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Boat Pricing Conundrum!


enandess

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18 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

A quality (proper) weld is the joining of two plates into a 'single piece', the addition of an external 'snail trail' (or blobs of duck poop in my case) adds nothing to the integrity and just shows how poor the standard of welding is.

I’m referring to additions welded to the shell, quite important things like a T stud on the bow or a centre mooring line ring on the roof. 

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2 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

I have no idea who DP bridgeman Boatbuilders are.  OK, I could look it up, but without doing so, I am still confident they will not have built many shells.  They are certainly not one of the recognised quality" brands.
 

 

It says HERE he is a quality boat builder

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It is worth considering the inventory as well. Cratch covers, decent mooring lines, anchor and chain, 12 volt telly, 12 volt fridge, decent inverter and charger, solar panels with a good charger a good set of batteries and a battery monitor all these items can easily cost several thousand and you will need most if not all of them.

Also check the storage space on board, how many clothes can you get in the wardrobe, how many drawers for other clothing, is there anywhere to hang a wet coat?, spare towels and loo roll, and most important is there space for the wine and beer.

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29 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

It says HERE he is a quality boat builder

I wonder if he was anything to do with Hixon Hulls - of whom i have heard varied reports. A 2015 report showed him and Hixon operating from the same industrial estate.

Edited by Athy
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13 minutes ago, Detling said:

It is worth considering the inventory as well. Cratch covers, decent mooring lines, anchor and chain, 12 volt telly, 12 volt fridge, decent inverter and charger, solar panels with a good charger a good set of batteries and a battery monitor all these items can easily cost several thousand and you will need most if not all of them.

Also check the storage space on board, how many clothes can you get in the wardrobe, how many drawers for other clothing, is there anywhere to hang a wet coat?, spare towels and loo roll, and most important is there space for the wine and beer.

Our boat falls down on most of those points :D

 

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2 hours ago, noddyboater said:

I’m referring to additions welded to the shell, quite important things like a T stud on the bow or a centre mooring line ring on the roof

 

A WHAT?????????????????????????????????????????????????????!!

 

The centre line is for handling the boat, not mooring it. 

 

 

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Totally agree with the idea that the boat will sell itself - happened to me twice now.  However, during my last search I had the usual flight of fancy of buying a new boat to my own spec and then saw what the waiting lists were for most builders.  Certainly, when/if I win the lottery I am not going to wait many months or years for my new wonder boat to be built. I will be lookiing for a really good second hand boat that either meets my requirements or can be easily tweaked.

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19 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

Are you comparing the two boats you have listed, nether is new, the second only a year old has a rusting hull, compare the bathrooms,one fully tiled and one plane ply. look at the galley in the first. I can't see a photo second. but just compare the bedrooms. I don't know how much this boat would have been new but it would have been moored than its offered for today

Agree completely, just looking at the photos the second boat has a very, very cheap looking fit-out and obvious paint rusting. I haven't compared levels of equipment but 'kit' like inverters, batteries, galley fittings can add a lot to a boat's price as does properly done joinery.

You definitely do need to look at boats in the flesh - see, for example, how a quality fit-out like a Braidbar or Stoke Boats looks after 10-15 years and you'll see why they command higher resale values.

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10 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

A WHAT?????????????????????????????????????????????????????!!

 

The centre line is for handling the boat, not mooring it. 

 

 

There was a boat moored and left for some time on the river Weaver moored tightly with a centre line, I hope that section of river didn't come up to much.

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19 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

A WHAT?????????????????????????????????????????????????????!!

 

The centre line is for handling the boat, not mooring it. 

 

 

Follicular dissection!

You will remember one moorings landlord who insisted on boats being tied up by all three ropes.

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10 minutes ago, starman said:

Agree completely, just looking at the photos the second boat has a very, very cheap looking fit-out and obvious paint rusting. I haven't compared levels of equipment but 'kit' like inverters, batteries, galley fittings can add a lot to a boat's price as does properly done joinery.

You definitely do need to look at boats in the flesh - see, for example, how a quality fit-out like a Braidbar or Stoke Boats looks after 10-15 years and you'll see why they command higher resale values.

We have found quite the opposite in the cruiser market.

You can get two boats of the same make and model, one quite well kitted out and the other a basic boat, and provided the condition is similar then the price will be the same or very similar.

Stuff like new canopies, new nav gear, heating, new upholstery seem to make bugger all difference to the price. Of course they may make the boat more attractive to the purchaser though.

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Mines a Bridgeman hull. The bulk of it seems well put together - sides are nice and flat compared to many I've seen and the welding along the gunnels seems very consistent.

However, there are some areas that it looks like a small child did. I contacted the builder but never got a reply, which seems pretty typical of the kind of service offered in this industry.

So, as you are buying "off the peg" you can have a good look around and make sure that the quality if the hull is acceptable to you. It's a bit more difficult having one built - once you accept it you just have to get on with it.

Would I recommend Bridgeman? No.

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3 minutes ago, Johny London said:

However, there are some areas that it looks like a small child did. I contacted the builder but never got a reply, which seems pretty typical of the kind of service offered in this industry.

 

 

Did you buy it new? 

If not then their view is probably that you are not their customer and any dialogue with you will have no upside for them. Hence their failure to respond. 

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1 hour ago, Johny London said:

Would I recommend Bridgeman? No.

Thanks for the heads up...

 

2 hours ago, starman said:

Agree completely, just looking at the photos the second boat has a very, very cheap looking fit-out and obvious paint rusting. I haven't compared levels of equipment but 'kit' like inverters, batteries, galley fittings can add a lot to a boat's price as does properly done joinery.

You definitely do need to look at boats in the flesh - see, for example, how a quality fit-out like a Braidbar or Stoke Boats looks after 10-15 years and you'll see why they command higher resale values.

I did agree with this sentiment earlier... the 2 examples I gave are completely different fish even to my untrained eye.

 

3 hours ago, Detling said:

It is worth considering the inventory as well. Cratch covers, decent mooring lines, anchor and chain, 12 volt telly, 12 volt fridge, decent inverter and charger, solar panels with a good charger a good set of batteries and a battery monitor all these items can easily cost several thousand and you will need most if not all of them.

Also check the storage space on board, how many clothes can you get in the wardrobe, how many drawers for other clothing, is there anywhere to hang a wet coat?, spare towels and loo roll, and most important is there space for the wine and beer.

This is a good point... and seems to be one of the major benefits of getting a used boat compared to a new one.

 

Thanks again for all your wisdom... I think the general message seems to be get out and look around and the right boat will come along. I am hoping that the more we talk to people and the more boats we see, will get us up to speed as to what to look out for. When you hear horror stories of lemons being passed off as bargain buys or boats needing major work just after purchase, I do not want us to be the next victim. Without wishing to make a nuisance of myself, I have no doubt I shall be asking more questions and seeking more advice on our boat buying journey! ;)

 

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4 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Did you buy it new? 

If not then their view is probably that you are not their customer and any dialogue with you will have no upside for them. Hence their failure to respond. 

Yes, new from Lymm as per the one in the add above. They ignored me too :(

The fitout inside is good though. The boat above just hasn't got lots of extra bits and bobs so it's basic in that sense, but what there is is done nicely. It seems a bit over priced to me, but it's a good canvass.

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21 hours ago, D. W. Walker said:

That may be true, but Rolls-Royces never, ever, break down. However, in the words of the R-R factory, occasionally they may "fail to proceed" instead!

Reminds me about a story I heard years ago from a mechanic who used to work at a Rolls Royce dealer. Just after WW2 finished a Major wanted to go to France to view some battlefields he had been in, so along he went with his wife in Rolls Royce car, just a few days into his holiday in France the Rolls broke down. He contacted RR in England and they sent two mechanics to him about two days later. They repaired the car in a few hours.  The Major continued his tour of France, and back in England a few weeks later thought to himself I haven't had the bill yet from RR, so he contacted them and explained the problem. He was told he must be mistaken, as RR cars don't break down.

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1 hour ago, johnmoly said:

 

Reminds me about a story I heard years ago from a mechanic who used to work at a Rolls Royce dealer. Just after WW2 finished a Major wanted to go to France to view some battlefields he had been in, so along he went with his wife in Rolls Royce car, just a few days into his holiday in France the Rolls broke down. He contacted RR in England and they sent two mechanics to him about two days later. They repaired the car in a few hours.  The Major continued his tour of France, and back in England a few weeks later thought to himself I haven't had the bill yet from RR, so he contacted them and explained the problem. He was told he must be mistaken, as RR cars don't break down.

Apocryphal I think. I heard another version of this where a guy in Oz had a failed back axle. RR turn up with a new axle and proceed to strip his car. “I can’t afford this!” He cries. Same response as your story. 

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9 hours ago, Athy said:

I wonder if he was anything to do with Hixon Hulls - of whom i have heard varied reports. A 2015 report showed him and Hixon operating from the same industrial estate.

I think there have been a few builders based at Hixon that have received some very mixed reports, (more poor ones than good ones, from memory).

DP Bridgeman's web-site is quite amusing though - apparently original Joshers had shells just like a modern leisure boat does - I never knew that!

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This may have happened in the dim and distant past but nowadays I've heard a different and more credible story about RR breakdowns. 

RR don't like breakdowns to be visible to all and sundry, so if yours breaks down they like you to call them not the AA. Rather than allow a roadside repair they send a specially designed covered breakdown truck to load it into and transport it anonymously and secretly to a repair workshop.  

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