but frankly I don't care what colour the walls are, personally.

 

 

1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

Solar is so cheap these days it really isn't a consideration.  


I don't buy this, either. The panels are 120 gbp each  (http://www.buypvdirect.co.uk/Perlight_250W_PV_Panel), the batteries are 150 each (https://www.tayna.co.uk/industrial-batteries/trojan/t-105/) and the invertor 770 gbp (https://www.sunstore.co.uk/product/victron-phoenix-compact-inverter-1200w-to-2000w-12v-24v/). At a guess I'll add on another 250 for wiring, switches, sockets and mounts, and another 250 for installation. That's well over 2kgbp worth of kit to buy new, apart from the hassle involved in getting it done.

 

1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

for a first time buy there is virtually no risk.  If you bought it and it didn't suit, or you found you just didn't take to canal boating, this sort of boat will sell for a decent price all day long - you can't say the same about the London boat.  It's vital as a first time buyer that you get something you know for certain will sell easily.  

This is by far your most persuasive argument to me as resaleability is the biggest factor in my decision. Why won't this boat sell, if we get her for a reasonable price and offer her for a reasonable price? Are there simply no boaters interested in white walls? Or is it all about the hull builder - some folks simply must have a Colecraft?

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8 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

 

This is by far your most persuasive argument to me as resaleability is the biggest factor in my decision. Why won't this boat sell, if we get her for a reasonable price and offer her for a reasonable price? Are there simply no boaters interested in white walls? Or is it all about the hull builder - some folks simply must have a Colecraft?

 

Because once away from London, this looks like a £30-35k boat to me. You will be paying (and losing) the 'London premium' should you buy this boat for £45k and find you want to sell up in a year having moved her away from London. (Moving away is your plan, isn't it?) 

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3 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

Because once away from London, this looks like a £30-35k boat to me. You will be paying (and losing) the 'London premium' should you buy this boat for £45k and find you want to sell up in a year having moved her away from London. (Moving away is your plan, isn't it?)

As I've said before, I also just don't buy this idea of a "London premium".

 

Firstly, the data doesn't support it. I put 40 or 50 asking prices into a spreadsheet and run the numbers against the distance from London. No correlation whatsoever. Of course it could be that there are confounding factors or it could just be chance. A possible theory is that if there is a London premium it's counteracted by the fact that most London boats are sold by owner rather than marina.

Secondly, it doesn't stand to reason. If you could get 50% more for a boat in London, why in the hell would anyone sell a boat up country for 30K when they could drive it to London and sell her for 45? Boats move, after all. Moving around is our plan, moving away is not - we would be more than happy to drive her to London to sell her for an extra 15 grand, and it boggles my mind that others would not.

If we were able to get this boat for 30-35K, would you agree that the boat would be a good buy? It's a tricky one because we do intend to go look at the marinas outside of the capital over the next few weeks, but we also don't want to lose a boat that's potentially a good fit for us.

Some tough decisions to be made this weekend!!

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Thanks for all the advice everyone, it's a moot point as we just got a call to say the boat was just sold for cash. She's been on the market for a week. Gutted. So much for being difficult to sell on, eh? I think the market may have moved on considerably since many of you bought your boats!

At least this means we'll be able to get to see some boats inland now...

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4 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

Thanks for all the advice everyone, it's a moot point as we just got a call to say the boat was just sold for cash. She's been on the market for a week. Gutted. So much for being difficult to sell on, eh? I think the market may have moved on considerably since many of you bought your boats!

At least this means we'll be able to get to see some boats inland now...

Dave's steelwork is as good if not better than Colecraft. As I said very early on to you, don't ask for buying advice here. They don't know the builders well or the trade well.

Good luck with your search, there will be a boat out there, just got to find it.. ;)

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2 hours ago, Stilllearning said:

Not doubting you, but I can’t find the link to the boat for sale.

https://www.waterwaysworld.com/boatsearch/index.cgi?action=search&min_price=30000&min_length=60&style=semitrad&max_price=40000&max_length=999&min_year=&order=cheapest

 

I was wrong - it's an asking price of £36k.  I blame @Richard T for saying it was £30k :D

 

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