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Peterson P

Coventry Victor HDW

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Hello everyone!

A friend of mine purchased a "Coventry Victor HDW" diesel flat engine. Unfortunately we do not have many information at all about this engine. I found some data on oldengine.org though.

The engine's badge says HDA2, which implies it is an "A"ir-cooled engine. I believe the badge has been channged, as my friend's engine is definitely water-cooled.

There are two parts, one on each side of the cylinders from which we do not know what they are for. Can anyone help? I attached pictures.

 

Many thanks!

false (wrong) engine number.jpg

unknown part 2.JPG

unknown part 3.jpg

unknown part 4.JPG

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2 minutes ago, Peterson P said:

Hello everyone!

A friend of mine purchased a "Coventry Victor HDW" diesel flat engine. Unfortunately we do not have many information at all about this engine. I found some data on oldengine.org though.

The engine's badge says HDA2, which implies it is an "A"ir-cooled engine. I believe the badge has been channged, as my friend's engine is definitely water-cooled.

There are two parts, one on each side of the cylinders from which we do not know what they are for. Can anyone help? I attached pictures.

 

Many thanks!

false (wrong) engine number.jpg

unknown part 2.JPG

unknown part 3.jpg

unknown part 4.JPG

I think, only think it might be a cold start oil pot. Take the cap off, unscrew the valve at the side, pour in a thimble full of engine oil. Turn valve off, replace cap. This is to raise the compression to aid cold starts. I might be wrong though.

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Looks water cooled. I can see core plugs in the cylinder barrel castings.

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2 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Looks water cooled. I can see core plugs in the cylinder barrel castings.

You mean those (red arrow)? What are they for?

unknown part 3.jpg

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3 minutes ago, Peterson P said:

You mean those (red arrow)? What are they for?

unknown part 3.jpg

Your arrow points at the diesel injector. No, the little circular plug to the left of it are the core plugs, soft iron. They're there to hopefully pop out in the event of the water inside freezing and expanding in  cold weather, so hopefully not cracking the castings.

  • Greenie 1

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Can't see any water pipes, mind you I can't see any cooling fins either!

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3 hours ago, bizzard said:

(snip) No, the little circular plug to the left of it are the core plugs, soft iron. They're there to hopefully pop out in the event of the water inside freezing and expanding in  cold weather, so hopefully not cracking the castings.

Core plugs are where a core was placed during the casting process to produce a void or gallery within the casting. They are not designed, and should not be depended on, as a form of frost protection!

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What Blizzard says. Have been told that 50% oil and diesel mix is meant to be used but have used both neat in the past. the tops are like plungers which you force the oil/diesel into the cylinder with when you push them down. Close valves before starting. Stand back and let white smoke clear from exhaust.

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Bizzard is correct, core plugs are designed to push out to prevent damage by freezing.  The one he indicates looks very like a core plug to me.

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On 05/03/2018 at 14:40, Peterson P said:

Hello everyone!

A friend of mine purchased a "Coventry Victor HDW" diesel flat engine. Unfortunately we do not have many information at all about this engine. I found some data on oldengine.org though.

The engine's badge says HDA2, which implies it is an "A"ir-cooled engine. I believe the badge has been channged, as my friend's engine is definitely water-cooled.

There are two parts, one on each side of the cylinders from which we do not know what they are for. Can anyone help? I attached pictures.

 

Many thanks!

false (wrong) engine number.jpg

 

 

Could it be that someone in the past has fitted watercooled cylinders to your HDA ? The engine plate therefore may well be original.  The engine is also known as the Vixen from memory.

This site may be of use to you.     http://www.coventryvictor.free-online.co.uk/

Edited by Flyboy

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The HDW engine should have a raw water pump at the front below the governor housing. Looking close at the picture i'm not sure if there is one there. The oil filter is in the way from the angle of the photo. For all I know the HDA could still have the drive for the cooling pump but blanked off. The barrels are HDW with some of the pipework not fitted as mentioned earlier. I don't think from memory that the circle in the barrel is a removeable plug, maybe it's just where the molten metal is poured into the cast. There are taps on the water pipes under each barrel on my engine to drain the coolant out of them for frost protection. I also think that it is possible that this could originally have been an air cooled engine converted to water cooled by changing the barrels and heads. On the HDA the flywheel works as a cooling fan and would also have been changed.

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11 hours ago, NB Esk said:

Bizzard is correct, core plugs are designed to push out to prevent damage by freezing.  The one he indicates looks very like a core plug to me.

Popular misconception, core plugs are part of the casting process. They are there to remove the sand core after casting a hollow chamber. Absolutely nothing to do with preventing freezing damage. 

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1 hour ago, Flyboy said:

Popular misconception, core plugs are part of the casting process. They are there to remove the sand core after casting a hollow chamber. Absolutely nothing to do with preventing freezing damage. 

This is quite true. But instead of plugging them up solid with something like a threaded plug they put soft iron core plugs in so that if it does freeze there is a good chance of popping a plug instead of cracking the casting.

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1 hour ago, Flyboy said:

Popular misconception, core plugs are part of the casting process. They are there to remove the sand core after casting a hollow chamber. Absolutely nothing to do with preventing freezing damage. 

Sorry but you are the one that's wrong.  Having just retired from being a mechanic most of my working life and replacing core plugs in engine blocks, pushed out as a result of freezing, I can assure you of that.  I also have first hand experience of the sand casting process (I.e. I've done it) and I'm afraid you are confusing two entirely different things.  Hope this helps...

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Just need to correct myself here re the core plug. Had a good look at a barrel this morning and there is a soft metal plug which looks to have been driven in.

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39 minutes ago, NB Esk said:

Sorry but you are the one that's wrong.  Having just retired from being a mechanic most of my working life and replacing core plugs in engine blocks, pushed out as a result of freezing, I can assure you of that.  I also have first hand experience of the sand casting process (I.e. I've done it) and I'm afraid you are confusing two entirely different things.  Hope this helps...

It is you that is wrong I'm afraid. Core plugs have been wrongly called "freeze plugs"over the years. Please tell why core plugs are not fitted to wet liner engine blocks if they stop block cracking. I've seen lots of cracked blocks and the core plugs haven't stopped it. Do some research and you will see that you are wrong. Here is a link to start you off. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_plug

As you are from Yorkshire you probably won't accept that you have got it wrong so I won't labour the point any more, we'll just have to agree to disagree.

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57 minutes ago, NB Esk said:

Sorry but you are the one that's wrong.  Having just retired from being a mechanic most of my working life and replacing core plugs in engine blocks, pushed out as a result of freezing, I can assure you of that.  I also have first hand experience of the sand casting process (I.e. I've done it) and I'm afraid you are confusing two entirely different things.  Hope this helps...

Unfortunately not.  The clue is in the name.  The need is to plug the hole where the core , which makes the hollow part of (in this case) a cylinder barrel,  rests when the mould is filled and is extracted when the casting is broken out of the mould and fettled.  Typically for a water cooled cylinder barrel there are two cores: one which makes the  cylinder itself and one which makes the water jacket.  The cylinder one is easy to remove as there are holes at top and bottom.  The water jacket one has to be broken up in-situ and extracted through the holes made for it to sit on- Do you remember the core prints on the pattern ( painted red or sometimes black?)  when you were doing casting??

That is not to say that the core plugs ( flat, slightly dished discs of steel usually) are not often  pushed out by the action of freezing.  They are indeed. But if the core holes were not there for another reason the makers would not have put them in.  They weaken the casting, add machining costs and need to be sealed up.

 

N

 

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59 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

It is you that is wrong I'm afraid. Core plugs have been wrongly called "freeze plugs"over the years. Please tell why core plugs are not fitted to wet liner engine blocks if they stop block cracking. I've seen lots of cracked blocks and the core plugs haven't stopped it. Do some research and you will see that you are wrong. Here is a link to start you off. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_plug

As you are from Yorkshire you probably won't accept that you have got it wrong so I won't labour the point any more, we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Makes you wonder how we all managed before Google came along and turned complete tosh into believable fact.

Lol, I come from Yorkshire? Sorry, no idea where you come from.

 

55 minutes ago, BEngo said:

Unfortunately not.  The clue is in the name.  The need is to plug the hole where the core , which makes the hollow part of (in this case) a cylinder barrel,  rests when the mould is filled and is extracted when the casting is broken out of the mould and fettled.  Typically for a water cooled cylinder barrel there are two cores: one which makes the  cylinder itself and one which makes the water jacket.  The cylinder one is easy to remove as there are holes at top and bottom.  The water jacket one has to be broken up in-situ and extracted through the holes made for it to sit on- Do you remember the core prints on the pattern ( painted red or sometimes black?)  when you were doing casting??

That is not to say that the core plugs ( flat, slightly dished discs of steel usually) are not often  pushed out by the action of freezing.  They are indeed. But if the core holes were not there for another reason the makers would not have put them in.  They weaken the casting, add machining costs and need to be sealed up.

 

N

 

I know how moulding cores work and there are plenty of ways out for the sand (in the case of a crankcase or cylinder head) without creating extra work and costs, by machining holes just to plug up.  You said yourself they weaken the casting and incur machining costs.  

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Core plug holes are usually well reinforced around them so I doubt if they weaken the casting by much at all, they are on that Coventry barrel. Core plugs are usually soft iron so that they squish in and seal nicely.  Steel ones? maybe if they're well annealed.  Other non core holes with plugs are often in place to facilitate cross drilling and the like.

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Hi, i recently bought a boat with a coventry water cooled in it. It hasnt been started in years and i am wondering if anyone knows what the starting an stopping procedure is for this engine. Alsow im wondering what kind of oil it needs, and if it runs on ordinary diesel. Thnx! 

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Hi. Obviously check the engine oil condition / level ( I use 15/40w ) and the diesel ( standard ) is clean & not contaminated. Because the engine has been stood, before starting i would use an oil can & the primer pots to get some oil into the barrels and with the decompressor button locked down with the lever turn the engine over on the handle ( by hand ) and watch the oil pressure build up on the gauge. You should be able to hear the creaking of the injectors as you turn the engine over if the injection system is still primed and stop lever is in run position. I set the throttle about 1/3rd on my engine when starting. With a good battery spin the engine over still on the decompressor when it gets up speed let the decompressor go still on the starter. You should get some life even if it's only the oil from the primer pots being burnt. If she doesn't start after say 5 seconds repeat the process of using the oil can and primer pots to push some oil into barrels ( increasing the compression for starting ). You might need to prime the fuel if it's not getting through. Once you know the engine runs and the oil is warm i would carry out a full service. Don't forget to retighten the primer pot taps every time after using the plungers to push the oil into the barrels.  Good luck.

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