Forth and Clyde Closure

[AllanD]

Totally agree,  a fantastic opportunity could be lost forever.  Our children and children's children may get to read about the Lowland Canals in history books but then again maybe not.

Edited February 15, 2018 by AllanD

[13-10]

1 hour ago, magpie patrick said:

A few thoughts to add...

A lot of work has been done on the benefits of scottish canal restoration, mostly by erstwhile colleagues and compatriots who now work for PBA and do much the same work for other organisations. Whilst much of the economic benefit of restoration is not directly related to boating it's a fair bet that a pivotal assumption underlying the work was that the waterways would be navigable. As I work in the same field this is the sort of assumption we have to make - it's very difficult to quantify what the economic benefits would be if the same waterway were not navigable without completely redoing the exercise although some work suggests that navigability adds around 30%. The point is, if the canals are not navigable, the benefits forecast, and currently being achieved will change: I've yet to see a non-navigable canal outperform a navigable one so the benefits will go down.

Interestingly, I'm working on another waterway where the client is adamant that secure, through navigability is critical to the benefits.

Whilst SW and SP may think that it's navigable except for two bridges, the loss of a through route will damage navigation, which in turn will be reflected in maintenance, a lack of which will creep from the bridges, after all, why pull shopping trolleys out of the first hundred yards either side of the bridge when no one can use it? then as one can't reach the bridge why maintain the next lock...

In short, not fixing these bridges is the thin end of a nasty wedge for the lowland canals

Unfortunately the rot had already started.

The Union has not been properly dredged and has overgrown so much that in some places only one boat at a time can pass through. When large areas of weed have become detached from the bank we've had cases of hire boats 'running aground' on them.

SC have a complete monopoly on moorings which are few and far between and have made it almost impossible to moor on other parts of the canal.

The few guys still working on the canal try their best but have no backing from the management.

I think it will be an uphill battle but it's got to be worth a try

[Iain_S]

4 hours ago, magpie patrick said:

(snip)

Whilst SW and SP may think that it's navigable except for two bridges, the loss of a through route will damage navigation, which in turn will be reflected in maintenance, a lack of which will creep from the bridges, after all, why pull shopping trolleys out of the first hundred yards either side of the bridge when no one can use it? then as one can't reach the bridge why maintain the next lock...

In short, not fixing these bridges is the thin end of a nasty wedge for the lowland canals

Exactly! The top 4 locks on the east side will get very little use with Bonnybridge shut (I can only think of one boat which might use them), and there is little attraction in cruising from the Wheel junction to Bonnybridge.

It is not, however, the thin end of a nasty wedge; it's a bit further up than that  From the Scottish Canals website :

Quote

Operating Hours

From Friday 23 March a pilot scheme will be in place from Maryhill to Bowling (Locks 21 – 38), with operation on a four day week, Friday to Monday. This will allow us to carry out increased dredging along the Lowland Canals.

While most transits on this stretch take place over the weekend, a new and additional servicehas been introduced to allow you to call and book manned assistance from Scottish Canals staff. This service will be charged at £60 and can be booked by calling 07810 794 467. Please note that this service requires at least 24 hours’ notice.

First time I've heard a reduction in availability and a charge described as "a new and additional service! 

Edited February 15, 2018 by Iain_S

[13-10]

But importantly cyclists and kayakers will not be affected 

[Waterway2go]

1 hour ago, 13-10 said:

But importantly cyclists and kayakers will not be affected 

it seems that the less you pay to use the canal, the better service you get.

[ronnietucker]

I've sent an email to pretty much all the major Scottish newspapers giving them the gist of the story and some bullet points. Also emailed my local MSP.

Can't just sit and do nothing.

[ronnietucker]

5 hours ago, 13-10 said:

SC have a complete monopoly on moorings which are few and far between and have made it almost impossible to moor on other parts of the canal.

Does this mean I can't just whack a couple of pins into the grass and moor up anywhere along the canal? I have to use a designated mooring spot? Because they DO seem a bit thin on the ground (looking at maps).

[haggis]

Yes you can knock in couple of pins if you can get to the bank where the foliage doesn't make it difficult to see where the water stops and the banking begins 

The Forth and Clyde is better in this respect than the Union 

Haggis 

Scottish Canals are under the impression that boaters only want to stop where they have said we can. We have tried to tell them about the delights of wild mooring but it falls on deaf ears 

Edited February 15, 2018 by haggis

[AllanD]

One of major issues for me was the inability for spontaneous cruising. Having always to plan ahead, arrange transit through the Falkirk Wheel,  mooring overnight in the basin,  arranging transit through the locks and bridges and having to cruise almost in convoy to accommodate the manner in which SC operate. It is a far cry from the situation on other areas which just happen to be those which seem to be flourishing with ongoing development. 

[TheBiscuits]

3 minutes ago, AllanD said:

One of major issues for me was the inability for spontaneous cruising. Having always to plan ahead, arrange transit through the Falkirk Wheel,  mooring overnight in the basin,  arranging transit through the locks and bridges and having to cruise almost in convoy to accommodate the manner in which SC operate. It is a far cry from the situation on other areas which just happen to be those which seem to be flourishing with ongoing development. 

I hadn't realised until this thread that was how SC work.  We have always fancied doing the lowland canals, but did not want to spend a couple of grand trucking our boat there and back.

I had semi-arranged borrowing a boat from friends in Fife just to do the trip, but with the broken bridges we can't even do that.

I still think the marina under the Kelpies looks nice though, and have done the Falkirk Wheel on the trip boat.

Maybe that is all we will get from the lowlands canals - very sad indeed.

[AllanD]

With this proposal concerning Bonnybridge and Twechar bridges you will still be able to make it from the Kelpies up along to Edinburgh via the Falkirk Wheel. 

[AllanD]

This morning my thoughts turn to those of the boating community at Auchinstarry, those who moor there and the businesses who service them. The Boathouse pub/restaurant is a good stopover and I worry that if the proposed closure is lasting then it would impact them considerably.  Also the availability of fuel for those at Kirkintilloch area. 

[13-10]

11 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

I hadn't realised until this thread that was how SC work.  We have always fancied doing the lowland canals, but did not want to spend a couple of grand trucking our boat there and back.

I had semi-arranged borrowing a boat from friends in Fife just to do the trip, but with the broken bridges we can't even do that.

I still think the marina under the Kelpies looks nice though, and have done the Falkirk Wheel on the trip boat.

Maybe that is all we will get from the lowlands canals - very sad indeed.

As AllanD says you can go from the Kelpies to Edinburgh. Once you've passed through the Falkirk Wheel upper locks you are lock free until Edinburgh and the bridge at Lochrin Basin.

That'll probably take a week. Do visit, it's worth the trip

[magpie patrick]

35 minutes ago, 13-10 said:

As AllanD says you can go from the Kelpies to Edinburgh. Once you've passed through the Falkirk Wheel upper locks you are lock free until Edinburgh and the bridge at Lochrin Basin.

That'll probably take a week. Do visit, it's worth the trip

Better still, make the trip, then write a travel blog saying how good it was and how much better it would have been if you could've got to Glasgow as well and how much money you didn't spend because you couldn't do this. Put it online and send a link to Scottish Waterways, the relevant MSP etc

[haggis]

Great idea! We need as many people as possible to write to the Scottish Government and their MSPs about the situation. You could write to Scottish Canals too but it will fall on deaf ears, sadly. We need the Scottish Government to get a wake up call and to look beyond the weasel words which they are fed by Thin (Chairman of the Board) and Dunlop (Chief executive). One thing both are good at is playing politics and sadly up till now they have been believed.

Haggis

[ronnietucker]

3 hours ago, haggis said:

We need as many people as possible to write to the Scottish Government and their MSPs about the situation. - Haggis

 

Absolutely. I emailed my local MSP who knew nothing about this and said he's going to inquire about it up the chain.

So, yeah, email your MSP about this. Most probably know nothing about it.

UPDATE:

I asked my MSP:

Quote

Would you advise other boaters to contact their local MSPs? Would that give the subject more traction?

Response:

Quote

Yes indeed, any MSP with a canal passing through their constituency should have some concerns about this.

If anyone wants my email to copy/paste to their MSP just drop me a PM. All hands on deck!

Edited February 17, 2018 by ronnietucker
update from my MSP

[ronnietucker]

The F&C story is in this month's Tillergraph magazine:

Good to see it featured somewhere in the press.

[AllanD]

I think I read somewhere that SC would arrange to briefly open the two bridges to allow those "trapped" between them to move to other moorings.  I also recall a mention of reduced mooring charges for those directly affected.  Can anyone else confirm any such arrangements being made.

[Up-Side-Down]

There is a proposal to open the canal around 14th March, possibly using a crane to lift the bridges. However, it is suggested that a third bridge is now inoperative (a swing bridge in Old Kilpatrick carrying Ferry Road) so nothing is definite. There are currently 3 boats trapped at Bowling that need to head east up the canal.

There is an offer of a derisory reduction in the licence fee for those boaters actually trapped by the bridges – i.e. moorers at Auchinstarry.

12 hours ago, ronnietucker said:

The F&C story is in this month's Tillergraph magazine:

Good to see it featured somewhere in the press.

There is also a full page article in this month's Towpath Talk Ronnie – you can get a copy FOC from the office at Bowling.

[Iain_S]

2 hours ago, Up-Side-Down said:

There is a proposal to open the canal around 14th March, possibly using a crane to lift the bridges. However, it is suggested that a third bridge is now inoperative (a swing bridge in Old Kilpatrick carrying Ferry Road) so nothing is definite.

(snip)

Is that Erskine swing bridge?

If so, it has been a bit problematic in hot weather for some time, as the bridge expands* and fouls the stonework. We, and a couple of others, were trapped there for a day in 2012. Wouldn't have thought that would be a problem at this time of year, but maybe it's been moved on to the "Urgent" list! It would make sense to fix it at the same time as the other ones.

* That was the explanation given in 2012, when it was a hot day. I suppose it might not be simple expansion, though, perhaps a change of shape?

[Up-Side-Down]

Correction: I've just had confirmation that it is in fact Ferry Dyke Bascule Bridge, between the bridge you refer to and the DropLock at Dalmuir. So nobody wanting to go east can leave Bowling for the foreseeable future. SC are keeping very quiet about this third failure which means that for a boater planning a trip, life has become even more difficult. We now have 3 boats at Bowling wanting to take up their booked moorings in Glasgow and Auchinstarry.

 

But, yes, hot weather regularly puts Ferry Road Bridge (beside the Erskine Bridge) out of action in the heat of a summer's day (we do get them in Scotland!).

[ronnietucker]

Just as well I wasn't planning anything (other than practice) for summer.

I hope everyone has been nagging their MSPs about this.

[13-10]

Apparently Ladbrokes have reduced their odds to 2-1 that The Falkirk Wheel won't open on time due to 'technical difficulties'

[Up-Side-Down]

Is this serious 13-10? Have Ladbrokes really opened a book on this event (or rather lack of it)?

Along with the three duff bridges, it does potentially represent the fourth nail in the SC coffin!

[ronnietucker]

11 minutes ago, 13-10 said:

Apparently Ladbrokes have reduced their odds to 2-1 that The Falkirk Wheel won't open on time due to 'technical difficulties'

They can open it all they like. No one can get to it.