Name The Header Tank

[Froggy]

An update to this thread. Here's our replacement header tank in situ. Once again, many thanks to Ray T for the very generous supply of this. It's nice to be able to see the water level without taking the cap off (see pic of our original in the top post), and not have to worry about the bodged Araldite repairs failing! After consultation with a marine engineer, rather than drill an additional hole for the extra pipe these were joined with a T-connector, as in the photograph. I can't imagine why this solution wasn't adopted from the start rather than drill a hole into a plastic body that was always then going to be a weak point for leakage.

Thanks to everybody who contributed to this thread with their advice and offers.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Froggy

[ditchcrawler]

7 minutes ago, Froggy said:

An update to this thread. Here's our replacement header tank in situ. Once again, many thanks to Ray T for the very generous supply of this. It's nice to be able to see the water level without taking the cap off (see pic of our original in the top post), and not have to worry about the bodged Araldite repairs failing. After consultation with a marine engineer, rather than drill an additional hole for the extra pipe these were joined with a T-connector, as in the photograph. I can't imagine why this solution wasn't adopted from the start rather than drill a hole into a plastic body that was always then going to be a weak point for leakage.

Thanks to everybody who contributed to this thread with their advice and offers.

 

You need a bit of pipe on the overflow now

[Froggy]

4 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

You need a bit of pipe on the overflow now

Agreed. I was just thinking that when i looked at the photo after posting. That should be a relatively simple affair! I'll have a root around and see if i can find some old brake hose or something. I seem to spend half my life tinkering with the boat these days!

[gbclive]

I’ve just had to replace a similar header tank for the Webasto CH system.

The lower spigot had cracked where it met the body.

I splashed out on one of these from A. H. Fabrications - reused the original cap (not supplied) after painting it.

Overflow is now connected.

The only problem I've had is trying to removing the pesky impervious plastic label - probably designed to make this impossible 

Blowtorch perhaps?

So I now have a “bling” - Mark99 will be proud of me 

[bizzard]

If there is rusty water circulating in the system the plastic header tanks and a plastic sight tubes inner surfaces will soon become stained rust coloured iand the level might not be discernable after a while.

[Froggy]

28 minutes ago, gbclive said:

I’ve just had to replace a similar header tank for the Webasto CH system.

The lower spigot had cracked where it met the body.

I splashed out on one of these from A. H. Fabrications - reused the original cap (not supplied) after painting it.

Overflow is now connected.

The only problem I've had is trying to removing the pesky impervious plastic label - probably designed to make this impossible 

Blowtorch perhaps?

So I now have a “bling” - Mark99 will be proud of me 

 

It's amazing how popular these BMC units seem to have been with boat fitters. Seeing yours makes me slightly more confident that our boat's fitters were at least bodging with some knowledge!

That label looks ok to me, but if you can remove the top layer of it and then gently scrape the layer underneath to break it down a bit, some sticky stuff remover might finish it off.

 

19 minutes ago, bizzard said:

If there is rusty water circulating in the system the plastic header tanks and a plastic sight tubes inner surfaces will soon become stained rust coloured iand the level might not be discernable after a while.

 

Well i'm going to bask in the glow of (relative) newness for the time being, Bizzard.  No doubt there is rust lurking, because when we checked for antifreeze in the middle of winter shortly after buying the boat there wasn't any!

Edited April 11, 2018 by Froggy

[gbclive]

19 minutes ago, bizzard said:

If there is rusty water circulating in the system the plastic header tanks and a plastic sight tubes inner surfaces will soon become stained rust coloured iand the level might not be discernable after a while.

Re sight tube - as always you are spot on Bizzard, but I can get replacement tube, although it’s an exotic type - not the normal stuff on eBay.

To be honest as the tube is realy quite narrow and my Screwfix antifreeze is clear, it’s not easy to see the level even before the inevitable staining. I have to shine a torch at just the right angle to pick out the meniscus. Perhaps a suitable dye would help?

So a bit of form over function has crept in, even though I tried hard to choose carefully 

I found there was not a great deal of choice of similar, non plastic tanks with sight tubes.

(I’ll probably get countless examples of better ones suggested - too late!)

[ditchcrawler]

5 minutes ago, gbclive said:

Re sight tube - as always you are spot on Bizzard, but I can get replacement tube, although it’s an exotic type - not the normal stuff on eBay.

To be honest as the tube is realy quite narrow and my Screwfix antifreeze is clear, it’s not easy to see the level even before the inevitable staining. I have to shine a torch at just the right angle to pick out the meniscus. Perhaps a suitable dye would help?

So a bit of form over function has crept in, even though I tried hard to choose carefully 

I found there was not a great deal of choice of similar, non plastic tanks with sight tubes.

(I’ll probably get countless examples of better ones suggested - too late!)

Float a plastic bead in the sight glass

[gbclive]

10 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Float a plastic bead in the sight glass

Thank you - a brilliant and simple idea  

(However my TEM (threat error management) training has kicked in - what if the coolant level was ever to get low enough that the bead was able to start circulating until it came to a critical restriction?) 

[Froggy]

57 minutes ago, gbclive said:

To be honest as the tube is realy quite narrow and my Screwfix antifreeze is clear, it’s not easy to see the level even before the inevitable staining. I have to shine a torch at just the right angle to pick out the meniscus. Perhaps a suitable dye would help?

 

Ah, a new word for the day!  

41 minutes ago, gbclive said:

Thank you - a brilliant and simple idea  

(However my TEM (threat error management) training has kicked in - what if the coolant level was ever to get low enough that the bead was able to start circulating until it came to a critical restriction?) 

Lateral thinking. Always best to look for worst case scenarios imo. Sods Law has a habit of creeping up on you when you've got your head turned the other way enjoying the tranquility of the moment!

Edited April 11, 2018 by Froggy

[gbclive]

45 minutes ago, Froggy said:

That label looks ok to me, but if you can remove the top layer of it and then gently scrape the layer underneath to break it down a bit, some sticky stuff remover might finish it off.

 

Thanks - I’ve tried but it’s incredibly resistant to my efforts so far.

I do have some of that SSR so I’ll try it if I ever manage to remove the top layer - don’t want to de-bling my only bit of bling by scratching it 

 

[ditchcrawler]

17 minutes ago, gbclive said:

Thank you - a brilliant and simple idea  

(However my TEM (threat error management) training has kicked in - what if the coolant level was ever to get low enough that the bead was able to start circulating until it came to a critical restriction?) 

OK a short brightly coloured plastic rod that wont go round the right angle bottom bend

[gbclive]

14 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

OK a short brightly coloured plastic rod that wont go round the right angle bottom bend

Or a suitably sized mesh filter in the bottom hose, but then what if that comes loose and start circulating?

Or a small magnet floating bead with a fixed magnet to limit its downward freedom - but what about ferrous sludge if there is such a thing?

[ditchcrawler]

1 minute ago, gbclive said:

Or a suitably sized mesh filter in the bottom hose, but then what if that comes loose and start circulating?

Or a small magnet floating bead with a fixed magnet to limit its downward freedom - but what about ferrous sludge if there is such a thing?

 

38 minutes ago, gbclive said:

Thank you - a brilliant and simple idea  

(However my TEM (threat error management) training has kicked in - what if the coolant level was ever to get low enough that the bead was able to start circulating until it came to a critical restriction?) 

What about the danger or not seeing the level has dropped out of the bottom off the glass because of a leak

[Froggy]

29 minutes ago, gbclive said:

Thanks - I’ve tried but it’s incredibly resistant to my efforts so far.

I do have some of that SSR so I’ll try it if I ever manage to remove the top layer - don’t want to de-bling my only bit of bling by scratching it 

 

[gbclive]

13 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

What about the danger or not seeing the level has dropped out of the bottom off the glass because of a leak

You’re right - probably the largest of the threats, so the hunt is now on for a suitably sized, high visibility floating sphere that’s resistant to dilute ethylene glycol and propylene glycol  

I’ll check the internal diameter of the sight tube later this week.

[Ray T]

Froggy, glad to see it in use.

13 minutes ago, gbclive said:

You’re right - probably the largest of the threats, so the hunt is now on for a suitably sized, high visibility floating sphere that’s resistant to dilute ethylene glycol and propylene glycol  

I’ll check the internal diameter of the sight tube later this week.

What about using the top of a cut down fishing float?

Edited April 11, 2018 by Ray T

[gbclive]

38 minutes ago, Ray T said:

What about using the top of a cut down fishing float?

Thanks Ray T, apparently they were originally made from porcupine quills; however they are now made of plastic and wood.

I’ll investigate whether they rely on air inside to float, although I’m guessing the dilute glycol should increase buoyancy compared to normal water. If I was really clever, it could also indicate SG and thus prompt if the antifreeze needed replacing or strengthening 

But then there is the increased viscosity in the narrow sight tube to concider - might have to rely on the ultra high amplitude low frequency vibrations from the Kelvin to prevent the float from sticking, so readings may only be reliable when under way 

[Pennine]

Food colouring added to the water?

[gbclive]

7 minutes ago, Pennine said:

Food colouring added to the water?

Yep - that might work Pennine, but not sure if only added to the header tank, how it would diffuse over time.

But at least the “jamming up the works” worry would be eliminated.

Hopefully no adverse chemical reaction - I’m guessing only a tiny preportion needed, so small risk?

[ditchcrawler]

14 minutes ago, Pennine said:

Food colouring added to the water?

It would probably stain the pipe

 

[Froggy]

Wouldn't it just be simpler to drain the coolant and replace with a coloured anti-freeze?!  You're not likely to need much for a diesel heater circuit.

[gbclive]

16 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

It would probably stain the pipe

 

 ........................... so back to the bead / float option then?

[ditchcrawler]

Maintenance procedure and schedule to clean sight glass, or fit a zero to 5 inch water gauge pressure gauge to the bottom tapping

[gbclive]

52 minutes ago, Froggy said:

Wouldn't it just be simpler to drain the coolant and replace with a coloured anti-freeze?!  You're not likely to need much for a diesel heater circuit.

True about the volume, but unfortunately the sight tube is quite narrow and very slightly opaque, so I suspect the colour would need to be really dense in order to make much difference visually.

If the tube was a larger diameter similar to my engine coolant header tank, then there would be no problem seeing the level. See the pic - the level is easy to see at 25% even with the tube badly stained and no colour.

(Sorry about the glass lid tins - I got a job lot of magnetic ones and then had to find somewhere to stick them )

41 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Maintenance procedure and schedule to clean sight glass, or fit a zero to 5 inch water gauge pressure gauge to the bottom tapping

At one level that really appeals  but then again, isn’t simple usually best?