Tractor Posted December 23, 2017 Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) I am trying to locate a 3 port valve to operate from 12 Volts, 15mm connections preferred. Required to divert engine hot water from calorifier to radiators. Thanks Edited December 23, 2017 by Tractor Spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoominPapa Posted December 23, 2017 Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) I used one of these for the washing machine hot water supply project, and it's been fine. 1/2" BSP ports, easily converted to 15mm compression if needed with standard plumbing fittings. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-way-motorized-ball-valve-DN15-reduce-port-T-port-electric-ball-valve/122677856218?hash=item1c902b87da:g:UjAAAOSwcu5UNlLW MP. Edited December 23, 2017 by MoominPapa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted December 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 Thank you, looks like what I need. Tracror Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted December 28, 2017 Report Share Posted December 28, 2017 Although it's a 3 way valve it's actually called a T-port valve rather than a 3 port valve. Another type of 3 way valve is the L-port valve which operates slightly differently. I have a manually operated L-port valve which I can use to switch the hot water supply from calorifier to gas water heater or vice versa. Make sure you know which one you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 Is it possible to get push fit motorised valves, like Speedfit or Hep H2O? If not, how do you fit them into a 15mm push fit system? A couple of 2 way valves on one switch, where one opens and one closes, would be really handy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dccruiser Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Richard10002 said: Is it possible to get push fit motorised valves, like Speedfit or Hep H2O? If not, how do you fit them into a 15mm push fit system? A couple of 2 way valves on one switch, where one opens and one closes, would be really handy. You can use the valves above with 1/2" to 15mm adapters from screwfix, the plumb centre or the like https://www.screwfix.com/p/hep2o-hx29-15ws-adapt-brass-male-socket-x-15mm/5970f ... As for switching one off and another on just put two relays in line with a double pole double throw switch , then you can wire it to change the polarity to the motorised valves dependent on the switch position thereby closing one as the other opens and visa versa, you could of course do the same thing without relays, but personally i over engineer things and would also add l.e.d.'s to my panel fed from the relays to confirm which valve was open and which was closed Easy enough to find a handful of useful relays in any car breakers yard .... i top up my toolbox every time i go and you would be amazed how many times i have found an equivalent relay to a boat heater plug relay or such like that had i had to buy through a Chandlery would have cost 40 to 80 quid. Rick Edited December 29, 2017 by dccruiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted December 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 Thanks for the help with this. My pipe work is all plastic, 15mm I am guessing, so an adaptor, metric to imperial is available, ‘dccruiser’. The boat has a Webasto for calorifier and radiators which works fine, but I am planning to use a valve to divert hot, engine water, to the radiators. The 12 Volt vale recommended looks ideal ‘MoominPapa’, this appears to have limit switches to remove the supply at limit of travel, and comment from Blackrose is a good prompt to make sure I get the right ‘porting’ arrangement? This is all preliminary stuff, so come the new year I will get the job done.... Thoughts, my plastic pipe is Grey with hand tight fittings, is it possible to ‘clamp’ this stuff whilst cutting the pipe to insert the valve? The thought of draining the contents and antifreeze, will make the job a bit messy. Also I guess I need to watch engine temp. Beta 43, to make sure it is still running at the right temperature. Thanks for the help with this, I will keep you posted on the result .... Tractor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 Thanks for that Rick. I agree on the on off lights, but I don't really know what a relay is, or how it works, so picking up from a scrapyard won't be on the cards for me. Having said that, as relays seem to be quite useful, it might be worth me educating myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted December 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 (edited) Relay, just a remote switch operated by a coil. Energise the coil, which is an electromagnet, with say 12 Volts, this ‘pulls’ the contact of the switch together to make the circuit for the electrical supply to something, heate light etc. The relay permits a light signal, to the coil with low current, to switch a high current, like the starter motor on the engine with hundreds of amperes. Tractor Edited December 29, 2017 by Tractor Insert a word Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileypete Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 (edited) Might be useful to use two 2 port valves, could have them both closed until the engine is up to temp, to help mitigate 'overcooling'. No experience of these but they aren't too dear and have a good temp rating. They use water pressure to open and close (servo valve), so need a bit of flow. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HEAVY-DUTY-N-C-12V-DC-1-2-ELECTRIC-SOLENOID-VALVE-NORMALLY-CLOSED-FOR-WATER-AIR/112488447167 ETA: One other thing, if the rads are going to be cooled direct from the engine, it'll increase the system volume and you may need a bigger expansion bottle. Edited December 29, 2017 by smileypete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza954 Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 23 minutes ago, smileypete said: Might be useful to use two 2 port valves, could have them both closed until the engine is up to temp, to help mitigate 'overcooling'. No experience of these but they aren't too dear and have a good temp rating. They use water pressure to open and close (servo valve), so need a bit of flow. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HEAVY-DUTY-N-C-12V-DC-1-2-ELECTRIC-SOLENOID-VALVE-NORMALLY-CLOSED-FOR-WATER-AIR/112488447167 ETA: One other thing, if the rads are going to be cooled direct from the engine, it'll increase the system volume and you may need a bigger expansion bottle. That's a good question, he says he already has a webasto running the central heating, won't there be an expansion tank on that system ? Also, is he planning on circulating through the webasto boiler ? Would like to know how he plans to connect into the existing system. Bazza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileypete Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Bazza954 said: That's a good question, he says he already has a webasto running the central heating, won't there be an expansion tank on that system ? Also, is he planning on circulating through the webasto boiler ? Would like to know how he plans to connect into the existing system. Bazza A good way to use spare engine heat for heating is with a car heater matrix and a decent fan or two. Needs fitting somewhere (step?) but with a bit of clever ducting it could be made to blow hot air at the steerers feet which would be nice. Edited December 29, 2017 by smileypete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dccruiser Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 3 hours ago, smileypete said: A good way to use spare engine heat for heating is with a car heater matrix and a decent fan or two. Needs fitting somewhere (step?) but with a bit of clever ducting it could be made to blow hot air at the steerers feet which would be nice. Tickled me you mentioned that ... i have a heater matrix and fan with 2 ducts from an early mini that has sat in my lock up several years waiting to be fitted under the pram hood cover ... reading your post might just give me the kick up the harris to finally fit it Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted December 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 Taking good notice of the comment, I now have a system with three 2 port valves, a pressure vessel, and some logic is now required to ensure the Webasto is shut down, isolated after a time delay, and the engine connected to the radiators via the two ‘two port’ valves. A monitor for engine temperature would be useful to reverse the operation should the heat load be excessive. As is the way, thought this would be a simple modification, work in progress, thankyou for the advice. ~ Tractor ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Tractor said: A monitor for engine temperature would be useful to reverse the operation should the heat load be excessive. That’s what the engine thermostat is for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileypete Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 (edited) If you really want to heat the rads from the engine, another way of doing it is via a plate heat exchanger, won't be quite as effective as a direct connection but the two systems remain separate. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hrale-Stainless-Steel-Heat-Exchanger-10-Plates-max-22-kW-Plate-Heat-Exchanger/331858113137 The webasto pump or a cheap circulation pump can circulate water on the rads side while the engine is running. One side of the heat exchanger could be put in after the calorifier coil, the other side after the webasto. 5 minutes ago, WotEver said: That’s what the engine thermostat is for. The takeoffs for the calorifier on the engine block (originally intended for a heater matrix in a car/van) usually bypass the thermostat. Edited December 29, 2017 by smileypete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted December 29, 2017 Report Share Posted December 29, 2017 4 minutes ago, smileypete said: The takeoffs for the calorifier on the engine block usually bypass the thermostat (originally intended for a heater matrix in a car/van) Yeah, I know. I thought OP was talking about taking the feed from the main cooling circuit though. I guess I got it wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Jeavons Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 One point worth noting is that these 12v 3-port (T-valves) do not have a mid-position (like domestic mains powered 3-port valves) where flow goes to both outlets. It's either one port or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 8 hours ago, Stephen Jeavons said: One point worth noting is that these 12v 3-port (T-valves) do not have a mid-position (like domestic mains powered 3-port valves) where flow goes to both outlets. It's either one port or the other. Are you sure? T-port valves usually offer 1-2-Both whereas L-port valves only offer 1 or 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 1 minute ago, David Mack said: Are you sure? T-port valves usually offer 1-2-Both whereas L-port valves only offer 1 or 2. Indeed. As per this earlier post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Jeavons Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 Forget the definitions from previous posts. The valve in question if you follow the link, has 3 ports, it is therefor a 3-port valve. Look at the specs of it and you'll see it only has two positions. There is no mid position. Domestic AC driven mid/position valves are sprung loaded and use a trick with a diode to lock the drive motor to get mid position and fully open positions whilst retaining power to the motor. The DC valve has no means of doing this, if you stall s DC motor it will burn out. These valves are not sprung loaded like domestic ones. If I've missed something in reading the spec please tell me. I would love a mid position 12V valve for my system. I haven't found one yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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