Carbon Monoxide alarms for boats

[AndrewIC]

The BSS guidance on CO alarms says, "choose a unit showing it was tested to BS EN 50291-2 and suitable for boat use". Seems that little "and" is important; I had originally read that as meaning that EN 50291-2 indicated that an alarm was suitable for boats, but it seems that an alarm should be EN 50291-2 and specifically rated as suitable for boats. Not all are, this is from the manual for a EN 50291-2 alarm I have at home.

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

Good post - well done - its surprising how many people don't read things / instructions before buying them.

[Richard10002]

I wonder what makes CO detection different on a boat to in a house?

Genuinely interested.

[W+T]

4 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

I wonder what makes CO detection different on a boat to in a house?

Genuinely interested.

i was about to ask the exact same thing. 

 

[Robbo]

1 minute ago, W+T said:

i was about to ask the exact same thing. 

 

I believe the. -2 means it’s been tested for vibration.  No idea why a -2 would be unsuitable for a boat but not another type of vehicle tho.

[rusty69]

6 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

I wonder what makes CO detection different on a boat to in a house?

Genuinely interested.

Same thing that makes a boat require a safety test every 4 years, whilst a house remains exempt

[Momac]

 Interesting.

I typed the same question as above !

Some seem to be rated for boats and some not . 

https://www.safelincs.co.uk/boat-camping-travel-caravan-carbon-monoxide-detectors/

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

The only thing I can find is a US website 

http://www.boatus.com/boattech/articles/codetectors.asp

that claims marine use CO detectors can take a transient spike of CO without going off (Engine start with the door open, feeding the stove etc) whereas a house CO detector will trigger at any whiff of CO.

Don't know if it's true, but a slightly higher trigger point setting for a boat unit might make sense - preventing people taking the battery out when it keeps going off.

[W+T]

8 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Same thing that makes a boat require a safety test every 4 years, whilst a house remains exempt

sounds like another rip for boat owners.

[Keeping Up]

There was one such (I forget which now) and I asked the manufacturer, they said that the "no boats" rating was because it wasn't sealed against being drenched by saltwater waves. He assured me unofficially that it would be fine for a narrowboat but of course they couldn't say so officially.

[Momac]

8 minutes ago, W+T said:

sounds like another rip for boat owners.

Actually the cheapest on the following website is boat rated 

https://www.safelincs.co.uk/boat-camping-travel-caravan-carbon-monoxide-detectors/

12 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

Don't know if it's true, but a slightly higher trigger point setting for a boat unit might make sense - preventing people taking the battery out when it keeps going off.

I don't think the sensitivity has anything to do with it as some are rated for all uses .

 

[GUMPY]

These are the ones we have

https://www.safelincs.co.uk/fire-angel-co-9d-carbon-monoxide-alarm/

And despite what it says they are technically not certified for boats.

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

3 minutes ago, Loddon said:

These are the ones we have

https://www.safelincs.co.uk/fire-angel-co-9d-carbon-monoxide-alarm/

And despite what it says they are technically not certified for boats.

• CE marked and Kitemarked to BS EN 50291-1:2010+A1:2012 (domestic use) BS EN 50291-2 (camping, caravanning and travel)

The CO-9D doesn't say it is suitable for boats.  The CO-9B or -9X do.

[Sea Dog]

14 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Don't know if it's true, but a slightly higher trigger point setting for a boat unit might make sense - preventing people taking the battery out when it keeps going off.

One of mine is the best part of 57' from the exhaust so need need for the higher trigger point thanks.  Most (all?) CO alarms do not have user replaceable batteries.

10 minutes ago, Keeping Up said:

There was one such (I forget which now) and I asked the manufacturer, they said that the "no boats" rating was because it wasn't sealed against being drenched by saltwater waves. He assured me unofficially that it would be fine for a narrowboat but of course they couldn't say so officially.

I read that somewhere too.

If the unit is OK for the vibrations if a caravan or motorhome, it's OK in the more benign conditions of a Narrowboat. I do hope that, should BSS include CO detectors in their check, they make the distinction between the damp conditions in seagoing boats and those found in a Narrowboat. 

'Course, the BSS is designed to ensure we don't maim or kill other users of the waterways rather than ourselves so, unless there's an increase in the scope of BSS, quiet self-asphyxiation really ought to remain our choice. I don't personally recommend it!

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, Sea Dog said:

One of mine is the best part of 57' from the exhaust so need need for the higher trigger point thanks.  Most (all?) CO alarms do not have user replaceable batteries.

I read that somewhere too.

If the unit is OK for the vibrations if a caravan or motorhome, it's OK in the more benign conditions of a Narrowboat. I do hope that, should BSS include CO detectors in their check, they make the distinction between the damp conditions in seagoing boats and those found in a Narrowboat. 

'Course, the BSS is designed to ensure we don't maim or kill other users of the waterways rather than ourselves so, unless there's an increase in the scope of BSS, quiet self-asphyxiation really ought to remain our choice. I don't personally recommend it!

I take it you won't be going to mrsmellys indoor barbeque tomorrow then?

[AndrewIC]

I guess you'd have to read the standard itself to see how the testing regimes differ, but I'm not spending £122 to find out!

[Mac of Cygnet]

7 hours ago, MartynG said:

 Interesting.

I typed the same question as above !

Some seem to be rated for boats and some not . 

https://www.safelincs.co.uk/boat-camping-travel-caravan-carbon-monoxide-detectors/

 

 

You can set the filters on that page to specifically include boats, but that removes only one of the 11 listed.  However, one of those left (First Alert CO-FA-9B) still doesn't mention boats.

[Momac]

6 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

You can set the filters on that page to specifically include boats, but that removes only one of the 11 listed.  However, one of those left (First Alert CO-FA-9B) still doesn't mention boats.

I have sent safelincs  an email and will report back if they respond.

 

 

[AndrewIC]

7 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

You can set the filters on that page to specifically include boats, but that removes only one of the 11 listed.  However, one of those left (First Alert CO-FA-9B) still doesn't mention boats.

The image in my original post camme from the CO-FA-9B user manual!

[TheBiscuits]

7 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

You can set the filters on that page to specifically include boats, but that removes only one of the 11 listed.  However, one of those left (First Alert CO-FA-9B) still doesn't mention boats.

Are you looking at the same page?

Ideal for home and travel use, the FireAngel CO-9B carbon monoxide detector is suitable for wall mounting or free standing as a portable device. The FireAngel CO-9B has a 7 year lifespan and manufacturer's warranty period, and is supplied as standard with 2 x AA batteries to power the alarm. Its LED status indicators show when the detector is correctly powered as well as when it has entered alarm mode.

• Battery powered CO detector - AA alkaline batteries included
• CE marked and Kitemarked to BS EN 50291-1:2010+A1:2012 (domestic use) & BS EN 50291-2:2010 (camping/caravans/boats)
• Test/reset button feature
• Activates when CO level reaches 50ppm
• Enables users to carry out a practical sensor test
• 85dB audible alarm as well as LED status indicator
• 7 year lifespan and manufacturer's warranty
• Automatic self diagnostic function - checks its own sensor and battery
• Can be wall mounted or left free standing
• Certified for home, camping, caravan, motor home and boat use
• Supplied with fixings; 2 x screws and 2 x rawl plugs

[Momac]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

Are you looking at the same page?

Ideal for home and travel use, the FireAngel CO-9B carbon monoxide detector is suitable for wall mounting or free standing as a portable device. The FireAngel CO-9B has a 7 year lifespan and manufacturer's warranty period, and is supplied as standard with 2 x AA batteries to power the alarm. Its LED status indicators show when the detector is correctly powered as well as when it has entered alarm mode.

• Battery powered CO detector - AA alkaline batteries included
• CE marked and Kitemarked to BS EN 50291-1:2010+A1:2012 (domestic use) & BS EN 50291-2:2010 (camping/caravans/boats)
• Test/reset button feature
• Activates when CO level reaches 50ppm
• Enables users to carry out a practical sensor test
• 85dB audible alarm as well as LED status indicator
• 7 year lifespan and manufacturer's warranty
• Automatic self diagnostic function - checks its own sensor and battery
• Can be wall mounted or left free standing
• Certified for home, camping, caravan, motor home and boat use
• Supplied with fixings; 2 x screws and 2 x rawl plugs

there are two models with very similar references

CO-9B

and

CO-FA-9B

 

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

8 minutes ago, MartynG said:

there are two models with very similar references

CO-9B

and

CO-FA-9B

I have just re-read the earlier post, and now understand

There is an error on that website that lists the CO-FA-9B on the boat page, but it isn't rated for boats.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, TheBiscuits said:

There is an error on that website that lists the CO-FA-9B on the boat page, but it isn't rated for boats.

Does the 'FA' mean its approved for 'not-much' ?

[Momac]

19 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Does the 'FA' mean its approved for 'not-much' ?

First Alert ?

Very similar devices with almost the same reference and different brand names , 'Fire Angel' and 'First Alert' adds to the confusion - it seems also to have confused the retailer in the case of Safelincs.

[Slim]

18 hours ago, Keeping Up said:

There was one such (I forget which now) and I asked the manufacturer, they said that the "no boats" rating was because it wasn't sealed against being drenched by saltwater waves. He assured me unofficially that it would be fine for a narrowboat but of course they couldn't say so officially.

I was just going to make the same point about great dollops of water going down the hatch on a 'proper' boat.

 

 

Frank