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First time buyer advice


Minormatt

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On 25/02/2018 at 20:29, rusty69 said:

Twas the death of poor Minormatts thread. (should we depart to another one do you think?)

And in my opinion that is happening far to often now. I enjoy a banter but lets not kill other peoples quests for information and help with it

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6 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

And in my opinion that is happening far to often now. I enjoy a banter but lets not kill other peoples quests for information and help with it

I agree.The sunday evening revelry disrupted this thread early on, but hope the OP got the answers (and an apology) they were looking for eventually.

 

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3 hours ago, Minormatt said:

I have sailed before... and yes with an engine, but only a small one.

Yes thanks guys.  I have been getting the answers!

An offer has been put in and rejected - but we arn't *that* far apart so im sure we can sort something out!

Don't forget to factor in the brokers commission - the vendor probably has a figure in mind after all the sales costs are covered.  If you get close enough to that figure you will get a deal.

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We once had a really tough negotiation with an estate sale (not a boat) until we figured out that there were three beneficiaries and they were not very good at mental arithmetic.

An easy number to divide by three in multiples of a hundred pounds closed the deal - as a lower offer than our previous one!

Why on earth they didn't accept X Pounds and Y pence each always baffled us. They could have always have flipped for the odd penny!

Edited by TheBiscuits
clarity
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On 28/02/2018 at 20:09, Minormatt said:

We are 3k apart atm...

The main issue I had, apart from a useless broker for first boat is that you negoatiate a price in the water normally, and based on the condition of the boat you see, sadly the most important bit is below the water line so a survey is essential....£300 boat out and in plus £500 survey then whilst it's out you get it blackened so if all of that is covered then £1,200 is good.

Then you find something and some people hide behind T&Cs conveniently ignoring any verbal discussions....but most will say no more movement because you'd already negotiated down.....sellers market and they seem to do what they want, especially when buyers are normally on a mission.

How much do you want it!?....is the £3K before survey?...or after?.....being honest you need £5K in hand afterwards because things will go wrong and you will want to change things. I've spent mine plus some, and now doing my own rebuild work after having to strip the front 1/3 to 1/2 of the boat.....partly own choice but also leaks hidden by the insulation, other leaks not :huh:

Good luck and enjoy, when I get back to work I'm hoping to use mine instead of hotels so with you on that one :cheers:

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3 minutes ago, Minormatt said:

Well... price agreed :o

Contract to be signed, deposit to be sent, survey to be done... then putt putt putt down the waterways 

(Yeah... like its going to be that simple/easy....)

Ooh tell more. Did you have to go the extra £3k or did you split the difference :)

 

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We made a split the difference offer and it was accepted.

I don't know if its actually good value or not... but its a much nicer boat than the similar priced and more expensive boats I viewed... so I am pretty happy.  Only thing I wish it had is a double garage :)

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10 hours ago, Minormatt said:

Unfortunately not... thats its main drawback.

No different to the old camper van though

Congratulations on your offer being accepted:). Hope the survey goes well.

Having a cassette loo is a big plus in freezing weather and frozen in. Having both is good, but I would resent paying for a pump out!

James:)

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So...

Found a surveyor (£10/ft) :)

Got the contract to sign... and it transpires that there is no evidence of VAT paid - which wasn't mentioned before.

We should get the bill of sale to the previous owner.  Boat was part x'd to back to Liverpool Boats, and the new owner bought it off them (private sale).  We should be getting a copy of that invoice.

What is the worst that can happen, and whats the likelyhood of it being a problem?

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8 minutes ago, Minormatt said:

What is the worst that can happen, and whats the likelyhood of it being a problem?

Worst : HMRCE charge you 20% of THEIR valuation of the boat (not what you paid for it), you get 14 days to pay in full.

Likelyhood : Remote

 

The invoice from Liverpool boats to the current owner should indicate if VAT was charged / paid.

 

If you had purchased it from Liverpool boats you would have full legal protection as they are 'selling in the course of a business' and product must meet 'trade descriptions, fit for purpose etc regulations'. As you are buying from a private seller you have no legal protection.

Caveat Emptor

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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6 minutes ago, Minormatt said:

So...

Found a surveyor (£10/ft) :)

Got the contract to sign... and it transpires that there is no evidence of VAT paid - which wasn't mentioned before.

We should get the bill of sale to the previous owner.  Boat was part x'd to back to Liverpool Boats, and the new owner bought it off them (private sale).  We should be getting a copy of that invoice.

What is the worst that can happen, and whats the likelyhood of it being a problem?

Agree with Alan. Not likely you will be picked up but how are you going to sell it? You may find in the future that HMRC clamp down on this and that could affect you ability to sell in the future.

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1 hour ago, Minormatt said:

Got the contract to sign... and it transpires that there is no evidence of VAT paid - which wasn't mentioned before.

 

Just like 99.9% of all canal boats sold every day.

If you want to worry about something vanishingly unlikely to ever come and bite you, this has to be high on the list!

(along with abduction by aliens)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Holy thread revival...

Boat has fallen through (before any money was spent) and the broker agreed he would have done the same thing.  

Been and looked at another which is ok... broker seemed very keen to point out that surveyors "always" say the bottom of boats are unpainted (and even if they were it would scrape off anyway) and that a surveyor would issue a new bsc from a full out of water survey if asked... does that sound correct?

Was looking at a 2003 boat being sold by the marina that built it

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5 hours ago, Minormatt said:

Holy thread revival...

Boat has fallen through (before any money was spent) and the broker agreed he would have done the same thing.  

Can/will you share why it fell through?  I noticed it was flagged as "Under Offer" last week, and I could understand it failing to proceed at survey if it had a bad one.  

I don't understand how it could fall through before survey was paid for without more information though.  Was it a rethink? Buyers' remorse? Backword from the vendor about price? Lack of confirmation of details already agreed?

It's not a dig - I am genuinely interested in how you decided to back out between offer and survey with the agreement of Nick, and without it costing you 5 grand(ish) in lost deposit.

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16 hours ago, Minormatt said:

Boat has fallen through (before any money was spent) and the broker agreed he would have done the same thing.  

Been and looked at another which is ok...

 

Ok in that it has the VAT paid certificate? 

That was the sticking point on the previous boat wasn't it?

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13 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

Can/will you share why it fell through?  I noticed it was flagged as "Under Offer" last week, and I could understand it failing to proceed at survey if it had a bad one.  

I don't understand how it could fall through before survey was paid for without more information though.  Was it a rethink? Buyers' remorse? Backword from the vendor about price? Lack of confirmation of details already agreed?

It's not a dig - I am genuinely interested in how you decided to back out between offer and survey with the agreement of Nick, and without it costing you 5 grand(ish) in lost deposit.

Maybe a cash buyer who didnt want a survey turned up so tbe owner decided to go with him for a quicker, potentially hassle free sale?

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