Chris J Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Hi all, So like the numpty newbie that I am smashed on the 24/7 heating to get through this cold snap and almost completely ran out of diesel. Resulting in the flame going out and the stove (a Morso squirrel conversion) sooting up quite heavily.. something thats never happened before. Any way I awaited a diesel delivery gave the stove a good clean out and froze to death for a couple of nights. I was hoping that a full tank of diesel would be all that was required to get some heat back in our lives. Not the case. The stove can be lit and burns a healthy blue flame but after about 20 minutes (can also hear a rather loud and fast dripping sound) the flame gradually lowers itself down the burner pot until its just a yellow flame burning away the remaining diesel in the hole where the fuel drips through until it burns out. Anyone have any ideas whats going on or what I can do to remedy this. I have used the cleaning rod, I have cleaned out the stove, paying attention to remove the coke from all of the little air holes in the burner pot. If I turn the regulator on I can physically watch the diesel entering the burner pot. The stove has been rock solid until running out of fuel, really need to get this sorted as its unbearably cold right now! Thanks in advance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Not much help to you now but it is problems like this that make people prefer solid fuel stoves. They rarely let you down when you really need them. I don’t know much about diesel stoves other than they are a PITA to live with. My best guess is yours is dripping fuel in too fast. A fragment of dirt in the governor probably. I suspect it needs dismantling and cleaning. Other, better informed people will be along in the morning to help you better than I can so hang on in there! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEO Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Check the thermo coupling point in the burner pot very carefully, you may have damaged it whilst cleaning the stove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Have to agree with Mike. For most newbies with solid fuel stoves the worst they can expect is not being able to light the fire and in this weather they'll soon learn. For someone more familiar with your stove it probably wouldn't be a problem, but as a newbie in the middle of winter I feel for you. Can you get in touch with the previous owner to get some advice? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bagdad Boatman (waits) Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 these stoves don't like dirty fuel if you do not fit a filter in the supply then any muck will clog the stove supply classic behaviour of a blocked fuel pipe try blowing back from the stove to the tank. This is a common problem if you run out of fuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris J Posted December 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 3 hours ago, LEO said: Check the thermo coupling point in the burner pot very carefully, you may have damaged it whilst cleaning the stove. What is the thermo coupling? What am I checking for, How may it be broken? 6 minutes ago, The Bagdad Boatman (waits) said: these stoves don't like dirty fuel if you do not fit a filter in the supply then any muck will clog the stove supply classic behaviour of a blocked fuel pipe try blowing back from the stove to the tank. This is a common problem if you run out of fuel. There is a fuel filter in line at the tank end of the supply. What exactly do you mean by blowing back from the stove to the tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 09:48, Chris J said: What is the thermo coupling? What am I checking for, How may it be broken? On a gas boiler it is virtually impossible to break so I suspect it is not what I know as a thermocouple. Do you have the manual for your squirrel conversion? It will almost certainly have a section on fault tracing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 01:32, Chris J said: The stove can be lit and burns a healthy blue flame but after about 20 minutes (can also hear a rather loud and fast dripping sound) the flame gradually lowers itself down the burner pot until its just a yellow flame burning away the remaining diesel in the hole where the fuel drips through until it burns out. Can you expand in this please? Is the fuel still dripping through at this point or has it stopped? And has the "rather loud and fast dripping sound" stopped at this point, or does it continue? Was the rather loud and fast dripping sound present before you ran out of fuel? Completely running right out of diesel is a Really Bad Idea and best avoided. But you may have figured this out already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEO Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Hi, The thermo coupling is a small point which projects in the burner chamber. It heats up by the flame (when the fire is alight) to keep the fuel supply valve open. They are easily broken or damaged when cleaning the inside if the fire. If broken the fuel will flow when the shut off valve is overridden when lighting, but will not stay open when heated by the flame. Only option is to replace it. They may be more robust on a gas boiler but they are pretty delicate on boat stoves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty69 Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 10 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said: Do you have the manual for your squirrel conversion? It will almost certainly have a section on fault tracing I probably have a manual for a lockgate squirrel conversion around somewhere if you get stuck OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Brummie Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 (edited) 1: Clean the filter by the tank. 2: Bleed the filter after reassembling. 3: Disconnect the oil feed from the float control and check that clean fuel is flowing freely, and for about a minute without interruption. Check that you have no 'up' runs in the fuel supply. If you have you need to re-establish the syphon. 4: Clean the filter on the inlet to the float control. 5: Refit the feed pipe and relight. If your problem still persists; 6: Remove the top of the float control and remove the metering column, clean out the feed slot, remove any debris that may have accumulated. 7: Don't run out of oil. Of all the above, 3 is probably the main cause. I suspect that you have introduced an airlock that allows a small amount of fuel to syphon through, but insufficient to maintain combustion. After this, you will understand your diesel stove much better and be able to appreciate all of its benefits and advantages over solid fuel. Edited December 10, 2017 by Ex Brummie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuthound Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 4 hours ago, LEO said: Check the thermo coupling point in the burner pot very carefully, you may have damaged it whilst cleaning the stove. I agree it is likely to be this ^^. If not the needle valve in the regulator may not be closing properly due to a bit of dirt in it. 14 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said: On a gas boiler it is virtually impossible to break so I suspect it is not what I know as a thermocouple. Do you have the manual for your squirrel conversion? It will almost certainly have a section on fault tracing. The thermocouple is exactly the same as one used for s, except (obviously) it controls a diesel valve, not a gas valve. If it is not correctly positioned in the flame, it may cause the fuel to shut off intermittently, causing the flame to die out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Brummie Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 If it is the pot burner I'm thinking it is, you won't have a thermocouple. When Lighting, do you have to hold a button in for a short period of time? If it rums for 20mins, then fuel supply has to be the problem. A thermocouple fault like on Kabolas, would not let you light it to start with and run for 20 mins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickent Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 This just goes to show how important it is on a boat to have at least two forms of heating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmelly Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 You will survive but it is cold innitt. Lesson learnt and add to this years running costs installation of a proper squirrell then you will never be cold again. Where are you? can you get to marina somewhere and get electric to get some instant heat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris J Posted December 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 22 minutes ago, Ex Brummie said: If it is the pot burner I'm thinking it is, you won't have a thermocouple. When Lighting, do you have to hold a button in for a short period of time? If it rums for 20mins, then fuel supply has to be the problem. A thermocouple fault like on Kabolas, would not let you light it to start with and run for 20 mins. In sure I don't have this thermocouple. Not inside the burner pot anyway. There is just a hole in the bottom of the pot where the fuel comes it. The same hole that the fuel line clearing rod pushes through. Stove lighting method is diesel isolator on, turn on regulator but leVe set to off on the heat regulator (the dial that turns through off/1-6) couple of caps of meths in the pot light with a match close door. Let it warm the flue for around 30 seconds then switch regulator to 1. Normal practice would then be wait for around 15-20 minutes before adjusting the heat setting of the regulator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickent Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Hope you get this sorted, when a boat is properly heated it's the best place on earth to be, but without heat a boat is not a nice place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris J Posted December 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 Assuming this pointy thing is a thermocouple.. I do not have one. This is not my burner pot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 11:07, Chris J said: Assuming this pointy thing is a thermocouple.. I do not have one. This is not my burner pot! That looks like the thermocouple on a gas boiler. As I said, they are bombproof and very difficult to physically damage. The flame however, eventually erodes through the outer metal leading to the internal guts being exposed once they get old. This is being mistaken I suspect by that nice Mr LEO above, for user damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEO Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 50 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said: That looks like the thermocouple on a gas boiler. As I said, they are bombproof and very difficult to physically damage. The flame however, eventually erodes through the outer metal leading to the internal guts being exposed once they get old. This is being mistaken I suspect by that nice Mr LEO above, for user damage. MtB..........agree about your comments, but wish the T Couples were as durable - I have broken a couple (2) (excuse pun) due to knocking them with a wire brush when cleaning the unit -------or they look Ok but fail to work properly... and snap off completely when touched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 10:10, Ex Brummie said: 3: Disconnect the oil feed from the float control and check that clean fuel is flowing freely, and for about a minute without interruption. Check that you have no 'up' runs in the fuel supply. If you have you need to re-establish the syphon. I too think this seems the most likely problem. But this will only be the problem if the OP's Squirrel is fed directly from the (low level) boat tank rather than a dedicated day tank mounted near the stove and two or three feet higher, I'd suggest. Perhaps the OP could clarify the details of the fuel supply. Is there a day tank? Where is it and how high is it? Whatever the answer though, the fix is to disconnect the fuel pipe from the control box and drain out a litre or so of diesel from it into a container. Id some bubbles/air come out with the fuel then a fix has probably bee achieved. Bung it all back together and test it out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On my Dickinson, I had a problem with air locks in the pipe between the tank and the burner control. I had to suck and blow and all sorts to move them out and get a good steady delivery again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris J Posted December 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 2 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said: I too think this seems the most likely problem. But this will only be the problem if the OP's Squirrel is fed directly from the (low level) boat tank rather than a dedicated day tank mounted near the stove and two or three feet higher, I'd suggest. Perhaps the OP could clarify the details of the fuel supply. Is there a day tank? Where is it and how high is it? Whatever the answer though, the fix is to disconnect the fuel pipe from the control box and drain out a litre or so of diesel from it into a container. Id some bubbles/air come out with the fuel then a fix has probably bee achieved. Bung it all back together and test it out! The stove is fed from the main diesel tank. It's completely gravity fed with no pumps in line with a steady decent from the tank to the regulator of about 2ft. Will investigate suggestions when j get home in a few hours. Thanks all for the help so far. I may need guidance disassembling everything, will be sure to post back on my findings, quandaries, or what's to do in case of flooding cabin with diesel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 5 minutes ago, Chris J said: The stove is fed from the main diesel tank. It's completely gravity fed with no pumps in line with a steady decent from the tank to the regulator of about 2ft. Will investigate suggestions when j get home in a few hours. Thanks all for the help so far. I may need guidance disassembling everything, will be sure to post back on my findings, quandaries, or what's to do in case of flooding cabin with diesel. But is it a down ward flow all the way, no anti vibration loops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 And what diameter is the pipe? If 8mm or less I reckon it just needs a damned good bleeding. If there is a fuel filter arc the stove end these often have a bleed screw on top you can use and that may well clear an air lock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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