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Lack of platforms at locks


GuyBarry

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Hi - I live close to Weston Lock (lock 6 on the river Avon navigation) and I often help out there just for fun.  I'm not a C&RT volunteer, I just got hold of my own lock windlass and started helping the crews through.  I think I've got pretty good at it.  I don't have a boat of my own.

 

Last week I decided I'd like a bit more of an adventure and went up to the flight of locks at the start of the Kennet & Avon canal.  I'd been warned about the deep lock but I knew how the gate mechanism worked and was prepared for it.

 

What I wasn't prepared for was the lack of platforms to allow you to cross the canal.  At lock 7 (the bottom lock) there's one at the lower end but none at the top end.  At lock 8/9 (the deep lock) there's none whatsoever and you have to use the road bridge.  There's a bridge at lock 10 but not at lock 11 or 12.  I actually got stranded at lock 12 because I was on the side away from the towpath and I couldn't get the gate to close.  The platform was at my end, so I had to shout for help.  Eventually two passers-by came across at the top end and helped me close the gate.  There's a bridge at lock 13 (the top lock) so that was OK.

 

It seems that the only way of getting across at some of the locks, if the platform is unavailable, is to walk across the top of the beam.  I've got poor balance and there's no way I'd contemplate doing that.  I can't begin to work out how I'd get over the supports in the middle of the lock gates.

 

Is it like this generally on the canal network?  I was hoping I'd be able to help out at other locks but I may not be able to.  Weston Lock has platforms at both ends and I'm quite comfortable working it.

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1 hour ago, GuyBarry said:

Is it like this generally on the canal network?  I was hoping I'd be able to help out at other locks but I may not be able to.  Weston Lock has platforms at both ends and I'm quite comfortable working it.

In my limited travels, the only place I remember is the top lock gates of Bosley flight on the Macclesfield canal..

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Almost always there are walkways, or at least a handrail above the lock beam, at each end of the lock.

 

It's some time since we were on the K and A, but I recall that the stirrups fitted to some of the beams were a bit awkward, especially when getting down from the lock beam. Also, if memory serves, there were conical cappings at the outboard end of the beams, which were definitely "no step" areas, as sloping and slippy!

 

I can't recall problems crossing gates, but, thinking about it, that could be because the crew worked one side of the lock and the steerer worked the other.

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Many of the locks on the River Lee only have walkways at the bottom end.

 

Haven't done it for quite a few years now, but our son used to scare seven kinds of crap out of us by crossing top gates simply balancing on the top edge.  There is absolutely nothing there to hold on to.

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9 hours ago, GuyBarry said:

It seems that the only way of getting across at some of the locks, if the platform is unavailable, is to walk across the top of the beam. 

This is pretty normal for narrow locks

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Just now, alan_fincher said:

But there will normally still be something yo hold on to, of course.

Quite, so are there actually places where you are expected to cross on the top of the beam with no handrail?  There are places where there is a bridge over the tail of the lock and nothing on the beam and some cross by the beam as a shortcut, but you don’t have to.  I would not be keen on doing that.

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20 minutes ago, RLWP said:

This is pretty normal for narrow locks

The locks on the K & A aren't narrow, they're wide enough for two narrowboats.  They do have handrails alongside the beam at the top of the lock, and I've seen people crossing over them, but I just don't feel confident enough to do it myself.  You have to put your foot in a stirrup to get up onto the beam and then climb over the posts at the point when the lock gates meet.  Then you've got to get down again somehow.  I'm not a gymnast!

 

It's not generally too much a problem because I can usually walk down to the other end of the lock, but if the gates are open then I can't - and as I mentioned, when one of the gates got stuck open I was stranded, which wasn't a pleasant experience.

 

Why are the top gates designed differently from the bottom gates?  At one end you've got paddles in the gates, at the other the paddles are separate.  This isn't the arrangement I'm used to where the paddles are in the gates at both ends.  When the paddles are in the gates you have to have a walkway, because it would be impossible to climb over the paddle mechanism.

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I’m afraid clambering onto the gate beam and crossing with the help of a handrail is just how it is, and how it’s been for 100s of years. Some locks have gate paddles, some have ground paddles, some both or either. Generally locks don’t have gate paddles on the top gates due to the flows created having the potential to sink the boat, but some do either in conjunction with ground paddles, or on their own. Some locks have gate paddles and you still cross over the gate, just avoiding the paddle mechanism.

Edited by nicknorman
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11 minutes ago, GuyBarry said:

The locks on the K & A aren't narrow, they're wide enough for two narrowboats.  They do have handrails alongside the beam at the top of the lock, and I've seen people crossing over them, but I just don't feel confident enough to do it myself.  You have to put your foot in a stirrup to get up onto the beam and then climb over the posts at the point when the lock gates meet.  Then you've got to get down again somehow.  I'm not a gymnast!

 

It's not generally too much a problem because I can usually walk down to the other end of the lock, but if the gates are open then I can't - and as I mentioned, when one of the gates got stuck open I was stranded, which wasn't a pleasant experience.

 

Why are the top gates designed differently from the bottom gates?  At one end you've got paddles in the gates, at the other the paddles are separate.  This isn't the arrangement I'm used to where the paddles are in the gates at both ends.  When the paddles are in the gates you have to have a walkway, because it would be impossible to climb over the paddle mechanism.

It sounds like you don't have huge experience of canal locks generally.

 

It varies hugely, depending on canal, but I suggest that crossing the gates by walking over the balance beam is the most common arrangement overall, whether the locks are wide or narrow.

 

Yes, many do have some kind of platform walkway instead, but I would say it is the rarer arrangement overall.

 

Where you do cross the balance beam, having to dodge the paddle mechanisms is quite normal  - the standard arrangement on locks like the Southern Grand Union, unless gate paddles have been removed at some point.

 

Using steps or stirrups to climb up, and negotiating any gap between handrails is also very normal.

 

if you wish to be able to operate locks anywhere, it is something you will need to develop the confidence for - it goes with the territory.

 

Edited by alan_fincher
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2 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

It sounds like you don't have huge experience of canal locks generally.

 

 

No I don't - this was my first time operating a canal lock, and indeed my first time operating any lock other than Weston Lock on the river Avon (which I can do with confidence).  I had assumed that once you could operate one lock, the others would be much the same, so it came as something of a shock to see what was involved.

 

I've been up and down there a couple of times since then to get some more practice, but I still don't want to risk crossing those beams without supervision.  I might need a lifejacket.

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A lifejacket will not help you much if you cross the top gates of deep empty lock, and fall onto the solid concrete or stone cill.

 

Just do what you feel you can do, and your confidence will probably build with time.

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As has been said crossing in the top of the beam with a handrail is the most common arrangement.  Keep one hand on the rail and go slowly, and if you can get your windlass out the the way so it is not a snag hazard then that frees up both hands.  Whilst I am not going to advise against a lifejacket they do create an additional hazard of getting cought up.  If you were a CRT volunteer then you presumably would have to wear one and I expect they give specific training on the addition hazards when wearing one.

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10 hours ago, GuyBarry said:

Hi - I live close to Weston Lock (lock 6 on the river Avon navigation) and I often help out there just for fun.  I'm not a C&RT volunteer, I just got hold of my own lock windlass and started helping the crews through.  I think I've got pretty good at it.  I don't have a boat of my own.

 

Last week I decided I'd like a bit more of an adventure and went up to the flight of locks at the start of the Kennet & Avon canal.  I'd been warned about the deep lock but I knew how the gate mechanism worked and was prepared for it.

 

What I wasn't prepared for was the lack of platforms to allow you to cross the canal.  At lock 7 (the bottom lock) there's one at the lower end but none at the top end.  At lock 8/9 (the deep lock) there's none whatsoever and you have to use the road bridge.  There's a bridge at lock 10 but not at lock 11 or 12.  I actually got stranded at lock 12 because I was on the side away from the towpath and I couldn't get the gate to close.  The platform was at my end, so I had to shout for help.  Eventually two passers-by came across at the top end and helped me close the gate.  There's a bridge at lock 13 (the top lock) so that was OK.

 

It seems that the only way of getting across at some of the locks, if the platform is unavailable, is to walk across the top of the beam.  I've got poor balance and there's no way I'd contemplate doing that.  I can't begin to work out how I'd get over the supports in the middle of the lock gates.

 

Is it like this generally on the canal network?  I was hoping I'd be able to help out at other locks but I may not be able to.  Weston Lock has platforms at both ends and I'm quite comfortable working it.

 

Can I add a note of caution here. It is obvious that you are not very experienced at lock operation but that you are helping boats at locks 'for fun'. This sounds like a recipe for a potential disaster!! 

 

Both the Avon Trust and CRT run volunteers lock keeper schemes  so I would suggest that before that you do any more that you contact them and get properly trained and authorised

  • Greenie 2
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3 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

Can I add a note of caution here. It is obvious that you are not very experienced at lock operation but that you are helping boats at locks 'for fun'. This sounds like a recipe for a potential disaster!! 

 

 

Well I've had no great difficulty at Weston Lock, and I actually think I've got rather good at it.  I'm often better than some of the inexperienced crews that come through who make all sorts of basic errors.  Many of the people who come through are very grateful to me, especially if they're single-crewed.  I've become friendly with some of the people who run the local boat tours and they've given me a lot of useful guidance.  I've also received various donations (which I never ask for) and the occasional free trip!

 

I've thought about training as a C&RT volunteer but I think the training doesn't start until February (for the new season).  But to be honest I think I'd rather put my experience to use by working as a crew member on one of the commercial boats - I might as well earn money from it if I can.

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17 minutes ago, GuyBarry said:

Well I've had no great difficulty at Weston Lock, and I actually think I've got rather good at it.  I'm often better than some of the inexperienced crews that come through who make all sorts of basic errors.  Many of the people who come through are very grateful to me, especially if they're single-crewed.  I've become friendly with some of the people who run the local boat tours and they've given me a lot of useful guidance.  I've also received various donations (which I never ask for) and the occasional free trip!

 

I've thought about training as a C&RT volunteer but I think the training doesn't start until February (for the new season).  But to be honest I think I'd rather put my experience to use by working as a crew member on one of the commercial boats - I might as well earn money from it if I can.

 

I would strongly advise that you volunteer on the Avon through the trust who would train you in their procedures etc and hopefully support you should something go wrong, Lots of info and application form here:

 

https://www.avonnavigationtrust.org/index.php?id=21

 

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4 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

I would strongly advise that you volunteer on the Avon through the trust who would train you in their procedures etc and hopefully support you should something go wrong, Lots of info and application form here:

 

https://www.avonnavigationtrust.org/index.php?id=21

 

Thanks for the information but that's the Midlands Avon - not the one down here in Bath.

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It would be worth doing some training, and getting hints and tips from experienced boaters. There are a number of things that can go badly wrong in a lock and you need to be aware of these and watch out for them. If you help inexperienced boaters then they will be putting their trust in you and expecting you to know what you are doing.

 

Hazards include:

getting boat on cill when descending.

boat getting caught on protruding bolts in gate etc going up or down (especially long boats that might "ride" the gate).

tiller getting caught under walkway or gate going up

boat, especially front fender, getting hooked under of over top of gate, up and down

pairs of wider boats getting jammed, especially if side fenders down

side of boat caught on slightly protruding brickwork

sudden surging of boats due to paddles opened too much too soon (can occur after time delay)

single boat swinging violently from one side to other as lock fills and water goes under boat

people or dogs falling into lock

and more.

You need to know exactly what to do when these things go wrong.

 

Some K&A locks are difficult and some of those foot stirrups can be very difficult, especially if you have wide feet.

 

................Dave

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1 hour ago, GuyBarry said:

The locks on the K & A aren't narrow, they're wide enough for two narrowboats.  They do have handrails alongside the beam at the top of the lock, and I've seen people crossing over them, but I just don't feel confident enough to do it myself.  You have to put your foot in a stirrup to get up onto the beam and then climb over the posts at the point when the lock gates meet.  Then you've got to get down again somehow.  I'm not a gymnast!

 

It's not generally too much a problem because I can usually walk down to the other end of the lock, but if the gates are open then I can't - and as I mentioned, when one of the gates got stuck open I was stranded, which wasn't a pleasant experience.

 

Why are the top gates designed differently from the bottom gates?  At one end you've got paddles in the gates, at the other the paddles are separate.  This isn't the arrangement I'm used to where the paddles are in the gates at both ends.  When the paddles are in the gates you have to have a walkway, because it would be impossible to climb over the paddle mechanism.

On the Grand Union there are no walkways, you just walk on the top of the gate beam, trying not to get too much grease on your clothes. There are decent handrails of course.

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@GuyBarry all locks around the system tend to be different. Which is due to all the different manufacturers that have made them and the spread of private companies / investors that built the inland water ways network over a significant time period. 

I kinda quite like the differences and being young (for on here) tend to not have difficulties crossing (jumping) gates

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8 minutes ago, dmr said:

It would be worth doing some training, and getting hints and tips from experienced boaters. There are a number of things that can go badly wrong in a lock and you need to be aware of these and watch out for them. If you help inexperienced boaters then they will be putting their trust in you and expecting you to know what you are doing.

 

 

 

I never get involved in the boat handling - I stick to the lock operation.  I always explain to people that I'm not an "official" volunteer and that I'm just helping out.  I make sure that the boat's over the cill when it's going down.  When I'm opening the paddles at the top end I do so very cautiously to avoid sudden surges of water (there's a huge leak at that end which doesn't help at all).  I always appreciate advice from experienced boaters (including members of this forum) so thank you very much for all your comments.

 

The C&RT never has volunteers on that stretch of the river as far as I know; I'm told they use them on the flight at the start of the canal proper, although I didn't see any when I was up there.  If I became a C&RT volunteer they'd presumably send me up there rather than using me on the river where I mainly know what I'm doing.

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