Smoke on The water

[Sapphal]

Any comments on this article in today's Times?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/smoke-on-the-water-from-canal-boat-stoves-turns-river-cam-into-shanghai-njlvdb0hr

[Boat&Bikes]

Some boats burn some very Smokey fuel.

Ian.

[Chewbacka]

I did like the reported boater comments when told it was being considered that future residential moorings would require the boat to be heated by shore supplied electricity - "However, some boat dwellers have said they are reluctant to switch to electricity unless it is free, with local taxpayers footing the bill."

[Sapphal]

The Times could have got  a better picture - not taken in summer with nobodys stove lit!!

1 minute ago, Chewbacka said:

I did like the reported boater comments when told it was being considered that future residential moorings would require the boat to be heated by shore supplied electricity - "However, some boat dwellers have said they are reluctant to switch to electricity unless it is free, with local taxpayers footing the bill."

Great,  I'm sure the local land based residents will jump at the idea.

[mrsmelly]

Other land based properties are available.

[Flyboy]

5 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Other land based properties are available.

So are other types of heating stoves.

[Chewbacka]

2 minutes ago, Sapphal said:

The Times could have got  a better picture - not taken in summer with nobodys stove lit!!

Great,  I'm sure the local land based residents will jump at the idea.

Sounds a bit like 'give me free power or I will poison you', this sort of article just increases the general public's negative view of livaboards, as shown by this partial comment left after the article -  "Others around Reading and Oxford, owned by ‘hippies’, are floating unhygienic slums, moved around at night to avoid paying fees. Outside the law." 

Unfortunately these boaters upset the locals so when local authorities or CRT decide to remove VMs or reduce the time allowed there is no support for the 'good' boaters that will be disadvantaged.  It will not be long before public opinion swings against on-line, low cost moorings for cc boats.  I don't suppose CRT will shed a tear when it happens..............

[Athy]

The comment about Austria puts the situation into perspective.

[Chewbacka]

Just now, Athy said:

The comment about Austria puts the situation into perspective.

But being Austria they probably do not burn the sort of fuel that is being complained about.  The other big difference is that with a house with a high chimney the smoke & fumes are well diluted before reaching the ground, whereas with a boat with a typical boat chimney the fumes are emitted at a height suitable for blowing straight in through the nearby house doors and windows.  

[mrsmelly]

7 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

So are other types of heating stoves.

Not that are any good for living on. There is only one type and that is solid fuel the rest are toys. I once bought a house in a beautiful place and quickly found it was actualy a little too close to a nearby pub. I didn't complain, I didn't go and ask the pub to close or stop serving beer I simply sold the house, simples.

[Peter X]

So how much smoke do boats at wharves in Shanghai actually make? There are people on this forum with real experience in the shipping industry, can they tell us?

[Flyboy]

6 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Not that are any good for living on. There is only one type and that is solid fuel the rest are toys. I once bought a house in a beautiful place and quickly found it was actualy a little too close to a nearby pub. I didn't complain, I didn't go and ask the pub to close or stop serving beer I simply sold the house, simples.

Unfortunately I think that eventually you will be forced to use an alternative heat source when solid fuel stoves are banned. It's just a matter of time I think, and that time is not too far away.

[Sapphal]

11 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Not that are any good for living on. There is only one type and that is solid fuel the rest are toys. I once bought a house in a beautiful place and quickly found it was actualy a little too close to a nearby pub. I didn't complain, I didn't go and ask the pub to close or stop serving beer I simply sold the house, simples.

I agree.  Our local pub had been there for over a hundred years.  some new houses built and now the pub can't play music after 10pm, ridiculous.

[mrsmelly]

6 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

Unfortunately I think that eventually you will be forced to use an alternative heat source when solid fuel stoves are banned. It's just a matter of time I think, and that time is not too far away.

I very much doubt it. Laws have to be enforceable and that would not be. There simply is no other source and any governing body would work out that they were on a loser trying to enforce it. Other heating sources are fine in houses then all the pollution is carried out by power stations for the electricity to maintain the pumps etc etc. Diesel stoves have been tried but are not up to the job and most of those need leccy to work. Still its all going to change cos the government says so, for instance in 19 years from now all cars in the uk are going to be electric, it was announced last year that it would be within twenty years, that's one of the reasons the fitting of charging points is already underway in every street and block of flats in the uk. To assist with the process Rail fares are still going up way above inflation to ensure none of us want to run cars anyway.

[Athy]

5 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

 all cars in the uk are going to be electric, it was announced last year that it would be within twenty years, that's one of the reasons the fitting of charging points is already underway in every street and block of flats in the uk. To assist with the process Rail fares are still going up way above inflation to ensure none of us want to run cars anyway.

Er, I don't quite follow that logic. Certainly, the fitting of charging points for toy electric cars is proceeding apace, I have noticed quite a few of them lately. But surely an increase in rail fares (modest though it be) will encourage, rather than discourage, people to use their cars.

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, Athy said:

Er, I don't quite follow that logic. Certainly, the fitting of charging points for toy electric cars is proceeding apace, I have noticed quite a few of them lately. But surely an increase in rail fares (modest though it be) will encourage, rather than discourage, people to use their cars.

Now I know you are winding me up!! Roll eyes!!

[Athy]

4 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Now I know you are winding me up!! Roll eyes!!

No, i simply seek enlightenment. It may be that I should not have taken your post at face value.

[peterboat]

I read about this on google yesterday the council own the moorings so they have the power in the end and we all know this will end badly for the boaters! As for the rises in ticket prices whats the issue? why should I fork out to keep rail prices low? nobody pays for my fuel in my cars but me If people dont like it move jobs or houses

[john6767]

1 hour ago, Chewbacka said:

Sounds a bit like 'give me free power or I will poison you', this sort of article just increases the general public's negative view of livaboards, as shown by this partial comment left after the article -  "Others around Reading and Oxford, owned by ‘hippies’, are floating unhygienic slums, moved around at night to avoid paying fees. Outside the law." 

Unfortunately these boaters upset the locals so when local authorities or CRT decide to remove VMs or reduce the time allowed there is no support for the 'good' boaters that will be disadvantaged.  It will not be long before public opinion swings against on-line, low cost moorings for cc boats.  I don't suppose CRT will shed a tear when it happens..............

This is in Cambridge, why are you having a go at CRT?

[matty40s]

5 minutes ago, john6767 said:

This is in Cambridge, why are you having a go at CRT?

He doesnt, he mentions local authorities(ie Cambridge), Or CRT - who are doing the same in London and other areas.

Edited January 3, 2018 by matty40s

[Athy]

4 minutes ago, john6767 said:

This is in Cambridge, why are you having a go at CRT?

CB's remarks also pertain to Reading and Oxford, both of which have CART waterways within their boundaries. Whether either or both of them has/have a substantial liveaboard population I don't know.

[john6767]

Just now, matty40s said:

He doesnt, he mentions local authorities)ie Cambridge), Or CRT - who are doing the same in London and other areas.

I am sure CRT are putting pressure on in other areas but Cambridge is nothing to do with them.,

[Graham Davis]

1 hour ago, mrsmelly said:

I very much doubt it. Laws have to be enforceable and that would not be. There simply is no other source and any governing body would work out that they were on a loser trying to enforce it. Other heating sources are fine in houses then all the pollution is carried out by power stations for the electricity to maintain the pumps etc etc. Diesel stoves have been tried but are not up to the job and most of those need leccy to work. Still its all going to change cos the government says so, for instance in 19 years from now all cars in the uk are going to be electric, it was announced last year that it would be within twenty years, that's one of the reasons the fitting of charging points is already underway in every street and block of flats in the uk. To assist with the process Rail fares are still going up way above inflation to ensure none of us want to run cars anyway.

I see no evidence of that, on both new developments or existing ones.
 

[Detling]

It doesn't matter how many charging points for cars they put in, where are they going to get the electricity from, we have been within 2% of the UK's total power generation capability on several occasions this year. Also most towns and housing area's are wired with an expectation of 3-4 kilowatts per household, double that to allow for charging of 2 cars and we have to dig up the roads to put in bigger wires.

[KevMc]

12 minutes ago, Graham Davis said:

I see no evidence of that, on both new developments or existing ones.
 

I heard somewhere that Mayor Khan has said that new building in London will not be granted planning permission if it has any parking spaces at all - bet he gets driven around in a nice motor though