Jump to content

Charity Shop Print (Thames)


mark99

Featured Posts

48 minutes ago, mark99 said:

Guess location = Thames near Lotts Road former power station?

 

image.png.d53b03deb510a500e73e8720a1b04dd0.png

View showing Wandsworth gas works on t'other side of the river perhaps, unless there was another one further down.

I assumed that the view is from the far end of what is now Chelsea harbour which was next to Lots road PS - the river is wide there - but there's a large church there and two bridges - so Mar99's guess below of Fulham is better. 'cept Fulhan is on the northern bank. So I'll stic with Wandsworth on the banks of the river Wandle.

Edited by OldGoat
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 Beckton gas works?. The boats in the foreground are on the barge roads which are still there - forgotten the name but its above Barking Creek on the Thamesmead side of the River. 

 

wp7282c875_05_06.jpg

 

Eta or is that a bridge to the far left on the print ? If so then obviously not Beckton as that's below the bridges. 

Edited by magnetman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hard to say with the style of painting. Looks more like shoreline to me with buildings.

 

Hang on - is that large bulky vessel near centre meant to be the Woolwich Ferry? Could be.

If that is the case, it could be a view from Greenwich (on the South, right hand side) looking past where the barrier now is. Just a thought.

Edited by Derek R.
added text
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If it is the other bank of the river then it indicates that there is a sharp bend so possibly a view from Limehouse hole (where canary wharf pier is now) down towards Deptford and Greenwich. 

 

Its possible the gas holders were made more prominent for artistic effect and that it is Rotherhithe gas works. 

 

The barges in the foreground are painted as if they are narrow boats but the detail shows lighter shaped ends. 

 

It would make sense if the picture was a view from near Limehouse that narrow boats would have influenced the artist because there would have been a lot of them about. 

 

There was a large timber processing yard at Limehouse hole which could well have had a large derrick crane as shown to the right of the painting. 

 

 

Or

 

View from Jamestown way on Isle of dogs beside the entrance to the now derelict east India dock basin. 

 

There was a large power station there  = lots of lighters. 

 

Opposite is Greenwich peninsular where there was a gas works. And the river bends round to the left downstream of there off towards Woolwich. 

 

For some reason I can't do Google map links. 

 

 

Edited by magnetman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

My logic was perhaps that was Battersea PS on the far bank. Although it does look like Dover!

 

And Battersea PS used only to have two chimneys.

Edited by mark99
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dover. Well, not unless the English Channel has the capacity for rafts of lighters tied to tiers by some piers with cranes on just offshore. But I can see what you mean.

I think Magnetman is close with Beckton piers and gasworks. The distinct lack of detail supplied by the artist confuses too, those are almost certainly meant to be lighters and not narrow boats.

If it depicts Beckton looking upstream towards Woolwich, then with some artistic licence he or she may have decided to include a ferry (if indeed it is meant to be that) for greater interest. But white cliffs in the distance, I think they are not. It would appear the artist wanted to convey the craft in the industrial foreground than attempt distant detail.

 

OS 1:25000 1937 - 1961

http://tinyurl.com/ycdhsl8g

 

Looking at Marks link to Lots Road Power Station, the painting depicting same by Francis Griffen is quite a different style to that in the original image. Griffen does better detail.

 

Some interesting images:

https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Beckton_Gasworks

Edited by Derek R.
Added text
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Derek R. said:

Dover. Well, not unless the English Channel has the capacity for rafts of lighters tied to tiers by some piers with cranes on just offshore. But I can see what you mean.

I think Magnetman is close with Beckton piers and gasworks. The distinct lack of detail supplied by the artist confuses too, those are almost certainly meant to be lighters and not narrow boats.

If it depicts Beckton looking upstream towards Woolwich, then with some artistic licence he or she may have decided to include a ferry (if indeed it is meant to be that) for greater interest. But white cliffs in the distance, I think they are not. It would appear the artist wanted to convey the craft in the industrial foreground than attempt distant detail.

 

OS 1:25000 1937 - 1961

http://tinyurl.com/ycdhsl8g

 

Looking at Marks link to Lots Road Power Station, the painting depicting same by Francis Griffen is quite a different style to that in the original image. Griffen does better detail.

 

Some interesting images:

https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Beckton_Gasworks

I don't get the Beckton connection - I worked in that gasworks for quite a while when it was derelict (I cleared out a lot of plant prior to wholesale land remediation in prep to sell off a load of acres). I found the remains of retorts as we dug out trenches to divert high pressure mains out of the site.

 

I still think it's around Lotts Road or Fulham Power Station looking to Battersea/Wands. I must admit I did assume Griffen as he sketched/painted around Fulham/Chelsea - trying too hard to make the link.

 

Perhaps if I purchase the print it will have something to ID it in the inside of frame.

 

Of course it may not even be the Thames!

 

 

Here is Fulham Power Station - near Fulham Gas works and Lotts Road Power.

 

https://rbkclocalstudies.wordpress.com/2012/03/01/the-case-of-the-missing-chimneys-lots-road-power-station/

 

There is a chain of boats in the images and two Waterless Gas Holders which with eye of faith correlate to the print.  :)

Edited by mark99
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is the Thames as the detail of the barges is accurate and they are Thames lighters. 

 

If the cliffs in the background are indicating a bend in the river without detail then I would go with my earlier suggestion of it being a view from Limehouse hole. Approximately where canary wharf pier is now or perhaps a few hundred yards inland from there. 

 

There aren't that many places where the river bends that tightly. 

 

Where is this charity shop ;)

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, magnetman said:

 

Where is this charity shop ;)

 

 

 

Fulham.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nah Leatherhead.  :)

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, cuthound said:

Ah yes, the White Cliffs of Beckton, I remember seeing them when I worked at a data centre in East India Dock. ?

Not forgetting 'Beckton Alps' of course. Such bracing air and scenery.

 

If it were Limehouse, or in the vicinity of Limehouse entrance to the South & West India Docks, there would be no gas holders to be seen, as there aren't any in maps from 1888 - 1961. If it were Lots Road (one T) on the right, where is the New Battersea Bridge carrying the West London Extension Railway across the river, as it would be prominent in the picture. If it were Wandsworth on the right (and looking East) - where is Wandsworth Bridge, which again would be prominent. Also, there are no piers shown in said maps. Another factor might be against it being 'above bridges': if - and it is an 'if' (as what I have seen as a Ferry might well be considered a low hull with bankside derricks or otherwise beyond), one of those vessels were a depiction of the Woolwich Ferry, or a vessel with masts that did not lower, it wouldn't be able to go above bridges.

 

However, we are debating a somewhat crude painting by an artist who may well have collated various aspects of London River into his chosen image. Even if his rendition of White Cliffs or buildings on a shoreline were a bridge of sorts, it's a long way away, and a poor effort at that. Still, and interesting picture, though one I wouldn't give wall space to.

Edited by Derek R.
Added text
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This print held by MOL shows a similar scene 

 

http://www.museumoflondonprints.com/image/322740/avery-illustrations-thames-riverscape-showing-south-metropolitan-gas-works-and-clarence-wharf-1937

 

Rotherhithe gas works

 

322740.jpg

 

A view from somewhere in Wapping around where King Edwards Memorial park now is .

Edited by magnetman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, magnetman said:

This print held by MOL shows a similar scene 

 

http://www.museumoflondonprints.com/image/322740/avery-illustrations-thames-riverscape-showing-south-metropolitan-gas-works-and-clarence-wharf-1937

 

Rotherhithe gas works

 

322740.jpg

 

A view from somewhere in Wapping around where King Edwards Memorial park now is .

 

Greenwich was more likely......

 

 

image.png.40e5b1ba36bae443be14ce9e301d5d7b.png

 

https://britainfromabove.org.uk/en/image/EPW009758

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, magnetman said:

The panorama mentioned is in a book I have by Chris Elmers and Alex Werner entitled 'London's Lost Riverscape' ISBN 0-670-81263-3, and is included in the back of the book in complete, if small version. The bulk of the book contains a selected number of full page images continuing from London Bridge to Greenwich on the North side, and Greenwich to London Bridge on the South. All images are taken from a craft on the river by an anonymous photographer contracted by Avery Illustrations in 1937 for the PLA. It's a wonderful insight to the activities of shipping and the wharves and warehouses, not forgetting the many docks and boat building yards throughout. But there's no clues as to where our 'artist' might have chosen his viewpoint! Nor do the images in the panorama extend to Beckton.

 

'Dockland Life' by the same authors ISBN 1-85158-364-5 is every bit as fascinating, as is 'Dockland' ISBN 0-901987-80-8, edited by  Skal Naib from a large variety of contributors each with their own chapter. Both profusely illustrated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Stilllearning said:

Just out of interest, is it still for sale in the charity shop, and if so, for how much?

 

This is the silly thing. I went in there and asked how much and the chap said I don't know come back tomorrow.

 

I won't be back there till tomorrow so can't check. I suspect it will be a tenner or so. It's medium size in a brass skinney frame. Happy to buy it for anyone that wants it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, mark99 said:

 

This is the silly thing. I went in there and asked how much and the chap said I don't know come back tomorrow.

 

I won't be back there till tomorrow so can't check. I suspect it will be a tenner or so. It's medium size in a brass skinney frame. Happy to buy it for anyone that wants it.

If it is around a tenner and has the initials K H possibly in red plus a date (there may be a label on the back) we would be interested and would pay postage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.