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Generator Accidents - A Timely Reminder


Alan de Enfield

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1 hour ago, jonathanA said:

Slightly off topic but related so hope Alan doesn’t mind....

also quite dangerous the use of camping stoves and heaters.....  

And disposable barbecues.  Apparently give off a lot of CO in their dying stages, have caused several deaths to campers.

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On 23/01/2018 at 15:23, LadyG said:

I've just bought a 1000W vacuum cleaner, does that mean I can run it off a 1000w inverter?

Almost certainly not. The inverter will be rated in VA, as WotEver has said.  VA unlike watts, do not cater for power factor (the difference  between real and apparent power). Actual inverter power rating is likely to be 800 watts.

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3 hours ago, cuthound said:

Almost certainly not. The inverter will be rated in VA, as WotEver has said.  VA unlike watts, do not cater for power factor (the difference  between real and apparent power). Actual inverter power rating is likely to be 800 watts.

 

And I was thinking of a completely different reason. The stall current of an electric motor might be typically ten times its steady state running current. An inverter unlike the National Grid, cannot be relied upon to deliver that very high transient starting current without bending a con rod.

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2 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

And I was thinking of a completely different reason. The stall current of an electric motor might be typically ten times its steady state running current. An inverter unlike the National Grid, cannot be relied upon to deliver that very high transient starting current without bending a con rod.

A decent quality low frequency inverter such as those offered by Victron or Mastervolt won’t have a problem with starting currents. 

It’s the high frequency ones that catch fire that can’t cope with transients. 

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12 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

And I was thinking of a completely different reason. The stall current of an electric motor might be typically ten times its steady state running current. An inverter unlike the National Grid, cannot be relied upon to deliver that very high transient starting current without bending a con rod.

That as well.

Industrial inverters, as used in UPSs automatically transfer the load to the mains when momentarily overloaded, so that they can trip breakers and blow fuses.

Marketing people love VA, they can sell things that appear biggercthan they are. I'm surprised they haven't started selling batteries that way. 

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On 23/01/2018 at 15:56, Wanderer Vagabond said:

 Add to that whether or not there is someone at BSS whose role it is to collate incidents or coroners reports, I don't know, and I would suggest that reporting is a lot lower than the actual number of incidents and near misses.

That's me and my colleague Dave. Without any shadow of any doubt there is under-reporting. And that is at two different levels. Firstly with totally miss some incidents - in some ways the most critical and useful ones. they are the close run events, the minor flames and smoke, the CO alarm activations. These incidents are the most useful be cause there are survivors, witnesses and little enough damage to get the full story of what happened.

The second sort of under reporting is the 'detail'. So we get to hear about a fire, but we never get understand who, what and how it happened. the incident gets logged but no lessons are extracted.

Like the MAIB or role is not to appoint blame or point fingers at individuals. It rather to learn lessons and share that learning with anyone where it can give greater benefit - with boaters, navigation authorities, the marine industry, boating organistions, fire service, industry groups etc.

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On 23/01/2018 at 16:29, ditchcrawler said:

No electrocutions ? 

Good question. We get to hear about very few electrocutions. As such we can be moderately confident that there are very few if any deaths in a marine enviroment by electrocution. But I don't think we get to hear about 'jolts', perhaps the wider audience here know something or have experience to share?

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On 23/01/2018 at 15:00, dor said:

It was not clear what the source was, although the DTI removed the gas fridge, but the size of flame on those would be unlikely to be enough.  It was suspected that the cooker rings were run and poor ventilation was the cause.  He was a pharmacist so you would think he was aware of the risks.

I think that's the fridge we took off to Dometic to examine, but they could not find a fault. The Coroner's expert witness identified a hole in the gas heater flue, but did not conclude it was significant.
However gas fridge flames have been the known cause of incidents of CO. The key thing to keep on top of is the burner and not letting rust and rubbish build up on top of it. Always too have the flue pipe properly sited and in good condition. Routine servicing is a good thing to have with all gas appliances.

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On ‎23‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 22:46, Alan de Enfield said:

And - keeping the ashes from the fire in a bucket in the cratch / front deck - smoulder away during the night pouring out Co 'just for fun'.

I've never understood why folks do this, especially with a massive source of water to damp them down to safe disposal levels but a few feet away?

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4 hours ago, Hudds Lad said:

I've never understood why folks do this, especially with a massive source of water to damp them down to safe disposal levels but a few feet away?

 

OMG are you one of those monsters who chuck their ash into the cut??? Where do you think it goes to?? :o:o

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Just now, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

OMG are you one of those monsters who chuck their ash into the cut??? Where do you think it goes to?? :o:o

good god man, no!

I merely meant you scoop some water from the cut and douse your hot ashes rendering them wet & cold and safe for disposal by sensible means

only thing I chuck in the canal is the occasional dregs from my cup of coffee when that last inch or so goes cold

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