Bss signs

[TheBiscuits]

Was the boat given RCD certifcation and BSS at sailaway stage or when fitted out?

If the cupboard wasn't there the isolator would have been visible.

[MHS]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

Was the boat given RCD certifcation and BSS at sailaway stage or when fitted out?

If the cupboard wasn't there the isolator would have been visible.

No, the BSS was when the fit out was complete.

I have now found the search facility on a pdf on an iPhone. Press the “forward” button which is the square with an arrow pointing upwards. Then scroll left to “Find on page”

[WotEver]

2 hours ago, MHS said:

I have now found the search facility on a pdf on an iPhone. Press the “forward” button which is the square with an arrow pointing upwards. Then scroll left to “Find on page”

However, anyone searching for ‘label’ or ‘signage’ wouldn’t have much success because the wording is ‘location clearly marked’. So anyone looking through the BSS guide trying to find this information still wouldn’t find it very easy to locate it. 

[Alan de Enfield]

The BSS documentation is well laid out and in easily manageable sections - sections are clear and refer to one 'system' of the boat ( Fuel, AC Electrical, DC electrical, Gas, Ventilation, Fire extinguishers etc) so it is easy to focus in on the system  you want.

Each system then progresses thru' the system, for example with Gas it starts at the 'beginning' and progresses along the system, so

Gas locker requirements

Gas locker drainage

Gas cylinder security

Gas Shut off valves

Gas high-pressure components

Regulators

Low Pressure pipe work

Low pressure hoses

Appliances

 

All very simple and logical and something that the BSS have done exceedingly well.

Just remember the 9 section headings and then scroll down until you get where / what you want.

 

[WotEver]

9 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The BSS documentation is well laid out and in easily manageable sections - sections are clear and refer to one 'system' of the boat ( Fuel, AC Electrical, DC electrical, Gas, Ventilation, Fire extinguishers etc) so it is easy to focus in on the system  you want.

Each system then progresses thru' the system, for example with Gas it starts at the 'beginning' and progresses along the system, so

Gas locker requirements

Gas locker drainage

Gas cylinder security

Gas Shut off valves

Gas high-pressure components

Regulators

Low Pressure pipe work

Low pressure hoses

Appliances

 

All very simple and logical and something that the BSS have done exceedingly well.

Just remember the 9 section headings and then scroll down until you get where / what you want.

 

Yes indeed but as I pointed out above, when you go through those gas requirements as an example there isn’t a section for ‘Signage’. So it won’t be immediately obvious to any newbie what labelling is required unless they go through the entire document from start to end. I don’t even know off the top of my head if ‘location clearly marked’ is a consistent phrase for every section. 

[Alan de Enfield]

44 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I don’t even know off the top of my head if ‘location clearly marked’ is a consistent phrase for every section. 

The terminology is identical in each section : from the 'gas' section :

7.6.2
Are the locations of all LPG system shut‐off valves, or their means of operation, in open
view, or their locations clearly marked?

Identify the locations of the valves used for the
LPG system shut‐off facility.
Where LPG system shut‐off valve(s), or the means
to operate them, are not in open view with all
removable lids, deck boards, curtains, doors etc in
place, check for the presence of marking in open
view indicating the location.

LPG system shut‐off valves, or the means to operate
them, must:
• be in open view with all removable lids, deck boards,
curtains, doors etc in place; or,
• have their location clearly marked in open view.

From the 'Fuel' section :

2.13.3
Are all fuel shut‐off valves or cocks, or their means of operation, in open view or their
location clearly marked?

Check for the presence of fuel shut‐off valves or cocks.
If present, check that fuel shut‐off valves or cocks, or their
means of operation, are in open view with all removable lids,
deck boards, curtains, doors etc. in place.
If not in open view check their location is clearly marked in
open view.

Fuel shut‐off valves or cocks, or the means to
operate them, must
• be in open view with all removable lids, deck
boards, curtains, doors etc. in place; or
• have their location clearly marked in open
view.

Edited February 25, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[MHS]

So the answer to my original post is yes, the isolators need labels.

The new version of the Bss is 87 pages, but one of the earlier ones is over 170. I hadn’t as much time free as Alan to trawl through and find the info. Thank you for your help. 

[WotEver]

So once you know that the magic phrase is ‘location clearly marked’ you can find all instances. 

[rusty69]

Just get some of those stick on labels and follow the bss bloke round. Replace with fancy ones when hes gone. 

Simples

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, MHS said:

So the answer to my original post is yes, the isolators need labels.

The new version of the Bss is 87 pages, but one of the earlier ones is over 170. I hadn’t as much time free as Alan to trawl through and find the info. Thank you for your help. 

No problem - but, it doesn't take long to find the relevant answers, once you have read it and understand the format it only takes seconds to get to the answer.

Eg, there is no need to read the 'gas locker construction section', 'flexible hose section' 'appliance section' etc just read the section relevant - labelling of isolaters will be around the Isolation valve section.

1 minute ago, rusty69 said:

Just get some of those stick on labels and follow the bss bloke round. Replace with fancy ones when hes gone. 

Simples

Post-It-Notes are handy, you can remove them and just bring them out every 4 years.

[rusty69]

4 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

No problem - but, it doesn't take long to find the relevant answers, once you have read it and understand the format it only takes seconds to get to the answer.

Eg, there is no need to read the 'gas locker construction section', 'flexible hose section' 'appliance section' etc just read the section relevant - labelling of isolaters will be around the Isolation valve section.

Post-It-Notes are handy, you can remove them and just bring them out every 4 years.

Or marker pen

[WotEver]

5 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Just get some of those stick on labels and follow the bss bloke round. Replace with fancy ones when hes gone. 

Simples

However, be aware of this note. It’s under the notes for the fuel filler but may appear elsewhere  

”NOTE – the use of embossed tape (e.g. Dymo) or other lettering that can become illegible through cleaning or normal use is not acceptable. The marking must be legible with all lettering complete.”

[Murflynn]

14 hours ago, MHS said:

The problem looking through 170 odd pages of a pdf on an iPhone is that I’m not aware of a search facility to find the one clause you want. 

then you need to find a more digestible way of reading critical documents.......  in reality the amount of critical text could be compressed to 20 pages if done proper like.

Everyone who owns a boat should have intimate knowledge of the BSS Essential Guide.

 

[MHS]

Just now, Murflynn said:

then you need to find a more digestible way of reading critical documents.......  in reality the amount of critical text could be compressed to 20 pages if done proper like.

Everyone who owns a boat should have intimate knowledge of the BSS Essential Guide.

 

A man should only have intimate knowledge of his wife. And maybe his mistress if he’s French. 

I will have to commit the Guide to my brain. Then keep an eye out for me on Mastermind!

[Alan de Enfield]

14 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

then you need to find a more digestible way of reading critical documents.......  in reality the amount of critical text could be compressed to 20 pages if done proper like.

 

Or, just have it printed out and keep it with the rest of the 'ships papers'.

[MHS]

13 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Or, just have it printed out and keep it with the rest of the 'ships papers'.

I could get the 170 page version leather bound. If stored on our bookshelf it will correct our slight list to port!

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, MHS said:

I could get the 170 page version leather bound. If stored on our bookshelf it will correct our slight list to port!

You could also use the 2002 171 page version - that also gives loads of stuff you no longer need to comply with (unless you intend to rent out your boat, or sell 'things')

But why would you ?

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, MHS said:

I could get the 170 page version leather bound. If stored on our bookshelf it will correct our slight list to port!

Print it out 2 pages to a sheet, double sided and it only needs 43 sheets of paper.

[system 4-50]

Do you still need to understand M and A in the latest version or has it been made clearer?

[Murflynn]

11 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Or, just have it printed out and keep it with the rest of the 'ships papers'.

well that's wot I did, but then I'm a Luddite.    Mind you I don't have a smartphone and use a good old fashioned PCV where I can read all sorts of documents without missing so much as an apostrophe.

[Rob@BSSOffice]

On 24/02/2018 at 16:17, MHS said:

The domestic isolator is on the rear bulkhead, immediately where the battery cable enters the boat. The battery bank is just inches away. 

Are you offering to help?!?!

 

On 24/02/2018 at 18:58, MHS said:

I’m in total agreement with you Alan. 

The reason for my original post, is that I was surprised that they were not fitted on our new boat if they were compulsory. 

The problem looking through 170 odd pages of a pdf on an iPhone is that I’m not aware of a search facility to find the one clause you want. 

87 pages https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/268789/ecp-private-boats-ed3_rev2_apr2015_public_final.pdf

6.1.5R  Are all portable fire extinguishers in open view or their location clearly marked?  missing from the list posted above

[Rob@BSSOffice]

On 24/02/2018 at 15:56, Sea Dog said:

They're in a kitchen cabinet?!  I'd have gone for putting them in the fridge as the cold will be better for electrical conductivity!

That would be a seriously cold fridge

[Machpoint005]

On 2/24/2018 at 18:47, Alan de Enfield said:

But are you not having to apply 'signs' because there were none,

You don't actually know that. Signs can fall off!

[Sea Dog]

15 hours ago, Rob@BSSOffice said:

That would be a seriously cold fridge

Absolute!