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On ‎17‎/‎05‎/‎2018 at 18:51, AMModels said:

About 2 and a half years ago I was in a very dark place, I was at the point of taking the site down and letting everything go but kind words on this forum and some amazing (to me) offers of help and support meant that the site not only survived but it is being rewritten, its a long job, not helped in the least by my own mental health being shite most of the time, but it is happening. 

Andy - I wish I had the answer for the bad times you have, and are, experiencing but from what you wrote here you are obviously a good and brave person and has done a great deal for the boating community in general and lovers of old boats particularly.  Try not to give in to the blackness and do trust that it could get better.

 

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11 hours ago, pete harrison said:

I have always had my motor's set up like this (counter a few inches out of the water) as it helps to minimise draught when on the move, and with a little more water under the boat it helps the boat move more efficiently.

Interesting.

A few years back now I was invited to be guest steerer of Chertsey for a couple of days.

That had its counter several inches out at the time.

I found it very slow to get going, and really rather reluctant to stop, though it was superb when actually up to speed, and not needing to stop in a hurry.

 

I must admit my preference is to run a bit deeper than that was.

(Though obviously, as you say, the deeper you are, the more you crash over in bridge holes...)

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When i bought Helvetia, the counter was about 2inches below the waterline when resting, and i kept that arrangement for a long time. Eventually, after getting fed up with constantly running aground,  I re-distributed the ballast so that the counter rested on the water line, and the bow was a little deeper in the water and the improvement was interesting,  not only did we run aground less frequently, but the boat swam better as well,

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I've always run with all ours with the counter just on the water. I've always found with it out all the prop wants to do is throw air about. i also found slow moving more a problem but it just in i find things are more responsive. ill tent to take out of gear as go threw a bridge this way i tend to find i don't disterb the rubbish in the bridge and dont hit anything.

 

a smaller prop or bigger gap between the prop and bottom of the boat and bigger gap between the uxter plate you could prob run higher out the water but all ours have had big props and not much room to spare.

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1 hour ago, billybobbooth said:

. ill tent to take out of gear as go threw a bridge this way i tend to find i don't disterb the rubbish in the bridge and dont hit anything.

A better way is to run hard to a bridge and just as you enter it you then knock back the throttle hard. The little wave that was following you catches up with you and lifts the arse end up and (generally) over any crud. This mostly works even when you are loaded and if you have a butty you will see the tow line hardly dip at all, whereas otherwise it will slack off and do its best to wrap itself round the blades.

I like blades as large as practical and to be slightly over-bladed. You might not have as much acceleration but you can stop on a sixpence. This means you can go into locks without a lot of faffing about - it's probably OK if you are pleasure boating but otherwise you just want to pass locks as quickly and efficiently as possible.

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12 minutes ago, Tam & Di said:

A better way is to run hard to a bridge and just as you enter it you then knock back the throttle hard. The little wave that was following you catches up with you and lifts the arse end up and (generally) over any crud. This mostly works even when you are loaded and if you have a butty you will see the tow line hardly dip at all, whereas otherwise it will slack off and do its best to wrap itself round the blades.

I like blades as large as practical and to be slightly over-bladed. You might not have as much acceleration but you can stop on a sixpence. This means you can go into locks without a lot of faffing about - it's probably OK if you are pleasure boating but otherwise you just want to pass locks as quickly and efficiently as possible.

My method was the same as "Tams" but as stated our boating was money making (hopefully)& had time restraints the boating of today is a different setup;

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I take the approach to a bridge with plenty wound on then quickly wind it back and knock it out of gear, with a butty in tow if the motor gets stuck then the butty will ride in to the stern and push the motor through.

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5 hours ago, Rob-M said:

I take the approach to a bridge with plenty wound on then quickly wind it back and knock it out of gear, with a butty in tow if the motor gets stuck then the butty will ride in to the stern and push the motor through.

not good for a wooden boat!

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8 hours ago, Tam & Di said:

A better way is to run hard to a bridge and just as you enter it you then knock back the throttle hard. The little wave that was following you catches up with you and lifts the arse end up and (generally) over any crud.

 

This was the only way I was able to get through many of the bridge holes on the southern Stratford last summer. Just grounded if I tried to cruise through, no matter how slow. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 18/05/2018 at 14:00, alan_fincher said:

As an aside, I do miss the friendly "arguments" with Graham (NB Alnwick) about whether 66HP of slow revving Kelvin K3 is actual an appropriate engine in a modern boat.  Where are you these days, Graham, it would be good to have you back on the forum!

On the 18 May we were probably on top of a mountain in the Isle of Man - the beauty of a big old engine is in its ability to turn a decent sized prop nice and slow so as not to disturb the water and everything that is in it . . .

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23 minutes ago, NB Alnwick said:

On the 18 May we were probably on top of a mountain in the Isle of Man - the beauty of a big old engine is in its ability to turn a decent sized prop nice and slow so as not to disturb the water and everything that is in it . . .

 

Basic engineering principles show us any 66hp engine, modern or old, can do that with appropriate gearing.

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On 17/05/2018 at 13:44, Dav and Pen said:

The great man himself with Bletchley and Argus. (Sorry about quality). Biggest load I ever had on a big Northwich was 26 tones and couldn’t get past Napton. Nick Hill often had Jaguar down to the gunwales.

979CA749-CD70-439A-8C96-1608760DA09D.jpeg

1964 I think it was ,2 pairs & 2 single motors were to loada Weston Point with "Felspar"  for Wedgewoods I was the last boat to load & the grab kept fro & to & the boat sat lower & lower in the waterI ended up with around half the gunnel timber dry side we had to be taken in tow for the MSC  two rank of 3 boats & me singly at the back I guess the tug skipper wanted to get home as he wound on the power the swill between the boats over my fore deck & ran along the side cloths goo job the were in good nick I thought I"d get in some submarine practice fortunately I didn't I managed to the potteries the guy when he got to me remarked "her's a bit deep" iwas never sure but it was estimated a 26/7 tons I know for sure there wasn"t much dry side good I didn't take on much water

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 22/05/2018 at 07:52, Tam & Di said:

A better way is to run hard to a bridge and just as you enter it you then knock back the throttle hard. The little wave that was following you catches up with you and lifts the arse end up and (generally) over any crud. This mostly works even when you are loaded and if you have a butty you will see the tow line hardly dip at all, whereas otherwise it will slack off and do its best to wrap itself round the blades.

I like blades as large as practical and to be slightly over-bladed. You might not have as much acceleration but you can stop on a sixpence. This means you can go into locks without a lot of faffing about - it's probably OK if you are pleasure boating but otherwise you just want to pass locks as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Have you ever had any problems with the boat tipping over, threatening to damage the cabin? I've been through a couple where the obstruction has been on one side and slid towards the brickwork of the arch, and assumed that if I'd been moving faster there would have been carnage. 

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11 hours ago, BWM said:

Have you ever had any problems with the boat tipping over, threatening to damage the cabin? I've been through a couple where the obstruction has been on one side and slid towards the brickwork of the arch, and assumed that if I'd been moving faster there would have been carnage. 

Bouncing and tipping through urban bridges 'goes with the territory' of owning / operating these boats, but I do not recall ever being tipped that severely towards the arch.

 

As I started my boating in Birmingham I was taught to drive into a bridgehole hard(ish) and throttle back hard as it narrowed to ride the wave as described by Mr Murrell in Post No. 55. The wave lifts and pushes the boat through the bridge, and even if you knock out of gear (if it is known to be a bad bridge) the boat will not slow down. I demonstrated this to my son when we bought my boat up the Oxford Canal last month and he easily mastered the timing, enjoying the confirmation of getting it right as the fore end appears to drop but is really the stern end rising on the wave. Traditional boating using traditional practices is really rewarding when you get it right, the only problem I find being you catch up with slower boat in front that much quicker  :captain:

Edited by pete harrison
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1 hour ago, pete harrison said:

Bouncing and tipping through urban bridges 'goes with the territory' of owning / operating these boats, but I do not recall ever being tipped that severely towards the arch.

 

As I started my boating in Birmingham I was taught to drive into a bridgehole hard(ish) and throttle back hard as it narrowed to ride the wave as described by Mr Murrell in Post No. 55. The wave lifts and pushes the boat through the bridge, and even if you knock out of gear (if it is known to be a bad bridge) the boat will not slow down. I demonstrated this to my son when we bought my boat up the Oxford Canal last month and he easily mastered the timing, enjoying the confirmation of getting it right as the fore end appears to drop but is really the stern end rising on the wave. Traditional boating using traditional practices is really rewarding when you get it right, the only problem I find being you catch up with slower boat in front that much quicker  :captain:

this is ok till they semi let you past then decide to speed up when your 75% past

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9 hours ago, pete harrison said:

Bouncing and tipping through urban bridges 'goes with the territory' of owning / operating these boats, but I do not recall ever being tipped that severely towards the arch.

 

As I started my boating in Birmingham I was taught to drive into a bridgehole hard(ish) and throttle back hard as it narrowed to ride the wave as described by Mr Murrell in Post No. 55. The wave lifts and pushes the boat through the bridge, and even if you knock out of gear (if it is known to be a bad bridge) the boat will not slow down. I demonstrated this to my son when we bought my boat up the Oxford Canal last month and he easily mastered the timing, enjoying the confirmation of getting it right as the fore end appears to drop but is really the stern end rising on the wave. Traditional boating using traditional practices is really rewarding when you get it right, the only problem I find being you catch up with slower boat in front that much quicker  :captain:

Thanks, I will give this a go next week as the worst of these bridges is on my regular 'service' run. Can I ask how much of the boat would be through the bridge before knocking out of gear? 

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21 minutes ago, BWM said:

Thanks, I will give this a go next week as the worst of these bridges is on my regular 'service' run. Can I ask how much of the boat would be through the bridge before knocking out of gear? 

As your engine "ole" front bulkhead gets in to the "narrows of the bridge hole",experiment a bit try shutting off to tick over or that plus knock out of gear & note the effect not fool proof though as some one could have flung a load of "crap"in since the last passage through or the "crap" been moved fished out & the passage is much more pleasant.

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33 minutes ago, X Alan W said:

As your engine "ole" front bulkhead gets in to the "narrows of the bridge hole",experiment a bit try shutting off to tick over or that plus knock out of gear & note the effect not fool proof though as some one could have flung a load of "crap"in since the last passage through or the "crap" been moved fished out & the passage is much more pleasant.

 

6 minutes ago, Tuscan said:

We do this at every bridge ‘ole, knocking off  as the engine hatch in line with bridge entrance winding back as canal widens. Occasionally we slow to a stop and have to engage earlier

 

Interesting.......

 

When I do this I would normally knock the power off before any part of the engine room was fully into the bridge hole.

 

That seems too late in my general experience.

 

EDIT.....

 

.... and are people talking about 15 foot wide brige holes or 8 feet wide ones, as rather different effects will be had in each if you choose to do this.

Edited by alan_fincher
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We back off and declutch as the bows go into the bridge, but  being a shortened boat she pulls down very early and stern rises late. At notmal speed the red bands 4 inches in and thats with half a ton of ballast in the front locker. I did once think she was going over when ihit a barrel on the cov, 

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1 hour ago, alan_fincher said:

 

 

Interesting.......

 

When I do this I would normally knock the power off before any part of the engine room was fully into the bridge hole.

 

That seems too late in my general experience.

 

EDIT.....

 

.... and are people talking about 15 foot wide brige holes or 8 feet wide ones, as rather different effects will be had in each if you choose to do this.

The ones i've had problems with are wide, and by the time the engine room is level with the arch on the worst one I'm close to the brickwork at a jaunty angle! But due to previous problems I have approached fairly slowly, which maybe compounds the issue?

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1 hour ago, alan_fincher said:

 

 

Interesting.......

 

When I do this I would normally knock the power off before any part of the engine room was fully into the bridge hole.

 

That seems too late in my general experience.

 

EDIT.....

 

.... and are people talking about 15 foot wide brige holes or 8 feet wide ones, as rather different effects will be had in each if you choose to do this.

If we knock off much before this we often either slow to a stop under the bridge or loose steerage way so that we have to engage fear when still within the bridge profile. We are well ballasted through the length of the boat

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