District enforcement mooring fine Reading

[john6767]

8 minutes ago, Johny London said:

I've just been looking at a District Enforcement sign at Sonning, Thames. This one said it is £10 per night and to call a number, then there is the usual £100 a day spiel (by way of a charge rather than a fine). A boater I was talking to there said that you register online at the DE website and then they give you the first 24 hrs free. I asked if he was thinking of the EA website but he said not. Apparently there is a site called Thames moorings that DE run and it includes their moorings, EA, and all the others (what even Mr Smiths field?). I couldn't find such a website.

 

I think the DE will offer to take over running peoples moorings (independent, council, etc) and possibly contact suitable riparian owners to bring new moorings into play - it's a great business model for them. Just give the land owners a small cut and away you go. The one here has cctv too  The shape of things to come. 

 

I must say - everything from the name, to the phrases used, rubs me up the wrong way. No coincidence they make their signs look like EA signs either - it's to give them extra credibility.

I suspect he meant https://www.thamesvisitormoorings.co.uk/ I don’t think it includes ones administered by DE though does it?   I is mainly EA moorings which are free for 24 hours, and I think a few council ones.

[Johny London]

I know - that's the website I've been using and I asked if he meant that but he seemed to think not. So there should be one for DE as well as EA - see they are trying to get on the back of EA's cred. He definitely said it gives you the first day free but that is not how I read the sign.

The DE moorings are not on there - but there is one I mentioned before that does have a £100 a day sign and I asked EA about that and was told they don't want anyone to moor there at all - that and signs warning of gabions under the water

Edited May 28, 2018 by Johny London

[WotEver]

3 hours ago, Johny London said:

I know - that's the website I've been using and I asked if he meant that but he seemed to think not. So there should be one for DE as well as EA - see they are trying to get on the back of EA's cred. He definitely said it gives you the first day free but that is not how I read the sign.

The DE moorings are not on there - but there is one I mentioned before that does have a £100 a day sign and I asked EA about that and was told they don't want anyone to moor there at all - that and signs warning of gabions under the water

This one?

https://www.where2moor.co.uk/

[erivers]

32 minutes ago, WotEver said:

This one?

https://www.where2moor.co.uk/

Interesting that on that new website District Enforcement claim to own 5 of the moorings:

 

Swinford Reach, Oxford

Tesco Coal Woodland, Reading

Wytham Estate, Oxford

Christchurch Meadow, Reading

Chestnut Walk, Reading.

 

Sheer fantasy ............... just like most of the other nonsense District Enforcement Ltd publish about Thames moorings on their signs and website!

 

 

[WotEver]

I guess you’ve seen this too?

http://www.district-enforcement.co.uk/phone-to-moor.html

[Lily Rose]

2 hours ago, WotEver said:

This one?

https://www.where2moor.co.uk/

Well now I'm confused.

 

I stayed at East Street a couple of times last year and registered my arrival on the TVM (Thames Visitor Moorings) website. I see it still appears on that site but it is also shown on DE's Where2moor as well.

 

Are they the same people but running two websites?

 

Or can I just choose which one I fancy registering my arrival with?

 

 

[john6767]

9 hours ago, Lily Rose said:

Well now I'm confused.

 

I stayed at East Street a couple of times last year and registered my arrival on the TVM (Thames Visitor Moorings) website. I see it still appears on that site but it is also shown on DE's Where2moor as well.

 

Are they the same people but running two websites?

 

Or can I just choose which one I fancy registering my arrival with?

 

 

There seems to be too much similarity between the information on the two web sites for there not be be some connection.

 

I have to say this is all putting be off visiting the Thames, but then I guess that is their intention.

[Lily Rose]

2 minutes ago, john6767 said:

There seems to be too much similarity between the information on the two web sites for there not be be some connection.

 

I have to say this is all putting be off visiting the Thames, but then I guess that is their intention.

I visited for the first time last summer and loved it so I doubt if this will put me off a repeat visit this summer but finding moorings was my main concern and this does not do anything to ease that.

 

I expect I'll stick with using TVM, where that seems to be an option, as that worked ok last time.

 

I assumed the information comes from the EA which would explain why it looks similar on both sites. Or maybe the guy that started TVM is handing it all over to DE's where2moor so the confusion arises during a transitional period.

 

I could be wrong but I would have thought the EA would prefer to attract boats, and therefore the fees they pay, rather than put them off.

[MtB]

40 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

I could be wrong but I would have thought the EA would prefer to attract boats, and therefore the fees they pay, rather than put them off.

 

Yes I would imagine the EA want to attract boats to pay license fees but I doubt they give a toss where the boats moor.  

 

It is the land owners who have the problem with CMers and employ DE etc surely?

[Johny London]

I think that DE have made their site and signs (and name) of a similar appearance to EA in order to give credence to their authority. Actually, I thought they had done a good job of their mooring page - it is handy to have all moorings in one place - although like the EA website they don't seem to have them all. If they really went to the trouble to include every single paid mooring, reduced their prices some (£6 p/n?), allowed a couple hours free (for lunch/shopping), worded their signs in a nicer manner, ensured ALL moorings were of a good standard (I mean any that they subsequently take over from land owners - deep enough and with rings/pins, and nettle free) and called themselves something a bit more friendly, then they could be providing a useful service. But I suspect it will go the other way.  Lets hope they don't try and take over all the moorings. Land owners who currently have to do their rounds every day would surely be tempted?

[erivers]

1 minute ago, Johny London said:

I think that DE have made their site and signs (and name) of a similar appearance to EA in order to give credence to their authority. Actually, I thought they had done a good job of their mooring page - it is handy to have all moorings in one place - although like the EA website they don't seem to have them all. If they really went to the trouble to include every single paid mooring, reduced their prices some (£6 p/n?), allowed a couple hours free (for lunch/shopping), worded their signs in a nicer manner, ensured ALL moorings were of a good standard (I mean any that they subsequently take over from land owners - deep enough and with rings/pins, and nettle free) and called themselves something a bit more friendly, then they could be providing a useful service. But I suspect it will go the other way.  Lets hope they don't try and take over all the moorings. Land owners who currently have to do their rounds every day would surely be tempted?

You're just kidding yourself.  District Enforcement Ltd do not own any moorings and have no interest in improving them or making them available to boaters at a reasonable price.

 

Their only interest is to attempt to extract penalty charges by threats and coercion, a system which they apply to car parks and which has been subject to severe criticism by a judge on one of the rare occasions when they attempted to chance their hand in court.

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, erivers said:

Their only interest is to attempt to extract penalty charges by threats and coercion, a system which they apply to car parks and which has been subject to severe criticism by a judge on one of the rare occasions when they attempted to chance their hand in court.

 

It is curious therefore, that they word their signs so aggressively. As someone previously pointed out there is a conflict of interest. DE actually want and need you to moor there so they can commence their threats and coercion, so you would expect their signs to be rather less hostile. 

 

The last thing they need is for their signs to be actually effective. That way no-one would moor and they would generate no income.

[Johny London]

I didn't say they own any moorings - I imagine that their business model would be all about running moorings. (But I'm just speculating). So if a landowner is fed up doing their rounds, and DE approach them saying they can collect all the fees, take a cut, maintain the site - it would be very tempting (for the owner) wouldn't it? Thus I can see DE growing. But I am not in favour of this (unless all my ifs and buts were realised which I should think there is zero chance of).

It seems to me they have such an aggressive ring about them due to their coming from the parking control business. Another thing I am totally against.

All we can do, is avoid using their pitches.

[erivers]

4 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

It is curious therefore, that they word their signs so aggressively. As someone previously pointed out there is a conflict of interest. DE actually want and need you to moor there so they can commence their threats and coercion, so you would expect their signs to be rather less hostile. 

 

The last thing they need is for their signs to be actually effective. That way no-one would moor and they would generate no income.

That's a very fair point, but as so many people on this thread have pointed out, the signs are virtually impossible to read and interpret properly without mooring up.  It is reasonable, surely, that if one sees a visitor mooring site it should be possible to stop and investigate the terms under which mooring is permitted before deciding whether they are acceptable.

 

Not so with these DE signs.  Stop to read the signs and if you subsequently decide to move on as you find their terms unreasonable, you are (well, according to their nonsense anyway) liable not only for a penalty charge of £100 (for stopping) but have also accepted their right to a lien over your boat and your property.

 

All complete and utter nonsense, but no doubt some fools will fall for it and further line the pockets of these crooks who are attempting to use their threats to bring to our waterways the misery they have inflicted on motorists.

[MtB]

1 minute ago, erivers said:

That's a very fair point, but as so many people on this thread have pointed out, the signs are virtually impossible to read and interpret properly without mooring up.  It is reasonable, surely, that if one sees a visitor mooring site it should be possible to stop and investigate the terms under which mooring is permitted before deciding whether they are acceptable.

 

Not so with these DE signs.  Stop to read the signs and if you subsequently decide to move on as you find their terms unreasonable, you are (well, according to their nonsense anyway) liable not only for a penalty charge of £100 (for stopping) but have also accepted their right to a lien over your boat and your property.

 

All complete and utter nonsense, but no doubt some fools will fall for it and further line the pockets of these crooks who are attempting to use their threats to bring to our waterways the misery they have inflicted on motorists.

 

I walked along the Reading Tesco moorings last Friday and two things struck me.

 

1) There are lots more signs there now. Probably six or eight new one, all obviously displayed and impossible to miss.

 

2) I counted five boats moored on the Tesco pontoon right underneath the signs, so clearly boaters are choosing to ignore them and chance it. 

 

3) The only person there reading the signs was me!

[Johny London]

I thought it might be useful to post these pics of the signs here at Sonning...

 

[Nightwatch]

29 minutes ago, Johny London said:

I thought it might be useful to post these pics of the signs here at Sonning...

 

I haven't seen those signs before. They do explain in more detail what you have to do and how to do it. I don't like it though. £10 a night! First night?

[Johny London]

Yes but it all goes to charity - via the honesty box  And someone has to pay for that fine cctv.

Seriously, I dunno what is going on here.

[Paringa]

Those have been about since last summer....

 

On ‎21‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 17:45, OldGoat said:

I say again -

The length of moorings below the lock from the bend (this is going upstream) that used to be available by the kindness of Mr. Geller now have (well they did in May) No Mooring signs. Past Uri's house there are several moorings that - I assume - are let out, or suffered by the various  house owners. The pub ('cos that's what it really is) has spaces for a couple of boats "by arrangement". The moorings - not being EA are not managed by TVM, though he might like to do so at some future time.

 

Yes so you did...

But there are Green signs just downstream of Gellers former place and on his side. I pulled up to one and I am sure it said a Tenner a night... 

Edited July 21, 2017 by Paringa 

Edited May 29, 2018 by Paringa

[Johny London]

And so I found myself at the dreaded Tesco moorings yesterday - thanks to a bunch of Catweazle boats that have taken root on the EA moorings. I stopped well clear of the wooden pontoon thing and tied up to check things out. There were plenty of signs on the pontoon but nowhere else so I assumed that was the extent of DE mooring control. However, it soon transpired that there were lots of signs (east) at this tree/rough mooring bit. But all totally and utterly covered in various information flyers about other stuff. There are a bunch of little crusty boats there obviously not paying anything - and why would you when there are trees protruding left right and centre ad dog mess everywhere? In the end, (after checking with EA that I had been looking in the right place - they said they know about the Cmoors but are not doing anything about it) I swallowed my principles and moored on the nice wooden pontoon - might as well enjoy the clean level surface and the mooring rings if I'm going to cough up. The only other place was where there are a lot of no mooring signs (just before the EA bit) and the EA guy said that would be ok as the signs don't have any authority as they are not telling you who they are (also no fines are mentioned) - but there seemed to be large rocks underwarer).

To me the DE signs seem relatively clear - they make the £100 bit big and bold to frighten you into paying - so I guess that is instead of policing the area, but it is clear (ish) they want you to go online and pay a days fee. So, I did that - but after trying three times each with two cards, I could not get it to take a payment. Apparently it would not accept the cvv number (3 digit back of card) plus each time you go round again it changes the date back to/from the same day so invalidates itself). So, I phoned Reading council - which is the number provided - and a guy begrudgingly and rather disinterestedly took my fee.

So, we have Reading council subing out to DE who use the Parkonomy website to take a payment - or if that fails you have to speak to someone at the council. What an utter, utter mess.

And just one other thing - the composite decking on the pontoon is super slippery. Pulling the boat in, I slid to the edge like I was on ice - and I had my good boots on!

It's a pity they dont make the small print the big print, and vice versa - or better yet reword the whole thing. I see no cctv here though.

What a nightmare boating will be when our every destination will be monitored and logged - and charged!

[Lily Rose]

@Johny London.      Have I misunderstood about the amount or are you saying you phoned up to pay £100.

 

If so, you must have really really wanted to moor there!

[WotEver]

1 minute ago, Lily Rose said:

@Johny London.      Have I misunderstood about the amount or are you saying you phoned up to pay £100.

 

If so, you must have really really wanted to moor there!

It’s a tenner if you phone and pay. It’s £100 if you don’t bother. 

[Johny London]

That's my point about the signs - they have made so much of the fact that the charge is £100 if you don't register your arrival, that (it seems to me) people have initially been mislead into think they don't want you to moor at all. Even the name of the company is aggressive and puts your back up from the off.

Had they been called "Boaters Club" or such, and made polite signs asking you to register and pay a modest fee (I'd say £6 is reasonable for a decent clean pitch with rings) then all this ill feeling and confusion could have been avoided. Personally, as a continuous cruiser, mooring fees are very bad news - just imagine if I was paying £10 every single nite! £3650 odd quid a year = no way. However, the Thames is a bit different, so we accept this begrudgingly.

I'm on the K&A now - SO glad to get back to normal locks and mooring - phew!

 

Would it be worth starting an online petition to Reading council to ask them to take back control of their moorings and be a bit more reasonable? I intend to write them with my views anyway. Then of course there is the Cmoors to worry about.

[Robbo]

18 minutes ago, Johny London said:

That's my point about the signs - they have made so much of the fact that the charge is £100 if you don't register your arrival, that (it seems to me) people have initially been mislead into think they don't want you to moor at all. Even the name of the company is aggressive and puts your back up from the off.

Had they been called "Boaters Club" or such, and made polite signs asking you to register and pay a modest fee (I'd say £6 is reasonable for a decent clean pitch with rings) then all this ill feeling and confusion could have been avoided. Personally, as a continuous cruiser, mooring fees are very bad news - just imagine if I was paying £10 every single nite! £3650 odd quid a year = no way. However, the Thames is a bit different, so we accept this begrudgingly.

I'm on the K&A now - SO glad to get back to normal locks and mooring - phew!

 

Would it be worth starting an online petition to Reading council to ask them to take back control of their moorings and be a bit more reasonable? I intend to write them with my views anyway. Then of course there is the Cmoors to worry about.

£3650 is cheaper than a lot of moorings, especially down south!

[reg]

THE SIGN HAS BEEN ALTERED 

 

Now that's interesting the sign referred to ^^^differs significantly from the sign at the start of the thread

First sign Then

Second sign Now

Perhaps we're having an impact of sorts

Edited June 1, 2018 by reg