Carbon Monoxide

[Naughty Cal]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5800899/Four-adults-taken-hospital-poisoned-carbon-monoxide-Broads-cruiser.html

[Robbo]

Perhaps it’s time the BSS made it mandatory for those alarms that boaters should be bright enough to have already installed.

Edited June 4, 2018 by Robbo

[Machpoint005]

4 hours ago, Robbo said:

Perhaps it’s time the BSS made it mandatory for those alarms that boaters should be bright enough to have already installed.

I don't disagree, but what's to stop the boaters who are not "bright enough" just taking the batteries out to stop the annoying noise?

[Horace42]

It is surprising the victims were not aware of the risk before being overcome by Carbon monoxide CO.

CO might be odourless, tasteless and colourless, and therefore the reason no one knew that it was there, but CO has to come from somewhere - where the likely sources would be boat engines, faulty gas appliances, faulty stoves, BBQ's, etc, - where there will also be exhaust fumes and smoke - and this is certainly detectable by humans senses at levels soon enough before it becomes dangerous in the short term (but only minutes) - or if ignored and allowed to persist where it could cause harm due to prolonged exposure to low levels that persist after the visible smoke has gone - the 'smell' is still there but the human nose has got used to it.

 

This is not a comment to shrug of the risk, or to  engender complacency,  even the omission of detectors - but to warn anyone smelling or seeing smoke or fumes on their boat, they will be well advised to investigate further to FiIND a CURE - DO NOT IGNORE it.

 

[Robbo]

Just now, Machpoint005 said:

I don't disagree, but what's to stop the boaters who are not "bright enough" just taking the batteries out to stop the annoying noise?

That’s just called Darwin if you remove the batteries to silence a CO alarm!    

[Machpoint005]

3 minutes ago, Robbo said:

That’s just called Darwin if you remove the batteries to silence a CO alarm!    

Only if the perpetrators haven't yet reproduced themselves -- if they have, it's too late for selective evolution! ?

[Robbo]

30 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

Only if the perpetrators haven't yet reproduced themselves -- if they have, it's too late for selective evolution! ?

Does it count if they take out their offspring as well?

[Naughty Cal]

36 minutes ago, Robbo said:

That’s just called Darwin if you remove the batteries to silence a CO alarm!    

You would think so.

 

We know someone who removed the batteries from their CO alarm as their V8 petrol engine set it off everytime they went out 

[Sea Dog]

9 hours ago, Robbo said:

Perhaps it’s time the BSS made it mandatory for those alarms that boaters should be bright enough to have already installed.

You have a point but currently, as I understand it, the BSS is there to protect the innocents around the boat concerned (those moored nearby, walking past, etc) not the occupants. 

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

You have a point but currently, as I understand it, the BSS is there to protect the innocents around the boat concerned (those moored nearby, walking past, etc) not the occupants. 

Correct - the BSS mission :

 

The BSS is in place to help minimise the risks to all visitors to the waterways and the waterways' workforce, and to help protect adjacent property, related to the condition, equipment and use of boats. The BSS is also used to minimise the risk of avoidable pollution from boats.

[Robbo]

26 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

You have a point but currently, as I understand it, the BSS is there to protect the innocents around the boat concerned (those moored nearby, walking past, etc) not the occupants. 

Why mandatory on fire extinguishers then which are really for in aid of escaping from the boat and also to stop the spread of small fires. “Well if I was notified of the fire by the ways of a alarm it would have been small (or notified the neighbours) and not spread to a neighbours boat!”

Edited June 4, 2018 by Robbo

[ditchcrawler]

8 hours ago, Robbo said:

That’s just called Darwin if you remove the batteries to silence a CO alarm!    

When I was working Offshore we use to have people living in "temporary Accommodation" ie Portacabins  at busy times. Smoking was not allowed in there units so some people put polystyrene drink cups over the smoke detectors. This is on a gas production platform.

[bigcol]

Seriously, have had 2 on our coat

never done much but blinked away for years.

 

last week, woke up to a alarm sounding.

i could believe it was happening.

a alarm??  Got out of bed, through the boat as smelt burning

Opened door to wheel house, and smoke!!

open engine hatch, and saw my engine battery smoking and burning smell.

the battery was so hot couldn’t touch it.

luckly the battery is easy to get to and removed the leads and took out side

had to use a tea tower as it was that hot!!

 

looking at the co2 alarm gage it was on 65,  but yes this could have been dagerous

imagine battery open circuit??

 

yep you buy em, they sit on your wall don’t do alot

apart from saving lives!!!!

[Sea Dog]

20 minutes ago, bigcol said:

Seriously, have had 2 on our coat

We also have two - one by the bed, one by the stove. 

 

However, my coat has to take its chances in the wardrobe!

[Machpoint005]

2 hours ago, bigcol said:

Seriously, have had 2 on our coat

never done much but blinked away for years.

 

last week, woke up to a alarm sounding.

i could believe it was happening.

a alarm??  Got out of bed, through the boat as smelt burning

Opened door to wheel house, and smoke!!

open engine hatch, and saw my engine battery smoking and burning smell.

the battery was so hot couldn’t touch it.

luckly the battery is easy to get to and removed the leads and took out side

had to use a tea tower as it was that hot!!

 

looking at the co2 alarm gage it was on 65,  but yes this could have been dagerous

imagine battery open circuit??

 

yep you buy em, they sit on your wall don’t do alot

apart from saving lives!!!!

I don't think you have a CO2 alarm. You might have a CO alarm, and you definitely have a smoke alarm (maybe both), but CO2 isn't harmful except in enormous quantities, expressed as tonnes in the atmosphere.

[bigcol]

It says co on the alarm, so your right Ian but enclosed photo of it.

i have 4 fire alarms, 2 co alarms 5 x extinsusers and 1 blanket.

and have done a trial emergency escape, which wasn’t as easy as you think lol

but  we became aware of what to do in case of an emergency.

[dor]

CO poisoning is still dismissed by too many people and too many people die from it. The owner of my previous boat died on board from CO poisoning, his wife just survived.  He was a pharmacist so should have known better!   It was suspected that as it was an early chilly night he had put the stovetop burners on to warm the boat up a bit rather than light the stove.  The boat was impounded for a few months to investigate it before being released for sale.  The gas fridge was removed although it was thought unlikely it would produce enough CO even if burning badly.  It was however thought that the vent for the fridge might have been obstructed by vegetation on the bank where the boat was moored.  It still seemed an unlikely cause as the flame is so small, compared to a gas ring for instance.

[cuthound]

4 hours ago, Machpoint005 said:

I don't think you have a CO2 alarm. You might have a CO alarm, and you definitely have a smoke alarm (maybe both), but CO2 isn't harmful except in enormous quantities, expressed as tonnes in the atmosphere.

 

Pure CO2 won't support life and being a heasy gas displaces air & oxygen. That is why it is used as a fire extinguisher.

 

I used to work on high voltage power installations with automatic CO2 extinguishing for the switch and transformer rooms. You had to lock off the extinguishers to release the door key (castell key interlock) before you could gain access, so that you wouldn't be asphixiated if the fire extinguishers went off.

Edited June 5, 2018 by cuthound
To unmangle the effects of autocorrect

[Alan de Enfield]

An update from the BSS :

 

So far in 2018 we have recorded 30+ boat fires/explosions. Three boaters have died. several more have lost their homes and all belongings. Don't be the next victim. Install systems correctly, maintain them routinely, use them properly and be alarmed .

 

Maybe this should be posted as a banner across the top of the forum.

[Horace42]

21 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

Pure CO2 won't support life and being a heasy gas displaces air & oxygen. That is why it is used as a fire extinguisher.

 

I used to work on high voltage power installations with automatic CO2 extinguishing for the switch and transformer rooms. You had to lock off the extinguishers to release the door key (castell key interlock) before you could gain access, so that you wouldn't be asphixiated if the fire extinguishers went off.

I didn'y know about the interlock thing, but it makes sense. But what happens if there is a fire?

But yes, breathing high levels of CO2 is quickly dangerous - like putting your head in a plastic bag - and there are plenty of warnings about that.

 

Edited June 5, 2018 by Horace42
typo

[cuthound]

1 minute ago, Horace42 said:

I didn'y know about the interlock thing, but it makes sense. But what happens if there is a fire?

But yes, breathing high levels of CO2 is quickly dangerous - like putting your head in a plastic bag - and there are plenty of warnings about that.

 

 

If you were in the high volage switch or transformer room when a fire occurred, you would quickly exit and lock the door, trapping the door key in the Castell exchange box and releasing the extinguisher key which would re-arm the automatic fire extinguishers.

[ditchcrawler]

We all ways put a locking pin in the weight arm that dropped to set the extinguishers off and not rely on electrical switches. 

[blackrose]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

An update from the BSS :

 

So far in 2018 we have recorded 30+ boat fires/explosions. Three boaters have died. several more have lost their homes and all belongings. Don't be the next victim. Install systems correctly, maintain them routinely, use them properly and be alarmed .

 

Maybe this should be posted as a banner across the top of the forum.

No harm doing that I suppose, but in general I don't think it's the boaters who frequent this forum who are the ones most at risk.