First boat - considering buying an 1860s ice breaker...

[thenortherner]

Because aluminium won't require the same maintenance as steel.  They're more expensive used than the equivalent steel boat but not ridiculously so especially when comparing the age of boats. 

 

If it's a stretch for me to spend 20k why would I look at 35k boats? 

 

The cheapest used Bentley I found is up for 26k so still out of reach unfortunately. 

 

 

Beetle not Bentley! 

[thenortherner]

There's a 1998 Sea Otter at Venitian Marina with only 860 engine hours up for 24K before negotiation.  So 10k difference. 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

1 hour ago, thenortherner said:

I think I've read enough and will cancel the viewing. 

 

I can't find many boats in decent mechanical and structural condition for 20K, especially with an interior which doesn't look to have an awful fit out. 

 

Just can't quite stretch to the cost of a 23ft Sea Otter which is what I was originally looking for but ended up going down other avenues due to budget. 

 

I'm starting to think that the higher initial outlay will be negated longer term with the comparatively lower running costs. 

Don’t cancel the viewing. Unless it’s a long trip and a pain to get to. You will at least learn and gain a bit more knowledge from seeing it. (I love the simplicity of the tiller and rudder attachment) And who knows, it might be the one. It looks lovely, it’s the only one of it’s kind out there. 

It’s only 23’ so will go and turn anywhere, brilliant. You could have lots of fun on that.  Get a good hull survey done and if you fancy it...

 

But go look at it. 

 

If I’d seen the comments on here before I bought my boat I would never have gone to view it. As it is, I’ve a sound boat with an iron hull.  

 

End of the day it’s your money. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by Goliath
A

[matty40s]

I'm just amazed at basket case Boilerman who bought basket case Reginald can diss a boat with such veracity.

 

Go and have a look, any old boat may have problems, and seeing some of the work that has gone into this means most of those problems have had money thrown at them and been sorted for a while.

 

[MtB]

1 minute ago, matty40s said:

I'm just amazed at basket case Boilerman who bought basket case Reginald can diss a boat with such veracity.

 

 

 

Just passing on the benefit of personal experience 

 

Mind you, Reginald is more of a receptacle for my series of basket case engines. And I knew what I was buying. The OP seems to be seeing this boat as a similarly-priced equivalent to a ten year old Sea Otter! 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

1 minute ago, matty40s said:

I'm just amazed at basket case Boilerman who bought basket case Reginald can diss a boat with such veracity.

 

Go and have a look, any old boat may have problems, and seeing some of the work that has gone into this means most of those problems have had money thrown at them and been sorted for a while.

 

Exactly, this could be a little gem. With years of fun to be had on it.  

Make sure the bike comes with it! 

 

 

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Exactly, this could be a little gem. With years of fun to be had on it.  

 

 

Correct, it could be. But more likely it will turn out to be an insane money pit.

 

I'm speaking from experience, remember??!

 

 

 

(Mine is actually both  )

[mark99]

Look at it and then decide.

[thenortherner]

To be honest I'm not wanting to pour money into something. 

 

It'll be for weekend use not heavy use. 

 

Sorted the mooring for under 1k and the licence is cheap enough due to size. 

 

Diesel and fuel aside I was hoping for an average of 2k a year for ongoing and unexpected maintenance.  Given the boat basically has bugger all equipment or mod cons and a simple engine I hoped that'd be enough...

[Captain Pegg]

If I had asked about Vulpes on here before I bought there would have been a lot of folk who would have said "run away".

 

Go and have a look. Nothing to lose by doing so. Strikes me though that if you have a budget of £20k and want to control the cost and effort of maintenance then a share may be the answer. I wonder if that has been considered and discounted for some reason.

 

JP

 

ETA - seeing above post I guess not really possible for weekend use

Edited May 10, 2018 by Captain Pegg

[thenortherner]

I struggle with block bookings when it comes to taking leave from work.   And I'm hoping to use it as a bolt hole at weekends even if I'm not planning to sail it anywhere. 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

3 minutes ago, thenortherner said:

To be honest I'm not wanting to pour money into something. 

 

It'll be for weekend use not heavy use. 

 

Sorted the mooring for under 1k and the licence is cheap enough due to size. 

 

Diesel and fuel aside I was hoping for an average of 2k a year for ongoing and unexpected maintenance.  Given the boat basically has bugger all equipment or mod cons and a simple engine I hoped that'd be enough...

So it sounds perfect for you. Go and look. Cheap as chips. 

 

If I had enough money I’d go and look at that.

I’d make it into a darkroom studio and tow it around. 

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, thenortherner said:

To be honest I'm not wanting to pour money into something. 

 

It'll be for weekend use not heavy use. 

 

Sorted the mooring for under 1k and the licence is cheap enough due to size. 

 

Diesel and fuel aside I was hoping for an average of 2k a year for ongoing and unexpected maintenance.  Given the boat basically has bugger all equipment or mod cons and a simple engine I hoped that'd be enough...

 

Just to throw another spanner in the works - You could get a superb 'modern' GRP cruiser style boat of similar (or bigger) size which will have similar mooring and licence costs, will have a shower, cooker, beds, & kitchen and you could have change (£1,000s) from your £20k budget.

 

 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Just to throw another spanner in the works - You could get a superb 'modern' GRP cruiser style boat of similar (or bigger) size which will have similar mooring and licence costs, will have a shower, cooker, beds, & kitchen and you could have change (£1,000s) from your £20k budget.

 

 

Yea, but that’s the dull answer. 

 

 

Too sensible

Edited May 10, 2018 by Goliath
A

[MtB]

5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Just to throw another spanner in the works - You could get a superb 'modern' GRP cruiser style boat of similar (or bigger) size which will have similar mooring and licence costs, will have a shower, cooker, beds, & kitchen and you could have change (£1,000s) from your £20k budget.

 

 

 

You have put your finger on what was worrying me about all this. Now we know the OP wants a hobby boat for odd weekends here and there a good GRP cruiser with better facilities and cheaper maintenance can be had for a great deal less dosh.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

11 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

You have put your finger on what was worrying me about all this. Now we know the OP wants a hobby boat for odd weekends here and there a good GRP cruiser with better facilities and cheaper maintenance can be had for a great deal less dosh.

This is an ideal hobby boat. 

 

Where’s the ‘high’ maintenance? It’s 23’ long. 

It hasn't even got a base plate. 

 

 

 

[thenortherner]

No base plate?  I'm not following... 

 

Apologies I'm new to boating.. 

 

Sounds like my average hopeful maintenance spend of 2k a year is achievable then from the previous comments

[alan_fincher]

I'm certainly not recommending the OP not to look at it.

I'm only seeking to ensure that if they are interested they make sure as far as they can that it is not Mike's "basket case".

 

I'm not sure one way or the other, from the limited information.

If it really appeals, be prepared to gamble the cost of a good surveyor.  Even if you are not scared off, and go ahead, they will probably find enough that you can negotiate at least the cost of the survey off whatever you have agreed to pay.

[WotEver]

8 minutes ago, thenortherner said:

No base plate?  I'm not following...

It has curved hull sides and a keel. 

[alan_fincher]

7 minutes ago, thenortherner said:

No base plate?  I'm not following...

The "base plate" of an iron or steel narrow boat is the flat bottom.

This boat doesn't have a flat bottom - it has a round bottom - I think the comment is made in jest, as it is far more expensive to replace a round bottom than a flat one!

 

It is designed to be easy to rock to break ice.  You should be aware, by the way, that a boat this short and with a round bottom will be far more prone to rolling than a conventional boat with a flat bottom.  Not necessarily a problem, but don't get 4 people stepping on to the same side at the same time!

4 minutes ago, WotEver said:

It has curved hull sides and a keel. 

I doubt it has much of a keel - just round bottomed is entirely normal for craft like this.

 

The idea of an ice boat is to be able to rock it as much as possible with a team of men - surely a keel would hinder rather than assist?

[WotEver]

4 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

I doubt it has much of a keel - just round bottomed is entirely normal for craft like this.

 

The idea of an ice boat is to be able to rock it as much as possible with a team of men - surely a keel would hinder rather than assist?

It’s difficult to see on those photos as it’s pretty dark down there. But the only point I was making is that the curved hull sides meet in the middle at the bottom. So no, it probably doesn’t have much of a keel at all. 

[matty40s]

4 minutes ago, WotEver said:

It’s difficult to see on those photos as it’s pretty dark down there. But the only point I was making is that the curved hull sides meet in the middle at the bottom. So no, it probably doesn’t have much of a keel at all. 

It has no keel, the new spreaders at the back have been installed so it can go forward on a fairly even keel, not loop the loop.

[WotEver]

3 minutes ago, matty40s said:

It has no keel, the new spreaders at the back have been installed so it can go forward on a fairly even keel, not loop the loop.

Kule

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

10 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

The "base plate" of an iron or steel narrow boat is the flat bottom.

This boat doesn't have a flat bottom - it has a round bottom - I think the comment is made in jest, as it is far more expensive to replace a round bottom than a flat one!

 

It is designed to be easy to rock to break ice.  You should be aware, by the way, that a boat this short and with a round bottom will be far more prone to rolling than a conventional boat with a flat bottom.  Not necessarily a problem, but don't get 4 people stepping on to the same side at the same time!

Alan have you a couple of photos to show the OP what an ice breaker would have looked like and to show why it needed that round bottom to rock.

And then we can imagine the boat in question without the cabin. 

[WotEver]

4 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Alan have you a couple of photos to show the OP what an ice breaker would have looked like and to show why it needed that round bottom to rock.

And then we can imagine the boat in question without the cabin. 

I have this one that I saved from somewhere.