Thoughts on this boat

[Midnight]

Anyone know anything about this boat -Kyle

https://m.apolloduck.com/boat.phtml?id=519651

 

A friend is interested

[Athy]

Don't let Mike the Boilerman see this, he's got enough boats already.

 

In my non-professional opinion after a brief look: top builder, top engine, but not (compared with current trends) top price; the boat is not young, but it's a classic. I do hope that it doesn't stop every eight or nine seconds, as the video seemed to do.

If I was in the market for such a long boat, I'd be arranging a viewing p.d.q.

Edited May 27, 2018 by Athy

[X Alan W]

As said a bit long in the tooth, but a   lot depends on the maintenance First div builder old school quality power unit

[alan_fincher]

It's 36 years old, so to justify that sort of price, the hull will need to have been very well looked after.

 

Russell Newbery engines raise a lot of different views - some people love em, some people hate em.  I'm only looking at small pictures - does it have electric start?

[dmr]

Nice looking boat though the colour scheme might need some remedial work. It is very old so would need to be in very good condition to justify that price. Good hull survey essential, its of the "might need overplating" age.

 

I thought that most vintage engine types liked the RN so Alan will have to explain his comment? 

 

Oooh, just noticed, no front doors, that might be an issue, no access to that lovely tug deck.

 

..............Dave

[Athy]

2 minutes ago, dmr said:

Nice looking boat though the colour scheme might need some remedial work. It is very old so would need to be in very good condition to justify that price. Good hull survey essential, its of the "might need overplating" age.

 

I thought that most vintage engine types liked the RN so Alan will have to explain his comment? 

 

Oooh, just noticed, no front doors, that might be an issue, no access to that lovely tug deck.

 

..............Dave

A quite common feature of "tugs" (pace Alan) from that era. But it does have side doors on both sides near the front, so access should not be a problem.

 

Russell Newberries [?] from a particular era have or had a reputation for unreleiability - I think it was when they were owned by Vero in the Southampton area. But as this one has been recently rebuilt by the former owner of RN, one would hope that it would not suffer such problems.

[alan_fincher]

8 minutes ago, dmr said:

I thought that most vintage engine types liked the RN so Alan will have to explain his comment?

 

We were seriously persuing a boat with an RN - indeed might now own one had the owner not pissed us about something rotten.

 

I did a bit of research as the time, and not all feedback was positive.  I don't still have the messages I exchanged with the well respected late Tim Leech, but I know he sent me a long list of things to be aware of.  As I understand it both the Nationals and the RNs can be buggers to hand start when cold, so I think I would only really want an electric start one, (which this probably is).

[dmr]

4 minutes ago, Athy said:

A quite common feature of "tugs" (pace Alan) from that era. But it does have side doors on both sides near the front, so access should not be a problem.

 

Russell Newberries [?] from a particular era have or had a reputation for unreleiability - I think it was when they were owned by Vero in the Southampton area. But as this one has been recently rebuilt by the former owner of RN, one would hope that it would not suffer such problems.

There's something rather nice about entering the boat via the tuck deck, or sitting inside the boat with the front doors open overlooking the "real estate".  Tug decks are a "waste" of space so losing more cabin space for access to Two side doors is not ideal, but then my thinking is in terms of liveaboard boating.

 

Funny world, as I was a "mostly electronics" engineer based on Southampton I made many visits to VeroSpeed just outside Southampton, and used a fair few Vero products, never had the slightest clue about the engine sideline.

 

..............Dave 

[Athy]

DMR, yes, what you say about the view along the, er, patio is valid - but I'm not so sure about the "waste of space": the bed is partly under the deck, as is a very large (170 gallon) water tank. So the space is put to use.

Alan, I can't see any reference to the nature of starting the engine, but I'd imagine that as it was rebuilt as recently as 2012 it would probably have the mod. con. of electric start. That is something that a prospective buyer should check, though.

[dmr]

6 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 

We were seriously persuing a boat with an RN - indeed might now own one had the owner not pissed us about something rotten.

 

I did a bit of research as the time, and not all feedback was positive.  I don't still have the messages I exchanged with the well respected late Tim Leech, but I know he sent me a long list of things to be aware of.  As I understand it both the Nationals and the RNs can be buggers to hand start when cold, so I think I would only really want an electric start one, (which this probably is).

I would see a hand start as a bonus and something to be used on special occasions but would want an electric start for day to day use, we are all getting older.

 

Has not this boat been on sale for some time now? must be something not right about it.  We are still resisting the temptation to get a second boat for the Northern System but otherwise would be tempted by this one. The children are helping this resistance by spending all our money for us. ?

 

..............Dave

[Neil2]

1 hour ago, dmr said:

I would see a hand start as a bonus and something to be used on special occasions but would want an electric start for day to day use, we are all getting older.

 

Has not this boat been on sale for some time now? must be something not right about it.  We are still resisting the temptation to get a second boat for the Northern System but otherwise would be tempted by this one. The children are helping this resistance by spending all our money for us. ?

 

..............Dave

Yes Kyle has been on the market for a very long time and Great Haywood do like to shift boats so it's clearly overpriced.  The owner is clearly hoping someone will one day come along who really wants a Pearson boat and will overlook the dreadful internal design.  

[Tonka]

As has been mentioned on the forum else where have a good look at the water line.

[zenataomm]

A lot of shillings, considering the age.

Also for that money I'd need better proportions, the tumblehome doesn't look right to me.

[WotEver]

25 minutes ago, zenataomm said:

the tumblehome doesn't look right to me.

It’s virtually non existent. However that does afford a more spacious feel to the interior. 

[noddyboater]

Wasn’t Kyle featured in a Graham Booth article many moons ago in Waterways World? It showed it being lengthened and refitted to the current layout. I thought it actually looked better shorter, more purposeful and balanced. A similar thing happened to another Pearson tug that used to moor on the Trent at Hazleford lock. Lovely lines, good quality basic fit out with Gardner 4L2. It disappeared then popped up lengthened and refitted on A/duck at a silly price. 

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Neil2 said:

Yes Kyle has been on the market for a very long time and Great Haywood do like to shift boats so it's clearly overpriced.  The owner is clearly hoping someone will one day come along who really wants a Pearson boat and will overlook the dreadful internal design.  

It was at Wincham a couple of months ago

[MtB]

5 hours ago, Athy said:

Don't let Mike the Boilerman see this, he's got enough boats already.

 

I did consider it but like others have said, I thought it doesn’t quite look ‘right’ to the critical eye. 

[Athy]

Perhaps it's a 1980s boatbuilder's perception of what a "tug" should look like and how it should be laid out, compared with that of 20 or so years later.

[MtB]

4 hours ago, dmr said:

There's something rather nice about entering the boat via the tuck deck, or sitting inside the boat with the front doors open overlooking the "real estate".

 

Like this you mean? ?

 

 

 

i have have to say I’m puzzled by comments in the other thread about tools rolling off the edge of a tug deck. Mine has upstands all around like in this photo. 

[Athy]

2 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Like this you mean? ?

 

 

 

i have have to say I’m puzzled by comments in the other thread about tools rolling off the edge of a tug deck. Mine has upstands all around like in this photo. 

That's chez Gregg, isn't it? Just a few yards along from our old mooring.

Some "tug" decks have more curvature than yours, so I guess a round metal tool could work up a fair speed and bounce over the lip (or upstand if you will).

I do, however, like the idea of a "tuck deck" - picnics on the boat in the sunshine!

[alan_fincher]

2 hours ago, Neil2 said:

Yes Kyle has been on the market for a very long time and Great Haywood do like to shift boats so it's clearly overpriced.

 

This blog post suggests it may have been for sale for 4 years......

http://nbyarwood.blogspot.co.uk/2014/06/nb-kyle-up-for-sale.html

 

[dmr]

2 hours ago, WotEver said:

It’s virtually non existent. However that does afford a more spacious feel to the interior. 

But surely tugs are all about looking good so getting the tumblehome at least half right is important. In my opinion most boats would look better with a little more tumblehome so are already compromised in favour of interior space.

 

..............Dave

25 minutes ago, Athy said:

That's chez Gregg, isn't it? Just a few yards along from our old mooring.

Some "tug" decks have more curvature than yours, so I guess a round metal tool could work up a fair speed and bounce over the lip (or upstand if you will).

I do, however, like the idea of a "tuck deck" - picnics on the boat in the sunshine!

Yep I've lost stuff off the roof in exactly that way.

 

............Dave

[70liveaboard]

Its a nice looking boat, to us anyway. If what has been said is correct, that its been up for sale for some time, then clearly the seller isn't strapped for cash and probably still enjoys it from time to time.

Somewhere out there... Hang on.. no ?

 

There will be a buyer for it out there, may not get quite what he wants (price wise), but many boats sell to the heart usually and someone will come along and love it..

[pete harrison]

2 minutes ago, dmr said:

But surely tugs are all about looking good so getting the tumblehome at least half right is important. In my opinion most boats would look better with a little more tumblehome so are already compromised in favour of interior space.

 

..............Dave

Well this is obviously different things to different people as to me a tug should be a powerhouse and agile, and looking good is not a high priority. To my mind most modern tugs are stylised pleasure cruisers that are woefully underpowered and far too long.

 

I remember KYLE being built and felt it had a lot of potential and its proportions as built were good, but back then it was powered by a Lister FR2 which was far to small for a tug. After about 5 years the Russell Newbery was fitted, but this engine would normally be associated with a motor and is still too small for a tug - but at the end of the day KYLE is another tug styled pleasure boat, especially in its current format.

 

It would be great to see somebody build a proper narrow beam tug (not a push tug), although of course there is no work for vessels like this anymore 

[dmr]

14 minutes ago, pete harrison said:

Well this is obviously different things to different people as to me a tug should be a powerhouse and agile, and looking good is not a high priority. To my mind most modern tugs are stylised pleasure cruisers that are woefully underpowered and far too long.

 

I remember KYLE being built and felt it had a lot of potential and its proportions as built were good, but back then it was powered by a Lister FR2 which was far to small for a tug. After about 5 years the Russell Newbery was fitted, but this engine would normally be associated with a motor and is still too small for a tug - but at the end of the day KYLE is another tug styled pleasure boat, especially in its current format.

 

It would be great to see somebody build a proper narrow beam tug (not a push tug), although of course there is no work for vessels like this anymore 

But as you have said, there is very little work for tugs these days so if they had a proper tug engine they would be woefully overpowered. Virtually all boats are now either hobby boats or liveaboards. Just like how boats have full length cabins, so tugs are a bit longer than a proper tug should be. 90%+ of boats on the cut are bog standard leisure boats or "floating caravans" if you want to upset a few people. I think its great that people choose to make tug style boats with pleasing lines, or any boat with pleasing lines.

 

I am aware of a couple of proper tugs, more or less all engine room, but I don't see them out and about on the cut very often.

 

.............Dave