should I start with a shorter narrowboat ?

[PMcC]

1 hour ago, bizzard said:

The beauty of a short boat, like cars is that you more likely to find a parking space that it fits and you're more likely to be able to ''about turn it'' if you lose your way or decide to go the other way or you've over shot a turning, unlike long boats 50-70' which often have to travel perhaps miles before they can turn around. Long boats can also be anti social. One of them can occupy the whole landing stage outside a pub for example, depriving others from drinkies.

Good point about taking up space but I need the space for the thousands of litres of red wine I'll be bring over from France , (where I live now)

[Tony Brooks]

Nasty things trads & semi trads. All too often engine access is limited unless it has a proper engine room and access into the back cabin can be something of a contortion. There is also nowhere to sit out in the air on a read and on many semi trads you are stuck with fixed seating either side. We don't all like obstructing the tow path with our "sitting out gear".

I have down-sheeting orotund my cruiser stern that gives a little projection from the weather and if I want war air blowing up then rather than robbing warmth form the boat I can just lift one of the deck boards with small wedges. A Desmo socket allows em to put a table up and I can get four soft folding chairs around it, plus the gas tank top to act as  a serving table. That brings me onto another thing about trads - gas bottle storage and access.

Its very personal but I am with Mrsmelly on cruiser sterns.

[PMcC]

1 hour ago, BWM said:

You will have no problem with the longer boat and will be glad of the extra space it provides, almost certainly steering will be less effort and if well ballasted will roll less too.

Thanks for the encouragement , especially as I'll have a darkroom aboard

24 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Good advice. I suggest a day at good old Wilton having a snoop round.

Thanks , I'll be over from France at the end of the month for a couple of days in Northampton so I'll find time to visit some boatyards and Marinas hopefully.

[Naughty Cal]

6 minutes ago, PMcC said:

Good point about taking up space but I need the space for the thousands of litres of red wine I'll be bring over from France , (where I live now)

A larger boat doesn't necessarily mean more storage. It all depends on the layout of the boat.

[rusty69]

A trad is much more pleasing to my eye than a cruiser, well as pleasing as a glorified shipping container that a typical narrowboat is, can be .

[PMcC]

1 hour ago, Tumshie said:

I suppose the question is why does Phill feel a cruiser stern is for him?

Hi Tumshie Well although I'm alone ,I do have family that will visit, the thought of them in the bow and me stuck up the stern, seems a bit strange, or am I missing something ?

Phill

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

A larger boat doesn't necessarily mean more storage. It all depends on the layout of the boat.

This is very true. There is a huge amount more storage on this 68 foot boat than there was on my 70 foot boat and I mean OOOOge amount more. Also the actual cabin length is an extra eighteen inches as even tho its two feet shorter it doesn't have a pretty pointy end which in fact was wasted space as a liveaboard boat on the 70 footer. The op already knows that looking at boats is the only way to know realy.

[TheBiscuits]

I would also say that the fitout of the boat can be more important than the overall length.

I have seen well-designed 45' boats with more useable space inside than some 57' boats with less well-designed layouts.

 

[PMcC]

48 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

I VASTLY prefer cruiser sterns. I have had one Trad because that boatbuilder only built trads at that time and it was ok but not anywhere near as nice as  the few cruiser sterns I have owned. At present I have a semi trad cos swmbo wanted to try one out and its ok but not as nice as the space on a cruiser with yer table on it with the glass of wine. As for the weather aspect well something obvious springs to mind. Short too life, rearrange those three and realise that if its blowin, raining, freezing then you don't boat...........simples. Remember you will not be on any restrictive timescale that the working classes have to adhere to so you can boat when it suits so yes stick to the cruiser stern idea. As others have said longer boats drive better but the downside is when singlehanding the weight is considerably more when mooring it up and yes moorings are harder to come by because of the numpties who leave gaps and don't share mooring rings on busy visitor mooring spots  As for costs te decent and half decent boats sell quickly and do not drop in price pre winter.

Thankyou for the reply ,interesting they don't drop in winter. Now you mention wine ! are there breath tests on the canals

Phill

[system 4-50]

60ft boat. 70yo me. Size of boat not a problem, just take extra care when attempting to moor with an gale-force off-bank wind (ie don't) as holding the boat against the wind whilst dealing with pins etc can be hard.  Large cruiser stern & wouldn't change it. It can be cold and I will do something about that one day. Mostly I avoid boating in driving rain. Easy access to engine and associated bits which is good because I don't bend so well. Easy and safe tiller operation.

Edited February 11, 2018 by system 4-50
add pic. add pic 2nd attampt.

[mrsmelly]

6 minutes ago, PMcC said:

 Now you mention wine ! are there breath tests on the canals

Phill

NOT YET..................but of course no one ever drinks and drives 

[PMcC]

2 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

NOT YET..................but of course no one ever drinks and drives 

I was only thinking about any other boats not my one of course

[MtB]

On 11/02/2018 at 12:30, Tony Brooks said:

Nasty things trads & semi trads. All too often engine access is limited unless it has a proper engine room

 

Couldn't agree more. When I recommended a trad, a proper back cabin and separate engine room with decent vintage engine and plenty of room around it is so blindingly obvious I forgot to even mention it!

Trad stern with engine under the floor, yes a recipe for stress and disappointment. Deffo. 

[Tumshie]

11 minutes ago, PMcC said:

Hi Tumshie Well although I'm alone ,I do have family that will visit, the thought of them in the bow and me stuck up the stern, seems a bit strange, or am I missing something ?

Phill

Nope, missing nothing. Seems perfectly valid to me. 

My family all together all at once, however.... 

[MtB]

On 11/02/2018 at 12:41, PMcC said:

Hi Tumshie Well although I'm alone ,I do have family that will visit, the thought of them in the bow and me stuck up the stern, seems a bit strange, or am I missing something ?

Phill

 

Yes you are missing something.

Your family will probably render down to visiting for a cruise about once a year. You are in danger of buying a boat to suit this situation perfectly that will be an uncomfortable compromise for the other 364 days of the year. By the boat that suits YOU, not the occasional guest. 

In addition, as a liveaboard it is better to have the space INSIDE the cabin length than outside, broadly speaking. Some peeps with cruisers fit pram hoods, but please don't. Anyone with any aesthetic sensibility recoils in horror when one is encountered... 

[mrsmelly]

9 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Yes you are missing something.

Your family will probably render down to visiting for a cruise about once a year. You are in danger of buying a boat to suit this situation perfectly that will be an uncomfortable compromise for the other 364 days of the year. By the boat that suits YOU, not the occasional guest. 

In addition, as a liveaboard it is better to have the space INSIDE the cabin length than outside, broadly speaking. Some peeps with cruisers fit pram hoods, but please don't. Anyone with any aesthetic sensibility recoils in horror when one is encountered... 

Apart from the crappy inside engine room with an antique in I completely agree. Buy for yourself not for anyone else and whatever you do please PLEEEEEESE do NOT have any form of Pram hood!! simply horrendous things.

[PMcC]

8 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Apart from the crappy inside engine room with an antique in I completely agree. Buy for yourself not for anyone else and whatever you do please PLEEEEEESE do NOT have any form of Pram hood!! simply horrendous things.

You don't know my family :)) I'd guess children and grandchildren (all can swim like fishes) would be aboard at least two months a year, I've kids in the South and North so one set will be in range I'm sure.

[MtB]

On 11/02/2018 at 13:09, mrsmelly said:

Apart from the crappy inside engine room with an antique in I completely agree. 

 

Ignore mrsmelly. He has no soul. How can ANYONE possibly not utterly LURVE to have a proper vintage engine like a heart beating in their boat!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mrsmelly likes Japanese digger engines. Nuff said  

[Tumshie]

I love my family but they should ALL be corralled at the bow and only syphoned back to the stern one at a time.

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, Tumshie said:

I love my family but they should ALL be corralled at the bow and only syphoned back to the stern one at a time.

Having five kids and nine grandkids and a big boat we learnt years ago that a boat should have only one double bed on it for myself and the missus therefore making stop overs uncomfy for any offspring 

[MtB]

On 11/02/2018 at 13:20, PMcC said:

You don't know my family :)) I'd guess children and grandchildren (all can swim like fishes) would be aboard at least two months a year, I've kids in the South and North so one set will be in range I'm sure.

 

On a more serious note, swimming in the canal is a BAD IDEA. Weils disease can be caught from ingesting the water and it is often fatal. 

I'm not sure if or how the canoeists mange the risk, and they are often soaking wet with canal water on their faces.

[kawaton]

Whats with the anti-pram hood sentiment?

Having never used one, i wouldn't know.

I am torn between semi trad and cruiser and have been considering a pram hood to keep the stern dry and covered when the boat is not in use.

So im curious as to what is peoples issue with them.  is it just that to some they are not pleasing on the eye?

 

imo.....

Cruiser - more space for kids/dogs, but imo uncomfortable for long journeys and my tea gets cold, and diluted by rain.

Semi trad - more comfortable, if gated can keep dogs in the boat, but tend to have steeper stairs which the dogs dont like

Trad - not for me

[TheBiscuits]

4 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

On a more serious note, swimming in the canal is a BAD IDEA. Weils disease can be caught from ingesting the water and it is often fatal. 

I'm not sure if or how the canoeists mange the risk, and they are often soaking wet with canal water on their faces.

Well we start out in a boat designed to turn upside down then take it down waterfalls, so risk assessment might not be our strong suit ...

As for ingesting the water, you soon learn to try not to!  Most canal water is actually quite clean compared to some canoe runs, but there is a risk present.

Note that the easiest way to get it is through cuts or abrasions, so if you are handling wet lines with a cut on your hand you are more likely to get it, especially if there is a large rat population near where you are moored.

[PMcC]

With my little knowledge, I would have thought that a hood that's easy to take down would be a godsend, bearing in mind that on the lousy days you would use it no-one else would be out to see it  Although I've spent many many hours in bad weather just waiting for the light to be right to take a picture, once in -18C for two days .

Phill

4 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

Well we start out in a boat designed to turn upside down then take it down waterfalls, so risk assessment might not be our strong suit ...

As for ingesting the water, you soon learn to try not to!  Most canal water is actually quite clean compared to some canoe runs, but there is a risk present.

Note that the easiest way to get it is through cuts or abrasions, so if you are handling wet lines with a cut on your hand you are more likely to get it, especially if there is a large rat population near where you are moored.

I would imagine that everyone falls in from time to time :))

[BWM]

53 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Couldn't agree more. When I recommended a trad, a proper back cabin and separate engine room with decent vintage engine and plenty of room around it is so blindingly obvious I forgot to even mention it!

Trad stern with engine under the floor, yes a recipe for stress and disappointment. Deffo. 

An engine in the situation you describe will almost inevitably suffer from lack of maintenance at some stage too.

4 minutes ago, PMcC said:

With my little knowledge, I would have thought that a hood that's easy to take down would be a godsend, bearing in mind that on the lousy days you would use it no-one else would be out to see it  Although I've spent many many hours in bad weather just waiting for the light to be right to take a picture, once in -18C for two days .

Phill

I would imagine that everyone falls in from time to time :))

A pram hood once fitted will rarely be taken down, in the same way a mains hook up often becomes an umbilical cord preventing the boat to which it's attached from cruising..