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Liverpool boat


Jat60

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Hi

I am looking at buying a Liverpool boat that is obviously second hand. 

Is anyone aware of obvious issues I should be aware of?

I am having the vessel surveyed, but I do recognise this will only cover certain areas.

 

Tia.

 

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Hello and welcome to CWDF. Many of us here (myself included) have owned or do own Liverpool boats, or boats with Liverpool shells: the company supplied a great many shells to individuals and other companies who then fitted them out. The youngest ones are probably approaching 10 years old now, so the emphasis is not so much on how well they were built in the first place as how well they have been maintained since.

Ours was robustly built and served us well; when we came to sell it the broker discovered that the side deck was 1" wider on one side than on the other, but this had affected us so little that we hadn't even noticed.

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14 minutes ago, Jat60 said:

Any ideas on what vehicle the 70hp Isuzu came out of? 

I have fixed the "h" albeit temporarily. 

Is this boat a wide beam ?

70hp sounds a lot for a narrowboat.

My engine is an Isuzu 70, its a 3.0 ltr. Marinised for the purpose. think it was the engine out of the trooper with no turbo. Its probably a canaline engine.

Edited by Bazza954
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12 minutes ago, Jat60 said:

Any ideas on what vehicle the 70hp Isuzu came out of? 

Its unlikely to have come out of any vehicle - one would hope that it would have been a new engine that was installed.  It is, however' unlikely that it has a 70Hp engine installed - If it is a NB, I'd suggest 30-40hp tops.

 

Make sure you ask your surveyor to check not only the width (beam) of the boat (as some were built a bit on the plump side) but to check for straightness as well. Some of Liverpool boats are known to have been built 'banana shaped' and whilst any particular point is the correct width, overall, if you were to moor against a straight edge, you can see the bow, it could be oversize (overall) and would preclude the use of some of the locks on the system.

 

Liverpool boats were a mass producer using a 'production-line' method and they tend to be at the 'starter-end' of the spectrum and consistent quality was not one of their strengths.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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1 minute ago, Bazza954 said:

Is this boat a wide beam ?

70hp sounds a lot for a narrowboat.

My engine is an Isuzu 70, its a 3.0 ltr. Marinised for the purpose. think it was the engine out of the trooper with no turbo. 

Great. Thankyou. It's a 67ft narrow. I guess it was spec'ed by the buyer originally. Thanks again.

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Getting serious again...Isuzus were fitted new as standard to a number of Liverpool boats. The company is Japanese and builds light commercial vehicles. As Bazza says, if it's a 70h.p. model it should have more than enough power - which means that itprobably won't have been thrashed.

So, how old is the boat? have you actually seen it in the "flesh"? Does it look clean and tidy with little or no rust and (not joking here) smell O.K. inside?

Edited by Athy
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1 minute ago, Athy said:

Getting serious again...Isuzus were fitted new as standard to a number of Liverpool boats. The company is Japanese and builds light commercial vehicles. AsBazza says, if it's a 70h.p. model it should hav emore than enough power - which means that itprobably won't have been thrashed.

So, how old is the boat? have you actually seen it in the "flesh"? Does it look clean and tidy with little or no rust and (not joking here) smell O.K. inside?

2007. Seemingly excellent condition with only 140hrs on the clock. No smells inside, and not bent like a banana. (I doubt the banana comment is true).

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1 minute ago, Jat60 said:

2007. Seemingly excellent condition with only 140hrs on the clock. No smells inside, 

That sounds promising - though I can't imagine that the engine has run for only 140 hours in 10, whoops 11 now, years, so it may well be a replacement engine, which is even better new.

2 minutes ago, Jat60 said:

and not bent like a banana. (I doubt the banana comment is true).

In pantomimes across the land, an appropriate answer to that will be said this evening. Some boats do indeed have a slight curve, though I don't think it's a syndrome which is restricted to, or even particularly, prevalent in, Liverpool shells.

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Just now, Athy said:

That sounds promising - though I can't imagine that the engine has run for only 140 hours in 10, whoops 11 now, years, so it may well be a replacement engine, which is even better new.

It's on hook up, and according to neighbours has never been moved after the first year other than blacking. The paintwork is a bit mossy, but I'll sort that. No rusty bits or anything. 

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3 minutes ago, Athy said:

That sounds promising - though I can't imagine that the engine has run for only 140 hours in 10, whoops 11 now, years, so it may well be a replacement engine, which is even better new.

or maybe a new clock especially if it is one of those combined rev counter/LCD clocks that stop working.

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Just now, Jat60 said:

It's on hook up, and according to neighbours has never been moved after the first year other than blacking. 

Ah, I see, you could be backing a winner there.

On the other hand, boats which have lived long in marinas and hooked to shore power can sometimes have a problem with corrosion of their hull under water. I am not scientific enough to understand why, but it is so. So an out-of-water survey would, I think, be advisable.

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2 minutes ago, Athy said:

Ah, I see, you could be backing a winner there.

On the other hand, boats which have lived long in marinas and hooked to shore power can sometimes have a problem with corrosion of their hull under water. I am not scientific enough to understand why, but it is so. So an out-of-water survey would, I think, be advisable.

Yes, i thought that. Hence requested a survey. It's not in a marina. I reckon I've had a bit of a result as long as it ain't bent like a banana.

  • Greenie 1
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6 minutes ago, Athy said:

That sounds promising - though I can't imagine that the engine has run for only 140 hours in 10, whoops 11 now, years, so it may well be a replacement engine, which is even better new.

My boat was 5 when I bought her. 14 hours on the engine, 2 of which were my test drive! I have absolutely no doubt about the validity of the hours recorded, it simply hadn't cruised at all and everything was just as brand new.  An unusual example, I'll grant you, but in truth you don't need to try too hard to find boats that don't move very much.

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It does happen I have watched boats being built at Johnathon Wilsons  and sometimes the baseplate material isnt as straight as it should be now a good builder sees that and sends it back others who are sending boats out at 2 -3 a week dont care and you have a boat with a curve in it

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Sea Dog is right, there must be plenty of boats in marinas or on long term moorings which have averaged 14 hours or less of moving per year; to me that's just a long day but I can perfectly understand those canal users who wish for various reasons to stay rooted to one spot. It does mean that you need to worry about corrosion if the electrics were not up to standard, and I think there can also be issues with an engine that has lain unused for a long period, which others with more knowledge than me could tell you about?

Having said that, I did a trip 15 months ago helping to move a boat which had spent many years in one place (apart from a day or two of moving 6 months before I turned up), and the engine ran well. It did have a tendency to stall at low revs during the first day or two of the trip, but by the time we'd given it a good work out going up river on the Nene it was going like a dream and got us to London no problem.

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39 minutes ago, Jat60 said:

I doubt the banana comment is true

It is true and a number have been reported on this very forum.

The locks at the bottom of the Llangollen are some of the narrowest and they tend to identify the 'banana Boats' quite easily.

The bend is not easily seen (they have been normally been about 1 foot in a 60 foot), so although the boat is only (say) 7 feet wide, it actually takes up the space of an 8 foot wide boat.

Moor against a straight edge with the bow and stern touching the side and see how much 'gap' there is at the centre.

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53 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

It is true and a number have been reported on this very forum.

The locks at the bottom of the Llangollen are some of the narrowest and they tend to identify the 'banana Boats' quite easily.

The bend is not easily seen (they have been normally been about 1 foot in a 60 foot), so although the boat is only (say) 7 feet wide, it actually takes up the space of an 8 foot wide boat.

Moor against a straight edge with the bow and stern touching the side and see how much 'gap' there is at the centre.

Or tight at the centre with a gap at bow and stern.

Neil

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You might care to sight along each side of the boat to see if there are slight 'bumps' where the curved bow section meets the straight sides. I know of at least three Liverpool shells with this 'feature' that have met challenges at Hurleston Bottom lock. I have personal experience of one of them . . . .  It hasn't stopped us from covering about 7000 miles around the system since 1998 without problems, including the locks on the Cheshire flight which are marked as particularly tight. In all other respects our boat has been fine, apart from the 'floppy rudder syndrome' mentioned in another thread, which was fixed by renewing the bolts and welding.

Mike

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