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Was asked for money today when coming down foxton by “ becoming a friends of crt”

personally i find it offensive that crt are targetting boat owners  who already pay large sums by stating that by giving to them they will be paying to maintain and protect the canal , Particularly as every sign here has been logo changed already.

it wasnt till i got halfway down that i did the maths and realised that in 35 years of boat ownership 17 of them with 2 boats and 2 bwb moorings i have paid ‘ the waterways’ over £40000. 

What was most enjoyable was hearing a crt worker join in my ‘discussion’ and point out he hadnt had a pay rise for 3 years had to buy his own protective clothing and had better things to do maintaining the canal rather than... putting up new signs.

the only comeback the ‘ friend signing up operative ‘ had was ‘ oh its a different  budget... and every organisation changed its logo...

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They probably didn't recognise the windlass thing you were carrying meant you were a boater as they have actively been discouraged from entering into Friends discussions with boaters recently.

The " its from a different budget " mantra has been quite amazing in its quick rollout to all the chuggers, were they that fast to instill confidence that out waterways were indeed being looked after for future users as per Trust aims.

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I wasnt carrying anything i let the staff  do that..havent pulled a paddle at foxton or watford for years now , after 40 years we are deemed  inexperienced... 

Ah are you saying that they (chugger?)  didnt recognise an ex waterways 1937  motor and would have left me alone had i been in a grey primered  rotten firewood and full elsan base covered 1980s cruiser. 

He even asked if i lived on the boat.....if that had any relevance to his arguments. That got me going i then got accused of blaming the badgers ( who cant defend themselves  for middlewich ) when i explained that a few quid on lengthsmen might have spotted the issue. He then claimed middlewich was vandalism...  

planet crt must be a very mystical place. Oh and they cant trim trees because of nesting birds. Clearly in the 1930s when the canals were maintained the birds were unsuccesful  in raising families , which makes me wonder how in gods name there are so many bashing out the dawn chorus every day, if the  1930s improvements wiped them out...

im going to bed the voltage meter says 12.3... 

 

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I had a conversation with C&RT's marketing director, Simon Salem during C&RT's first year. He was quite proud of the fact that C&RT had convinced government that a regulator was not needed to protect boaters interests. Regarding 'Friends', boaters were not to be targeted by chugging companies because it was his view that they were already contributing enough and no restriction was placed on C&RT that prevented them hiking licence fees such that boaters contributed more in the future.

 

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One of my ex working mates & myself had our annual get together & put all things canal to rights & the "natter" got around to wondering the % of "real" canal workers still left on the books the # we came to (stand correcting) was on the ground guys less than 5% office staff 2% & headquarters staff 0 % if indeed these #'s are somewhere near the mark it's little wonder the upkeep of the waterways & boaters are solow on the list of money being spent

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I was approached at Bingley Five Rise recently. Mr Chugger got most annoyed when I pointed to the "waste of resources", new sewer logo signs. Working in a pair there was Nice Mr Chugger and Nasty Mr Chugger. Nice Mr Chugger was errr... very nice even offered to buy me a coffee, before suggesting I may like to sign up.

Ironically we discussed the new logo colour scheme which I agreed was most refreshing but pointed to the one remaining swan logo interpretation panel which had the same colour scheme as the new signs. You have to give credit to those boys they are in for a lot of 'sewer logo' abuse over the coming weeks.

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I have been asked twice to become a friend of CRT. I don’t mind being asked, a simple no thanks worked both times. I have no problem with them asking, I know some boaters that have signed up. More money the better surely. I happen to think that what we pay to licence a boat is a bargain.

Edited by ianali
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12 minutes ago, ianali said:

I have been asked twice to become a friend of CRT. I don’t mind being asked, a simple no thanks worked both times. I have no problem with them asking, I know some boaters that have signed up. More money the better surely. I happen to think that what we pay to licence a boat is a bargain.

Hear, hear. CRT must spend close to £4 on navigation infrastructure and boaters' services for every £1 we pay them through our licence fees, and I find the level of resentment that they then spend a proportion of their other income on other things quite incredible. I mean, fair enough if you think a particular project is a waste of money, or a particular system is inefficient - that's a matter of opinion - but CRT seem to face a constant barrage of criticism on this forum for daring to spend any money at all on anything not immediately related to boating.

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Are we missing the fundamental point here? The inland waterways network is a national asset which, since it is so important, is grossly underfunded by central government. 

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6 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

Are we missing the fundamental point here? The inland waterways network is a national asset which, since it is so important, is grossly underfunded by central government. 

Problem is that almost everything is underfunded in this country. Look at the state of the roads, railways and buses. There is not enough money.

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10 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

Are we missing the fundamental point here? The inland waterways network is a national asset which, since it is so important, is grossly underfunded by central government. 

True, but how do we alter this?

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28 minutes ago, magictime said:

Hear, hear. CRT must spend close to £4 on navigation infrastructure and boaters' services for every £1 we pay them through our licence fees, and I find the level of resentment that they then spend a proportion of their other income on other things quite incredible. I mean, fair enough if you think a particular project is a waste of money, or a particular system is inefficient - that's a matter of opinion - but CRT seem to face a constant barrage of criticism on this forum for daring to spend any money at all on anything not immediately related to boating.

Only from a certain "ilk" of posters though.

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12 minutes ago, pete.i said:

Only from a certain "ilk" of posters though.

Correct. If I wasn’t out boating and just relied on what I read on this forum I’d probably sell my boat. ‘‘Tis rather a doom and gloom vibe on here at times. We set out late March this year, had a short delay on the Llangollen, cures within an hour by CRT staff. They came out within an hour of a phone call, fixed a loose collar quickly. It’s mostly good out here. Smile and enjoy. 

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23 minutes ago, ianali said:

Problem is that almost everything is underfunded in this country. Look at the state of the roads, railways and buses. There is not enough money.

There's plenty of money - we're one of the richest countries in the world. What there isn't, is a willingness to pay/collect enough of that money in taxes to fund all this stuff.

20 minutes ago, LadyG said:

True, but how do we alter this?

Simple - CRT should just plough every penny into navigation infrastructure and boaters' services. Once the 65 million or so non-boaters in the country see how happy we all are as we swan about on boats that cost more than the house deposit they'll never afford, they'll be clamouring to increase the level of subsidy they provide in order to keep our licence fees so low.

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4 minutes ago, magictime said:

There's plenty of money - we're one of the richest countries in the world. What there isn't, is a willingness to pay/collect enough of that money in taxes to fund all this stuff.

Simple - CRT should just plough every penny into navigation infrastructure and boaters' services. Once the 65 million or so non-boaters in the country see how happy we all are as we swan about on boats that cost more than the house deposit they'll never afford, they'll be clamouring to increase the level of subsidy they provide in order to keep our licence fees so low.

Well il leave you to dream. Time to cast off.

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31 minutes ago, magictime said:

There's plenty of money - we're one of the richest countries in the world. What there isn't, is a willingness to pay/collect enough of that money in taxes to fund all this stuff.

Simple - CRT should just plough every penny into navigation infrastructure and boaters' services. Once the 65 million or so non-boaters in the country see how happy we all are as we swan about on boats that cost more than the house deposit they'll never afford, they'll be clamouring to increase the level of subsidy they provide in order to keep our licence fees so low.

The 65 million are the general public, they have little or no control over government spending.

Its those who control the purse strings who need to be flattered and cajoled into supporting the inland waterways. The idea that the CRT can ever find enough friends to pay for the infrastructure is totally flawed.  And as for paying people to ask towpath walkers to sign up is strange  [I am assuming they won't be able to ask many cyclists], I would expect towpath users are more interested in towpath maintenance than canal maintenance. The main benefit of talking to towpath users would be to raise awareness, just like re-branding.

I have signed up to some charity things, they are to be found in some supermarket exits, and may turn out to be some sort of lottery, I usually cancel after two months. Its an inefficient system.

My charitable donations are made direct to charities. Sorry to say, that would not include CRT, it does not have the emotional appeal of the RNLI,  SSPCA or similar.

Edited by LadyG

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12 minutes ago, ianali said:

Well il leave you to dream. Time to cast off.

No need to dream, but thanks anyway for the patronising tone. It's a plain fact that we're one of the richest countries in the world, and an equally plain fact that our tax burden is about 5% lower than the European average. Is it really so implausible that a £100bn increase in the tax take (c. 5% of GDP) would suffice to keep our infrastructure in better shape? 

 

36 minutes ago, LadyG said:

The 65 million are the general public, they have no control over government spending.

Its those who control the purse strings who need to be flattered and cajoled into supporting the inland waterways. The idea that the CRT can find enough friends to pay for the infrastructure is flawed.  

Yes, but those who control the purse strings are obviously sensitive to what the voting public value and what they don't. Hence the wisdom, to my mind, of encouraging as many people as possible to recognise the stake they hold in the waterways as part of our shared heritage and as somewhere to walk, run, fish, feed the ducks, etc.

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2 minutes ago, magictime said:

No need to dream, but thanks anyway for the patronising tone. It's a plain fact that we're one of the richest countries in the world, and an equally plain fact that our tax burden is about 5% lower than the European average. Is it really so implausible that a £100bn increase in the tax take (c. 5% of GDP) would suffice to keep our infrastructure in better shape? 

 

Yes, but those who control the purse strings are obviously sensitive to what the voting public value and what they don't. Hence the wisdom, to my mind, of encouraging as many people as possible to recognise the stake they hold in the waterways as part of our shared heritage and as somewhere to walk, run, fish, feed the ducks, etc.

There seems to be a subtle movement going on to soften us up for an income tax increase of 1% or so, in order to fund the requirements of the NHS. There is even a petition or two knocking about which, if they reached 100,000, would give the government the excuse to discuss it openly as actually desired by the people. a 1% increase is suggested to raise something between about £4 billion and £6 billion, depending on which source you read... so £100 billion would need a 15% rise in income tax - highly unlikely??

 

Even if the current movement succeeds and we "accept" 1% for the NHS, and even if it is "ring fenced for the NHS", it would not be long before it was usurped into the general tax fund, and the NHS would continue to be underfunded.

 

Having said that... why dont we wait until we leave the EU, then use £9 billion a year to fund the NHS.... no need for any tax increase in the short term!! 

 

 

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37 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

 a 1% increase is suggested to raise something between about £4 billion and £6 billion, depending on which source you read... so £100 billion would need a 15% rise in income tax - highly unlikely??

Well yes, but if you were actually looking to raise £100bn a year, you wouldn't pile that whole burden on to the basic rate of income tax! You'd spread it around between some combination of the different income tax bands, NI, VAT, corporation tax, inheritance tax, assorted duties etc., as well as looking at various allowances and so on, depending on your political priorities.

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1 hour ago, magictime said:

No need to dream, but thanks anyway for the patronising tone. It's a plain fact that we're one of the richest countries in the world, and an equally plain fact that our tax burden is about 5% lower than the European average. Is it really so implausible that a £100bn increase in the tax take (c. 5% of GDP) would suffice to keep our infrastructure in better shape?

It's perfectly possible to find squillions to back questionable armed incursions into foreign countries, prop up ailing banks (and sell them back at a loss to the public purse), and prop up an unpopular government with bungs to a certain Irish political party, so why not spend some of it for the public good?

56 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

in order to fund the requirements of the NHS

And enable the Tories to claim they "care" when it comes to the next election?

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2 hours ago, magictime said:

No need to dream, but thanks anyway for the patronising tone. It's a plain fact that we're one of the richest countries in the world, and an equally plain fact that our tax burden is about 5% lower than the European average. Is it really so implausible that a £100bn increase in the tax take (c. 5% of GDP) would suffice to keep our infrastructure in better shape? 

 

Yes, but those who control the purse strings are obviously sensitive to what the voting public value and what they don't. Hence the wisdom, to my mind, of encouraging as many people as possible to recognise the stake they hold in the waterways as part of our shared heritage and as somewhere to walk, run, fish, feed the ducks, etc.

I honestly didn’t mean to patronise. I completely agree that we should have more than enough money to sort the countries ills. I just don’t ever see it happening. Anyway, many apologises I meant no offence.

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25 minutes ago, ianali said:

I honestly didn’t mean to patronise. I completely agree that we should have more than enough money to sort the countries ills. I just don’t ever see it happening. Anyway, many apologises I meant no offence.

No problem, we've all written things online that have come across differently from what we intended.

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CART generaly do a good job and I still think as others that the licence is good value. However what realy gets my goat is that although I only pay about 20 quid a week for my licence cyclists who rip the towpath to shreds especialy when its wet in the winter pay absolutely diddly squat yet many tear around giving not a jot for the infrastructure.

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