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Calder & Hebble length


Nick D

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You will see from a previous posting that we will be taking our boat home to its new mooring at Fairies Hill Marina on the Aire & Calder via the Rochdale Canal.  There is a nominal length restriction on the Calder & Hebble of 57' 6" but we are 58".  I'm sure I have read somewhere that we should be ok (maybe going diagonal in wide locks?) but can't remember where I found this.  Can anyone put my mind at rest please? Thanks.

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58ft is fine - you may want to reverse down the top and middle locks at Salterhebble, I know of two 60ft boats that do that. I'm 57 plus fenders and don't recall being so tight as to be concerned coming down normally. Shepley Bridge is also a bit short but you won't have a problem if you take good care.

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Our boat is an accurate 57 foot but with fenders it is 59 foot. We have been up and down these locks quite a few times with no problems. You may possibly have to do one or two locks on your own and not share but it only adds a few minutes.

Take care and watch the cills and keep your rudder clear. 

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We have just completed the C&H downstream in our 57ft + front and rear fenders and did struggle on some of the locks due to high leakage from the top gates threatening to swamp the back deck when needing to position the boat in the centre of the cill to open the bottom gate to exit. Just make sure your back deck is as watertight as possible and keep your wits about you at all times. The worst was Salterhebble top where we had to pole the bow past the bottom gate to avoid reversing into the centre of the lock to manoeuvre and swamping the back deck from a heavy leak. I remember saying at the time if they're all like this I'm going back down the Rochdale! Thankfully they weren't and we enjoyed out trip on the C&H (practically had it to ourselves) but are pleased to have the extra couple of feet again on the L&L locks.

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You are probably referring to the handspike which was originally used to operate many of the top gate and ground paddles. In essence it is a metre-ish long piece of timber that is inserted into a ratchet mechanism which is turned one or two notches at a time. Some people have proper posh ones (even proper painted posh ones!) 

We have just come up from the Aire and Calder and stopped at a timber merchant just above Fall Ing lock. We bought a metre long piece of planed 75mm x 50mm (3 by 2) for just over £4. It might not last too long if in continuous use but it will probably see us out.

In any event, there are few, if any, locks where its use is mandatory as many have windlass-worked options as well and some have no handspike mechanisms at all. However, it is good to be able to try it out. Also, as the number of non-functional paddles is quite high, a backup option is always useful, or at least comforting.

We are officially 60ft (new Tyler Wilson so I doubt if they threw in extra steel for free) and have managed it as far as just below Huddersfield. We have only managed from the Rochdale to Coopers Bridge once before in our previous boat (also supposed to be 60ft). It was always necessary to be extra vigilant, especially going down. Even coming up it is important to avoid catching the swan neck on the bottom gate platforms. It is worth working out a rope technique so that at least two, if not three, are deployed to control the boat on the diagonal.

Edited by Mike Todd
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6 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

You are probably referring to the handspike which was originally used to opera

A piece of wood that is familiar with Bizet's Carmen?

But yes, I too think the OP is referring to a handspike, The Calder and Hebble one's are impressive, some navigations just  used a crowbar

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11 minutes ago, rgreg said:

You need a Calder & Hebble stick which is, I believe, available from Shire Cruisers at Sowerby Bridge. Otherwise a 1 metre length of 3in x 2in hardwood tapered at one end will work.

Ordinary softwood will do for at least one transit. at 3 by 2 it does not need tapering. We previously had a piece of 4 by 2 which did need tapering. Alas it failed to make the transfer from our old to our new boat so we had to start again. Memory was a bit faded and I tapered the 3 by 2 only to discover that it was counter-productive.

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4 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

Ordinary softwood will do for at least one transit. at 3 by 2 it does not need tapering. We previously had a piece of 4 by 2 which did need tapering. Alas it failed to make the transfer from our old to our new boat so we had to start again. Memory was a bit faded and I tapered the 3 by 2 only to discover that it was counter-productive.

Fair enough; I was just going off the dimensions of the handspike I brought with me which is 3 x 2 and tapered like a baseball bat at one end and worked fine.

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11 hours ago, magpie patrick said:

A piece of wood that is familiar with Bizet's Carmen?

Perhaps used to help the male soprano's hit the high notes? Can't imagine which part of the male anatomy it might be used on though :P

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21 hours ago, Mike Todd said:

 

In any event, there are few, if any, locks where its use is mandatory as many have windlass-worked options as well and some have no handspike mechanisms at all. However, it is good to be able to try it out. Also, as the number of non-functional paddles is quite high, a backup option is always useful, or at least comforting.

 

Salterhebble Top and Kirklees Upper and Lower are all handspike only on the top paddles. Cromwell and Park Nook as well

Edited by Mac of Cygnet
To add 2 locks.
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I agree that getting the back deck swamped is an issue. We are only 50ft,which gives some wiggle room. Not sure I would fancy taking a 60ft  cruiser stern down the Sir John Ramsden and Calder & Hebble canals.

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Took a 60ft nb up the Rochdale east to west a couple of years ago (don't do it the other way with marginal length boat). There was not an inch to spare despite all fenders removed, but I managed it and single handed!

Anything less should be easy. Problem locks are top one at Salterhebble flight and Shepley bridge although that's on the Calder and Hebble.

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3 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

Salterhebble Top and Kirklees Upper and Lower are all handspike only on the top paddles. Cromwell and Park Nook as well

Yes, I was really only reporting on the section up to Cooper Bridge - it was 2011 the only time we have done the upper part. Will know soon enough as we have turned around in Huddersfield and will be heading that way on Sunday.

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3 hours ago, by'eck said:

Took a 60ft nb up the Rochdale east to west a couple of years ago (don't do it the other way with marginal length boat). There was not an inch to spare despite all fenders removed, but I managed it and single handed!

Anything less should be easy. Problem locks are top one at Salterhebble flight and Shepley bridge although that's on the Calder and Hebble.

I'm a bit confused about what you mean here.  The Rochdale locks are full length (71ft plus)

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22 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

I'm a bit confused about what you mean here.  The Rochdale locks are full length (71ft plus)

Sorry, yes I was referring to the fact that in order to reach the Rochdale, I had to first travel the Calder and Hebble, and both the locks mentioned were on that of course.

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Our latest 'experience' this morning coming down one of the Huddersfield Broad (which is the same challenge for a 60ft as C&H) came after having done three successfully and training up new crew member to help pull the bow across when empty, was to tackle one with a very,very leaky top gate paddle, on the same side as the stern was placed on the diagonal. The force of the water suddenly pushed the boat across to the other side. Of course then not on a diagonal meant that we were perilously close to the cill (we only have inches to spare anyway). 

Quickly demanded that the bottom paddle we dropped as quickly as possible (easier said than done on this canal). A couple of attempts were made to lift the gate paddle to see if whatever was stuck in it wold clear but no luck. We would need to pull the stern back against the flow.

The stern rope was not long enough to throw across and back to the boat so needed to be extended and then crew had to carry across. This then meant that I could haul the stern back to where it should have been but it took some time. We could then resume the normal procedure.

Doing these short locks is an interesting challenge! Helps us to realise what it is like for full length boats generally. Alertness at all times is an absolute essential, especially with small crew and 'helpful' youngsters on an outing. (Always like to involve onlookers as it, we hope, reduces the chances of them doping something unhelpful)

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For 60' boats, length is not the only consideration. Hull shape also matters. Some 60' boats will go. Some won't. Personally, if I was having a "go anywhere" boat built. I'd wouldn't go longer than 58' or you're in risky territory. 

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